Author Topic: hello. my name is Carsten. (another racist meltdown thread)  (Read 21739 times)

Offline earthw7

  • Posts: 1423
    • Standing Rock Tourism
Re: hello. my name is Carsten.
« Reply #15 on: April 04, 2013, 08:46:45 pm »
 hakita najin jordans  you hero was not a full blood he was half german
I got a report on him before he died as someone who was doing bad things in Europe
so i guess you were the bad thing.
In Spirit

Offline earthw7

  • Posts: 1423
    • Standing Rock Tourism
Re: hello. my name is Carsten.
« Reply #16 on: April 04, 2013, 08:50:54 pm »
According to our ways you can not run a sweat lodge ceremony until completeing four year of Sun Dance
and Four Years of Vision Quest and you must have permission, and most of all it must be done in Lakota
and you need to know the songs in Lakota for each door. Other wise you are just fooloing yourself
In Spirit

Offline Carsten

  • Posts: 33
Re: hello. my name is Carsten.
« Reply #17 on: April 04, 2013, 09:06:03 pm »
http://www.lakotacountrytimes.com/news/2011-05-11/The_Holy_Road/Melvin_Custer_Jordan.html
well its from a newspaper article  that obitrary came from.  exactly the same.  not sure if the news paper a legit but you can tell me that then.

and yes it has to be that person.   

the reason he did teach whites , like me sweatlodges ceremonies was in fact because he did not agree with the idea that only  NA should take part in ceremonies. 

neither did he want to keep the ceremony away from us white people , he said he was told to go back home and teach us.

he said he  was told to go home and do this.  by his elders .  someone here would be able to confirm this.

this was a reaction against the lakota declaration of war against exploiters of lakota spirituality  with the demand that no whites could take part in ceremonies.

how could he do otherwise when he is married to a white woman.  and his friends , some adopted and sundancers themselve  are danish.

and that at the time for me is reasons enough for him to do this.  I can understand that  fully. 


Offline Carsten

  • Posts: 33
Re: hello. my name is Carsten.
« Reply #18 on: April 04, 2013, 09:08:39 pm »
Are these your words........................................................ :o

I am aware of this issue. check out hakita najin jordans response to this .. I can tell you that he went home and made a one time event , paid for as a course where he did teach twelve people how to do a sweatlodge themselves.

this course was paid for by us attended. we got a little more from them than I can see how they can have made any money on and I do know what they got out of it since I know the people who made this possible. it was nothing that made them rich I can assure you.

I was the leader of the sweat we where supposed to run ourself. hakita left the lodge at round three at let me pour the fourth round while his wife where the firekeeper.

I met him later at a private ceremony where he did not bring his pipe and we used mine for that healing ceremony. so he has no problems with my pipe either.

I knew a native american close to where I live that told me that he did think that I needed to pay for a course to learn that so he told me before hand all I needed to know in hopes I would not waste money and time on this course.

however I knew before that course I had to be there and was supposed to be the leader of that sweat we should do ourself. spirit told me a year before.

after that event I gave a pipe to a Danish sundancer and told her that I was doing sweats myself in all modesty and privacy if people where interested in it and asked how she felt about this issue about non natives doing sweats and she thought it was a good thing I did.

then I know now a ceremonial roadchief that does'nt seem to have a problem with me doing sweats , in fact his wife told me it was something I should be doing by myself.

so......I have no problems with what I do. and can point out people that gave me permission by name with a native background if anyone asks me at a sweat where I got my knowledge and they can judge it all they want from this .

its not like I been on the rez and been adopted and had many years of training behind me but if anyone has problems with this then they can ask the persons I can point to for their reasons and also go speak to spirit about the matter.

I do however feel very very strongly about this issue and would love for new age to leave that alone. ceremony is not to be taken lightly but you can get away with lots of things if your honest. however being honest about these things in my book needs also a permission from spirit and a permission from a native american on some level if you plan to do sweats.

my opinion on this is that if you can find a person who will allow you to do this then all is fine. its not needed to be a person that are native but just a sundancer that made lots of sweats before and I feel this way because its dangerous and should not be played around with.

if someones spirit guides are native americans and they like to be honoured by performing some ceremonies and also that someone meets up with someone that can show how its done and knows this by hart then I see no problem with it no matter how white ones skin is.

what I do see a problem with is the people who blend tarot card readings and native american traditions they read in a book in a blend that is far from honest in anyway to seem more interesting to clients.

there is one really important issue at hand here as well...we NEED the native americans wisdom and how to learn to respect our earth more. that wisdom can come from just about every other tribal culture as well but we need to work along with each other regardless of skin colour or gender or age to start acting more responsible towards our nature and this needs to be done now.

I only take from the native americans what they give me . nothing else. however as said I also feel strongly about their culture and I see the things I got from them over the last fifteen years as a gift but also something I need to help protect if I see some new age guru pissing on it and we have some of these here as well. I might not be the right one to do this but if a situation comes where someone hands out a phone number for a paid for sweat done along with some new age stuff I will call them and ask them not to do this because its simply not the way it should be done.

I also was told to teach others about this and maybe even how to run sweats themselves but i did not find anyone yet that I would think where seriously dedicated yet so I did not do this yet. however I would never ever teach anything to someone I could imagine starting to charge for it and mix it with other things like healing and tarot card readings and crystals and new age stuff.

I am aware that some native americans do not agree with this tht I stand for and do . .....but as said they can then go speak to spirit about it if they have a problem with me and what I do. or ask some of the people with native background that showed me how to do this. I can point to two instructors and a few that just seems to not have problems with what I do. I wont namedrop here anymore than just hakita because he is the lakota ambassador of Denmark -.
however I also feel its a sensitive subject and we should respect their opinions those who feel things are not the way it should be. they after all just protecting something sacred .

looks like something I could have wrote years ago maybe.  depends on where you found it.  or if its altered in anyway,  since I only read the first two lines and think it might be me.  I can usually tell my own writing style yes. 


Offline earthw7

  • Posts: 1423
    • Standing Rock Tourism
Re: hello. my name is Carsten.
« Reply #19 on: April 04, 2013, 09:12:52 pm »
nope i just copied and pasted it from a site did not change a thing
from this site http://shamanportal.org/forum/shamanism-f1/are-our-elders-backing-away-t726.html
« Last Edit: April 04, 2013, 09:14:31 pm by earthw7 »
In Spirit

Offline Carsten

  • Posts: 33
Re: hello. my name is Carsten.
« Reply #20 on: April 04, 2013, 09:29:05 pm »
hakita najin jordans  you hero was not a full blood he was half german
I got a report on him before he died as someone who was doing bad things in Europe
so i guess you were the bad thing.

not my hero. I did like him as a person but met him couple of times ,  not enough to become a personal friend though.   
but as said before in this thread he was not popular around here for doing it either.  this was why a other native ,  instructed me for free before going to this seminar.  he did not like the idea ,  or hakita . 

well at the time I took part ,  only after years after when I got internet I found out the lakota declaration of war against exploiteres of spirituality so then it all made sense what he had said about being told to go home and teach us and open up for it for whites. 

its many many years ago all this happened.   

Offline Ingeborg

  • Friends
  • *
  • Posts: 837
  • I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
Re: hello. my name is Carsten.
« Reply #21 on: April 04, 2013, 09:35:29 pm »
yes this is me.  I was the person writing these post years ago.

Thanks for the confirmation.

But really, we've seen a lot of truths twisted by defenders of frauds and frauds, but this is getting simply ridiculous! You wrote those posts years ago?

One was written in April 2012, the other on Jan 13, 2013!
The latter was posted in a forum you only joined a week prior to that.

I don't know what you believe we think or know about Europe... Let's put it like that: we do know that this is the year 2013 in Denmark as well as in the rest of Europe and the USA.

Your evasiveness does not do you any good, plus it makes me wonder how many "years" ago you wrote the text earthw7 found  ;D .


used2bnaf

  • Guest
Re: hello. my name is Carsten.
« Reply #22 on: April 04, 2013, 09:43:14 pm »
hello.  my name is Carsten.

I can offer only to help the boards with people in Denmark , which is where I Live.   but I happened to come across the forums because a person I happen to know in person was questioned in a thread in here so it was the main reason I joined to speak up for him on his behalf , lost contact with him  myself  otherwise I could have made him aware of the thread in question.

if any one needs information about people living in Denmark.  new age gurus,.  healers and such.  I can offer to look into it from here.

also if people claims to be Native American  and have relation to here , I Might be able to find out something , since I know people with affiliations , with tribes in mostly Lakota  rez. 

it wont be much I can do but I do support the agenda of the forum ,   all I can say in general is there is  very very few legit people in the new age realm here in Denmark. 

most are frauds.  only people with approved license to practice ,  zone therapy and herbal medicine is to be considered trustworthy here.  and these are easy to find out about.  the state approved  them and know them like a doctor also is easy to check .

feel free to ask for my help.  however since I was just speaking on behalf of someone I Know then I wont be so dedicated to reading the forums ,  most takes places elsewhere in the world too so really not something I will be reading trough everyday however you can PM me if you need information  which I can access more easy from Denmark ,  know the people or can check or call people even otherwise I wont be using the forums that much.

regards, Carsten.

Having read your orginal post slowly and thoroughly, I have a few questions.

a) why do you think a lack of money changing hands justifies your behavior?

b) why do you think that because 1 half blood says it is ok for Non NDNs to facilitate ceremony, that is is gospel truth?(stated in another post)

c) why did you come here and lie? 

Just wondering....

Truly and sincerely,
used2bnewagefraud

Offline Carsten

  • Posts: 33
Re: hello. my name is Carsten.
« Reply #23 on: April 04, 2013, 09:44:17 pm »
nope i just copied and pasted it from a site did not change a thing
from this site http://shamanportal.org/forum/shamanism-f1/are-our-elders-backing-away-t726.html

yes this must be me.  I had a profile there once.   long ago ,  too.  this is are words of mine that speaks of what I reflected upon back then. 

again .  I never kept any of this a secret. 

however you might read some of the other post and maybe put two and two together and find that I am really not so keen on these things  but have my motivations  to do so.- 

I was in hell for long time.   initiations like you read about in shamanistic traditions but I can do anything with it neither find anyone that is legit that can help in any way. 

so .  it was a very very hard  time in my life.  however I am doing good now. 

I cant use these initiations or experiences for anything because we have no culture for it.   we have no teachers. 

it was personal development that was very hard and almost cost my life. 

and never even did learn or ever dared to learn to travel on the drum.   these things scare me to be honest.

core shamanism I consider very dangerous and warns about starting up on it.  however I Wish to learn from others with real tradition behind them if I can. 

this has nothing to do with sweatlodges.  neither with native americans.   just to be sure you understand the reason I was using the site in the first place.


Offline Ingeborg

  • Friends
  • *
  • Posts: 837
  • I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
Re: hello. my name is Carsten.
« Reply #24 on: April 04, 2013, 10:01:14 pm »
yes this must be me.  I had a profile there once.   long ago ,  too.  this is are words of mine that speaks of what I reflected upon back then.

Date of post:

Quote
Posted: Tue Jun 05, 2012 6:09 pm

Kaere Carsten, you're an effing liar. So please stop telling us all this B.S., willya.


Offline Carsten

  • Posts: 33
Re: hello. my name is Carsten.
« Reply #25 on: April 04, 2013, 10:33:35 pm »
hello.  my name is Carsten.

I can offer only to help the boards with people in Denmark , which is where I Live.   but I happened to come across the forums because a person I happen to know in person was questioned in a thread in here so it was the main reason I joined to speak up for him on his behalf , lost contact with him  myself  otherwise I could have made him aware of the thread in question.

if any one needs information about people living in Denmark.  new age gurus,.  healers and such.  I can offer to look into it from here.

also if people claims to be Native American  and have relation to here , I Might be able to find out something , since I know people with affiliations , with tribes in mostly Lakota  rez. 

it wont be much I can do but I do support the agenda of the forum ,   all I can say in general is there is  very very few legit people in the new age realm here in Denmark. 

most are frauds.  only people with approved license to practice ,  zone therapy and herbal medicine is to be considered trustworthy here.  and these are easy to find out about.  the state approved  them and know them like a doctor also is easy to check .

feel free to ask for my help.  however since I was just speaking on behalf of someone I Know then I wont be so dedicated to reading the forums ,  most takes places elsewhere in the world too so really not something I will be reading trough everyday however you can PM me if you need information  which I can access more easy from Denmark ,  know the people or can check or call people even otherwise I wont be using the forums that much.

regards, Carsten.

Having read your orginal post slowly and thoroughly, I have a few questions.

a) why do you think a lack of money changing hands justifies your behavior?

b) why do you think that because 1 half blood says it is ok for Non NDNs to facilitate ceremony, that is is gospel truth?(stated in another post)

c) why did you come here and lie? 

Just wondering....

Truly and sincerely,
used2bnewagefraud

I never lied to you. 

please do not accuse me of being a liar.  which I am not.   I tell you completely honest about things in my past . 

you can find lots of things on the net I wrote in the past.  and I stand by these things as parts of my past as well.  relate differently to some of the things as I grown older but but never denied any of that.

but why is that so important to you in the first place what I  done with my life and wrote on the net sometime long ago ?

what do you want to know about me ?

I have no problems with answering this.   I can even be found  if you look hard enough on forums because I use my real name as screen name. 


Offline Defend the Sacred

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 3400
Re: Re: Declaration of War Against Exploiters of Lakota Spirituality
« Reply #26 on: April 04, 2013, 10:46:57 pm »
Carsten, you know nothing. You are propagating racist stereotypes and insulting respected members of the communities you would try to steal from. Stop it. We will not put up with ignorant people spewing racist bs here.

Offline Defend the Sacred

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 3400
Re: hello. my name is Carsten.
« Reply #27 on: April 04, 2013, 11:16:30 pm »

I found this after the seminar.  I was told that he was instructed by elders to teach this and it was supposed to be in one semiar ,  it did not make profit  but however cost was covered.

You can't learn these ways in seminars. You are divorced and alienated from the cultural context, the relatives and spirits that give the ceremonies meaning and power. You are fooling yourself. If your health improved, it was the placebo effect. By attempting fake ceremonies from anther continent and culture you have no legitimate ties to you are offending the spirits where you are. The spirits from here probably haven't even noticed you. Pray they do not.

Quote
I Am not taking more than someone from your culture gave me. 

You were defrauded. You were not taught real ceremonies. Now you perpetuate the fraud.

Quote
however please , consider asking spirit ,  why did they lead me down the path I was .

"Spirit" led you no where. Humans have free will. You used yours to be a culture vulture.

Quote
  I do want to warn others about new age in particular.

You're either lying or a hypocrite because what you are doing is not Lakota, it is new age fraud.

Quote
I can not ,  and repeat not  claim in anyway that I was given any special insight in native american culture or anything but in fragments from various people I met that are maybe some of them genuine and maybe some of them not.

If you realize this you should also realize you have no rights to ceremony. Understanding and belonging to culture comes first. Attempts at ceremonies are meaningless without that foundation.

Quote
I NEVER claim to be a medicine person. I Never claim to have had anything other than the few instructions I had  in the sweatlodge  by two persons. 

By leading sweats and talking about it on the Internet, you are making that claim. At least you admit you have no idea what you're doing, so if anyone trusts you they are a fool.

Quote
and know deep inside that I never ever insulted spirit by  trying to heal myself neither did I ever exploit your sacred ceremony. 

It's not your place to decide if what you did was exploitative. You've now been told by people who are actually from these cultures that what you have done is exploitative, and you refuse to hear it. That is racist and arrogant.

You say over and over how this is justified because you wanted healing. That does not justify it. No one person's desire for self-improvement is more valuable than an entire culture and the integrity of that culture. By messing with this and insulting the very people entrusted with these ways you have done harm, and it will do you more harm in the long run. If you had the slightest idea of the people you have insulted at this point, you would be horrified. But you are too arrogant and racist to see it. You only care about yourself. You know nothing.
« Last Edit: April 04, 2013, 11:20:21 pm by Kathryn »

Offline Defend the Sacred

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 3400
Re: hello. my name is Carsten.
« Reply #28 on: April 04, 2013, 11:18:36 pm »
what do you want to know about me ?

Nothing. You've already told us more than we need to know.

Offline Carsten

  • Posts: 33
Re: hello. my name is Carsten.
« Reply #29 on: April 04, 2013, 11:23:27 pm »
yes this must be me.  I had a profile there once.   long ago ,  too.  this is are words of mine that speaks of what I reflected upon back then.

Date of post:

Quote
Posted: Tue Jun 05, 2012 6:09 pm

Kaere Carsten, you're an effing liar. So please stop telling us all this B.S., willya.

du forstår  åbenbart dansk .  så prøv lige at slappe af og hør her . 

helt ærligt.  slap af.  jeg er ikke her for at gøre skade på jer.  i virker dælme paranoide men jeg gider heller ikke sidde her og forsvare mig mod anklager om noget jeg ikke engang aner hvad i mener med. 

jeg har aldrig løjet over for nogen som helst.   hvad vil i vide ?

vil du have mit telefon nummer og PM og snakke med mig , på dansk om de her ting.   

jeg er ikke så god til at skrive på engelsk.  men vil meget gerne have lov at forsvare mig selv nu da jeg bliver genstand for beskyldinger ,  om at lyve.

hvad mener du egentligt  har jeg løjet om ?.  det bryder jeg mig nemlig ikke om folk bare slynger ud da jeg er som regel en af de mere ærlige dansker du kommer til møde i din livstid hvis du er herfra landet. 

hvis ikke i behandler mig ordentlgit herinde så gider jeg da slet ikke spilde min tid på jer .   så må i have det godt og så  blive ved med hvad end i laver herinde .

  jeg kom her kun for at finde ud af noget om en jeg tilfældigvis kender og jeg kan heller ikke stole på de ting i siger er sandt heller. 

nu gider jeg ikke de her ting mere.  prøv at høre her .  det er så simplet.   i kan måske ikke lide mig.   men jeg er da fuldkommen ligeglad om i kan det for    jeg har ikke brug for jeres accept eller forum.   

jeg har slet intet udaf at  fortælle jer noget som helst  om mig personligt  og slet ikke hvis i bare bruger tiden på at prøve at svine mig til eller er paranoide over et eller andet. 

gå efter boldend i det mindste.  ikke manden.

klart nok ?

@rest of you not speaking danish ·

remember one thing.   never insult people who try to be nice and help you. 

you just did.   
?
what in the world makes you think I would be interested in either coming here with intent of harming you or stick around taking your abuse ?