Author Topic: "John Heyoka"  (Read 2928 times)

Offline MsWilma

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"John Heyoka"
« on: January 27, 2013, 06:58:18 AM »
Hi from Australia, meet Heyoka:

http://www.oranum.com/psychics/HEYOKA/chat

only $1.99 Aus per minute!
« Last Edit: January 27, 2013, 03:16:29 PM by educatedindian »

Offline educatedindian

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Re: "John Heyoka"
« Reply #1 on: January 27, 2013, 03:15:55 PM »
A bald fat white man dressed in an imitation of who knows what tribe claiming to be psychic. Seems to be doing the oldest con game around, cold readings.

Did anyone else look at him and think "Larry Bud Melman is still alive!"

Seems to be either a Deer Tribe member or have studied under them. He's 51, named John, and sometimes wears a silly/insulting dreadlock wig. Yeah, I'd go to him for advice. ::)
http://community.oranum.com/en/psychic/643

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http://www.psychic-consult.com/heyoka/
In 1254 BC in Oaxca, Mexico, the White Rattlesnake school was formed by the descendants of Mu, Lemuria, Atlantis, and Miehyen, these were men and woman of knowledge, medicine men and woman, shamans and sorcerers. In 1254 AD, a mystery school emerged from the Rattlesnake School and took on its present name of
 the Twisted Hair Metis Medicine Society Counsel of Elders. This counsel of elders has over the life times collected,
 and tested to the full measure, an encyclopedia of knowledge that has been passed on from a lineage of healers,
 
The right and proper use of crystals, from the Olmec, Toltec, and the Cherokee. Methods of singing came from singers and shakers of the Dine (Navajo) peoples. Sand and body painting from the Hopi, Zuni, Yaqui, and Navajo.
 The teachings on the Karma Pipe came from the Cheyenne and Crow. The Energy Pipe Teaching from the Sioux, these were blended into a whole new paradigm, by the Naqual Julian and Stella Many Names assisted by Ruby Morning Star.
 
This is most emphatically not what is practiced by traditional native American tribal medicine men or woman....
 
Like many wounded healers I became quite ill, to the point of death, even at one point leaving my body and looking down upon myself, knowing intuitively that I had but a moment to make decision or I could not return to this lifetime, at that time I had a wife and two small children, and the thought of leaving them pained me greatly. I broke free of my trance and willed myself back into my body, at which time I felt hands pull me back down into the bed, and even through to the ground below. Things were never the same from then on in....
 
Sincerely John 11HEYOKA11

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http://www.esotericslive.com/psycics-esoterics-live-expert.php?psycic=HEYOKA&&exp=10-15&&BIO=In%201254%20BC%20in%20Oaxca,%20Mexico,the%20White%20Rattlesnake%20schoolwas%20formed%20by%20the%20descendentsof%20Mu,%20Lemuria,%20Atlantis,%20andMiehyen,%20these%20were%20men%20andwoman%20of%20knowledge,%20medicinemen%20and%20woman,%20shamans%20andsorcerers.%20%20In%201254%20AD,%20amystery%20school%20emerged%20fromthe%20Rattlesnake%20School%20andtook%20on%20its%20present%20name%20of&&TAGS=mayan%20astrology,tarotreading,rune%20cardreading,pendulum,runedivination,dreaminterpretation,clairvoyance,crystal%20healing,home%20andfamily,career%20andbusiness,finance%20andlaw,travelling%20andrelocation,mind%20andbody,rituals%20and%20energies&&LANGUAGES=en&&M=1&&PRICE=099&&NP=26
My name is HEYOKA and I have 25-30 years of experience within the field of esoterics.

IN 1254 BC in Oaxca, Mexico,the White Rattlesnake schoolwas formed by the descendentsof Mu, Lemuria, Atlantis, andMiehyen, these were men andwoman of knowledge, medicinemen and woman, shamans andsorcerers.
In 1254 AD, amystery school emerged fromthe Rattlesnake School andtook on its present name of

I am a specialized Psychic with experience concerning mayan astrology, tarotreading, rune cardreading, pendulum, runedivination, dreaminterpretation, clairvoyance, crystal healing, home andfamily, career andbusiness, finance andlaw, travelling andrelocation, mind andbody, rituals and energies

I speak  and for the past 30 days I have been conducting several consultations for more than 26 people in need of my advice.

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ETA- "Stella Many Names"is only mentioned on Deer Tribe cult sites.
The only mention I could find of "Ruby Morning Star" is on a Rainbow Tribe site. Apparently she's as poor a psychic predictor as old John.
Another site claims she was a supposed teacher of Lynn Andrews.

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http://www.welcomehome.org/rainbow/info/bibliography.txt
Ruby Morning Star was the head seer of the Crystal Skull Society.  She said
that in 1985 you will see a total change in the concept of what we call the
United Nations.  Instead of political opposition and struggle it will change
names and become the new circle of law - the Eight Great Powers.

Offline Piff

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Re: "John Heyoka"
« Reply #2 on: January 27, 2013, 11:30:52 PM »
Oranum has a facebook page https://www.facebook.com/Oranum.Global . May 18, 2012 entry has video clip of John announcing who won:

Quote
Both winners will receive a personalised, FREE E-mail Reading from Oranum's newborn star HEYOKA, with minimum 2000 characters for 1 specific question; or 4000 characters for a general horoscope reading.

On video he introduces himself as "Heyoka ... a shaman on the sweet medicine sundance path"

The Oranum page admin is listed as Gattyán György from Budapest, Hungary. He also runs 11 other facebook pages, his website listed is http://www.doclerholding.com/en/main/

Same photos on the facebook account as the György Gattyán who is in the movie biz: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm4831648/

As for John, hope we can bring his real name to light.






Offline MsWilma

  • Posts: 30
Re: "John Heyoka"
« Reply #3 on: January 28, 2013, 12:41:39 AM »
I had an intuition that this profile would end up in frauds..must be psychic  :P

'Oranum' was advertised on my fb page so from curiousity I went over & checked it out.
On a first glance the majority of the readers were advertising tarot, mediumship, etc etc.... 'Heyoka' was the only pretendian & he stood out
 ( there certainly may be more, but he's getting the highest profile at the moment)

When I first found the Oranum site, I was able to click on 'Heyoka's link and listen to him in 'free chat'- a forum designed for the readers to talk with potential clients.
He was giving out his version of general world truths: 'Your answer lies within you, the world is a dance and you need to learn the choreography'  etc etc.
He was holding something (maybe a crystal?) and he would occasionally close his eyes and the crystal would give him confirmation that the person he was talking to (via text chat) needed to pay him for a private consultation because he had a special message for them.
He seemed to have quite a few people typing questions for him at once.
I was able to type a question without joining so I asked 'Hi Heyoka, are  you Lakota?..You mention them in your bio' He didnt answer the question and his chat function shut down for guests (If I was a member maybe I could still talk to him...) I checked today and he still doesnt seem to have the free chat function enabled but Im sure he will again as he was working hard to fish for clients when I found him, so maybe others would like to pay him a visit?
If you google 'Oranum' and 'complaints on the web you'll find there are many, including psychics who say Oranum threw them off the site after complaints from clients... they are a serious business and they do seem to take their business seriously. If they received lots of complaints from indigenous americans and their supporters it might be bad for business, who knows (I'm not a business person..)

Here's the Heyoka profile as it appears on my computer:

The Heyók?a symbolize and portray many aspects of the sacred, the Wak?á?. Their satire presents important questions by fooling around. They ask difficult questions, and say things others are too afraid to say. By reading between the lines, the audience is able to think about things not usually thought about, or to look at things in a different way.

Principally, the Heyók?a functions both as a mirror and a teacher, using extreme behaviors to mirror others, thereby forcing them to examine their own doubts, fears, hatreds, and weaknesses. Heyók?as also have the power to heal emotional pain; such power comes from the experience of shame—they sing of shameful events in their lives, beg for food, and live as clowns. They provoke laughter in distressing situations of despair and provoke fear and chaos when people feel complacent and overly secure, to keep them from taking themselves too seriously or believing they are more powerful than they are.

In addition, sacred clowns serve an important role in shaping tribal codes. Heyók?a's don’t seem to care about taboos, rules, regulations, social norms, or boundaries. Paradoxically, however, it is by violating these norms and taboos that they help to define the accepted boundaries, rules, and societal guidelines for ethical and moral behavior. This is because they are the only ones who can ask "Why?" about sensitive topics and employ satire to question the specialists and carriers of sacred knowledge or those in positions of power and authority. In doing so, they demonstrate concretely the theories of balance and imbalance. Their role is to penetrate deception, turn over rocks, and create a deeper awareness.[citation needed]

For people who are as poor as us, who have lost everything, who had to endure so much death and sadness, laughter is a precious gift. When we were dying like flies from white man's disease, when we were driven into reservations, when the government rations did not arrive and we were starving, watching the pranks and capers of Heyók?a were a blessing.
—John Fire Lame Deer, Seeker of Visions, p250

Wi?háša Wak?á? means Holy man, not "Medicine man" or "shaman" (a term of Siberian origin). This is an important distinction. A Lakota medicine man is called p?ežúta wi?háša.
What follows is a reading I did for myself, I find I have difficulty describing who and what I can do for others here at Oranum. So I did a reading for myself asking my guide to channel a message regarding what would be useful information for those who come to seek my help.

.
Anything involving the world of lovers.
Social sanctions and rejections.
Physical assets and liabilities.
Financial welfare.
Payment of taxes.
Planning of a life with another human being.
Insurance and wills.
Where and how to live.

Offline Piff

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Re: "John Heyoka"
« Reply #4 on: January 28, 2013, 02:38:15 AM »
Many complaints on Oranum out there. Some choice bits of info:

Quote
...this subcompany (Oranum) of the parent company (Lalib, who operates many, many companies) should be avoided.

Quote
Thats why you see so many people work there for two weeks, and then vanish. I am sure they never get paid either. They need to be investigated, and shut down for fraud. Its no mistake they are located in Russian and hire 95% of their employees from the US. They are avoiding charges due to international boundaries.

--------

From a Lalib press release:

Quote
Connect with live psychics on the go from anywhere with Oranum for iOS
By Press Releases on Apr 18, 2011 at 2:30 am

Funchal, Portugal – Lalib Lda., an innovative esoteric wisdom solutions provider, has today announced the release of Oranum for the iPhone, iPad, and iPod touch. 

Quote
With a mission to help people, Oranum is the first globally reaching esoteric community available in the mobile arena. This app has the power to connect users with the worl

Quote
They accomplished exactly this, so when you’re confused and in need of some advice, Oranum will be here to help you find the inner strength and wisdom you need.

http://appmodo.com/49428/connect-with-live-psychics-on-the-go-from-anywhere-with-oranum-for-ios/

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Lalib http://lalibco.com/index.php?id=4

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Another John sighting http://www.livemystics.com/psychics/HEYOKA
« Last Edit: January 28, 2013, 02:52:18 AM by Epiphany »

Offline John Heyoka

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Re: "John Heyoka"
« Reply #5 on: February 11, 2013, 04:10:46 AM »
Dear Educated Indian:  I am the bald, fat, white guy, who for Halloween put on some dreadlocks in order to not take myself to seriously, it appears I have given offense, by calling myself  Heyoka, I am not here in order to defend against the charges of being bald, fat or white, as there is ample evidence to convict me on this.  So to those assertions I will plead no contest.  I can also see how on the surface it would be the path of least resistance to label me as a fraud, but I was wondering if you might wish to test your assertions regarding my "supposed, alleged" psychic capacities?  I am actually a bit nervous in opening myself up to this as I know that sometimes people are more interested in believing themselves to be right than test a theory in order to gather empirical data.  I am making myself open to discuss anything you wish to about me, who I am, what I believe, where I am going.  I believe you to be a person who values authenticity and integrity, I like to believe I do to.  My reason for doing this is that I  may have out of ignorance be wrong, and if I am I will stop using the name Heyoka if I find your perceptions regarding me to be accurate and true.  At he very least you will discover I am not by nature a con artist, just uneducated, and I am genuinely interested in changing and improving if I have made an error in judgement in this matter, at what ever level it has taken place.  I would hope that if you conclude that my abilities are genuine and helpful that you will print that to go with your previous observations regarding me.  John

Offline milehighsalute

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Re: "John Heyoka"
« Reply #6 on: February 11, 2013, 04:20:41 PM »
wow......giving the benefit of the doubt that you are sincere.....that is way more than i expected..............everyone who comes to "defend" themselves usually come to assert themselves with more and more lies about background and who gave them the rights.............none have been willing to correct themselves (unless backed into a corner) and none ever asked an indian for advice on what they can do to change direction.......i dont know much about psychic capabilities.....not my dept but i DO know a little somethin about my people...........and i do know my friends from up north, the lakota take alot of offense to non-indians......even non-lakota either claiming to be a heyoka or even using the name which may be interpreted as them being a heyoka......as heyokas are very special beings and something someone has had to be their whole life and appointed by a prominent holy-man..............as an indian (a non-lakota indian) i do appreciate your willingness to disasocciate yourself from the word and any references to american indian as far as any of your practices go.......good luck

Offline educatedindian

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Re: "John Heyoka"
« Reply #7 on: February 11, 2013, 05:23:43 PM »
John, first of all, what's your actual name? What made you think it was OK to call yourself a sacred name from another tradition?

Like Ms Wilma, I strongly urge you to drop the name entirely. I also strongly urge you to quit making claims about Native traditions to make your counseling or alleged abilities seem legit.

It is a brave admission to admit your ignorance and be willing to change. Could you tell us about your involvement with the Deer Tribe? I strongly urge you to read the threads in here about this dangerous cult. You seem to have spent many years learning falsehoods from them.

As for your abilities, real or not, if you want to test them, go to James Randi. I'd accept any results from him.

Offline John Heyoka

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Re: "John Heyoka"
« Reply #8 on: February 14, 2013, 11:27:21 AM »
Hi:  I sent a lengthy post in response to you post and do not see it here, so either it got lost or got deleted.  I look around and notice no one is particularly interested in me, given the number of responses.  I do not believe myself to be a fraud, however I can see your point,  I will give it thought, and if I can think of a name, other than Heyoka, that I like as much I will change it, trouble is I can't at the moment.  I wont be coming back here anymore, it grieves me that I made your fraud list, and it is important for you to know that I found your personal attacks against me to be unforgivable, if you wish to chat further to me come find me at Oranum, and apologize for your slander and liable.  Then I might listen to something you have to say about what words I am allowed to use and what I am not.  The other thing I would mention is I am not a fraud in respect to what I am capable of, it is sometimes a very complex blend of things I don't always understand, nor can I always control.  At the risk of sounding self important, everything in life contains a lesson, I have learned from you, and I suspect in the fullness of time you will learn from me.  I would urge you to swallow your pride on this one and retract that which you have said regarding me...that part of me that is my "knack" is not mine to command, it is however buzzing like very pissed off rattler.  If you have someone you trust who does have the gift, a medicine person, with site, ask him if what follows is true about me. "A person who is a very dangerous enemy, but no one can understand why or how harm comes to the persons enemies.  This one may be disposed to the practice of occult malificia for vengeance,when seeking justice".  Then ask your person to what degree and what percentage the rattle snake is part of my shield.  I say this because I am not wishing any blow fall upon me because you chose to speak foolish and thoughtless things...so with all the earnestness at my command I entreat you to check with someone you do trust, regarding what I have just said.  It may be that you have educated yourself to a degree that you do not believe this is a real possibility, that unfortunately will not make it so.  Now my hands are clean, also ask yourself how did I know to find this, probably just luck I suppose.  I don't mind that your pissed I used your sacred word, I am giving this deep consideration, as you have a point, if you wish to post that this offends you, I will not begrudge you that.

Offline educatedindian

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Re: "John Heyoka"
« Reply #9 on: February 14, 2013, 12:42:17 PM »
Why are you reluctant to say your actual name? Why are you reluctant to talk about your time and/or training in the Deer Tribe cult?

There was no "liable" of you. Libel means falsehoods, not criticism.

If you change your name and quit falsely claiming to be a Native medicine person or teaching about such ways, then we'd consider removing you from the Frauds list.

The rest of your post appears to be a very silly attempt to intimidate. But really, claims that you have a demon that you can't control that is out to get me is not exactly scary. All I have to do is picture you in your fake dreadlocks and I can't take the threat seriously.

Oh no! Larry Bud Melman is going to send a demon after me! ::)

"Occult malefica"? Isn't that medieval Christian occult claims? Means nothing to me.

If you were truly the mystical person or shaman you claim to be, you wouldn't need to go online to make money on a "psychic" hotline with consumer complaints against it.

I suggest you seek professional counseling to cope with matters that, by your own admission, you don't understand.

Offline Piff

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Re: "John Heyoka"
« Reply #10 on: February 14, 2013, 04:09:40 PM »
From John: "A person who is a very dangerous enemy, but no one can understand why or how harm comes to the persons enemies.  This one may be disposed to the practice of occult malificia for vengeance,when seeking justice".

From Tarot Divination by Bill Heidrick: "A person who is a very dangerous enemy, but no one can understand why or how harm comes to the person's enemies. One who may be disposed to the practice of occult malificia for vengeance."

Bill Heidrick's themes on his site are Crowley and Thelema. http://www.thelema101.com/ I'm not saying that John and Bill are the same person, Bill Heidrick was born in early 1940s, but John is using a direct quote from Heidrick.

« Last Edit: February 14, 2013, 04:22:14 PM by Epiphany »

Re: "John Heyoka"
« Reply #11 on: February 14, 2013, 04:25:47 PM »
Another person who's world is centered solely around their own self. Not caring about anyone or anything outside of their own mind and imaginings.

" if I can think of a name, other than Heyoka, that I like as much I will change it, trouble is I can't at the moment."

You aren't the only person alive here! Why can't people just bow respect and back away from that which isn't theirs for the taking. And why would *anyone* trust *anyone* who doesn't? I wouldn't trust this guy for anything..  such a lack of respect and care for others. That's why he's on Oranum taking advantage of people.

Are Native peoples supposed to feel gratified that your grand self has taken on serious consideration of your false claim to a name that you have stolen because you like it?  Your hands are not clean, they are full of thievery.


press the little black on silver arrow Music, 1) Bob Pietkivitch Buddha Feet http://www.4shared.com/file/114179563/3697e436/BuddhaFeet.html

Re: "John Heyoka"
« Reply #12 on: February 14, 2013, 04:34:14 PM »
he probably pulled a couple tarot cards because he's "psychic" and needs to use cards for divination because he's "psychic"..  i personally can't stand people who claim to be psychic and then use tarot cards.. LOL what a freaking joke.

From John: "A person who is a very dangerous enemy, but no one can understand why or how harm comes to the persons enemies.  This one may be disposed to the practice of occult malificia for vengeance,when seeking justice".

From Tarot Divination by Bill Heidrick: "A person who is a very dangerous enemy, but no one can understand why or how harm comes to the person's enemies. One who may be disposed to the practice of occult malificia for vengeance."

Bill Heidrick's themes on his site are Crowley and Thelema. http://www.thelema101.com/ I'm not saying that John and Bill are the same person, Bill Heidrick was born in early 1940s, but John is using a direct quote from Heidrick.


press the little black on silver arrow Music, 1) Bob Pietkivitch Buddha Feet http://www.4shared.com/file/114179563/3697e436/BuddhaFeet.html

Offline Piff

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Re: "John Heyoka"
« Reply #13 on: February 14, 2013, 05:43:17 PM »
John: "with all the earnestness at my command I entreat you"

AA: "With all the earnestness at our command, we beg of you" http://www.serenityclub.info/cgi-bin/big_book/smart_search.cgi?command=show_chapter&chapter=chapter_5.html

 ;)


Offline MsWilma

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Re: "John Heyoka"
« Reply #14 on: February 14, 2013, 10:37:55 PM »
Hi John (if you come back)

I thought your first post on this thread rocked. Saying you didnt understand but were willing to learn- good for you :)

Your second post is just your anger.
 I worked for some years in welfare organisations, assisting people escaping domestic violence. If I had a dollar for every time I've heard someone (mainly men, but women as well) say they're not in control of what happens when they're angry I would be very wealthy. If you are truly afraid that you can energetically hurt people and you think its ok to threaten people here, then as educated indian says counselling and some anger management education would be great for you.

There are many many people who feel that their anger is uncontrollable. This isnt mystical and doesnt deserve to be endowed with some kind of mystique. And it can be owned and then controlled. But you may have some new things to learn. So go with your first impulse! Go find out more!

Edited to say: I'm also wondering if you're confused because your connection to the Deer Metis Medicine/ Twisted Hairs Society is being challenged? If you had no idea that calling yourself Heyoka was offensive to indigenous people, you may not have heard much criticism of the Twisted Hairs stuff. They are certainly spreading the word here in Australia, and there are plenty of non indigenous people going along to their workshops in good faith believing that they are receiving genuine teachings.  Have a look around this website for more info on the Deer Metis Medicine Society (They're not Metis, for a start). That might give you a picture of why your published association with them is being questioned.

btw, you've had plenty of responses to your posts here. Dont stress out- people are talking with you, but they are offended because you've appropriated some sacred concepts. Start there, I feel.

ps: for South Park fans out there, I've attached a link to Cartman and the psychics battling it out...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=22Tj_l4PcPs


« Last Edit: February 14, 2013, 11:15:40 PM by MsWilma »