NAFPS Forum

Received this account of SHUK. The group referred to is at https://www.spirithorse.co.uk/
Bolding is mine.

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I'm writing to give you feedback on a recent experience at a place called Spirit Horse...

Although they have a sweat lodge that wasn't available at the time I figured this may be a good idea to share with you.

If it's not appropriate, then please direct me to some other body that oversees such activities.

This is the feedback I sent:

Dear Shivram,

Firstly I'd like to share my feedback in writing with you so you have a copy of for reference.

I've been thinking long and hard about what to say to you. I don't want this to be sent or received in the heat of hurt anger and upset, but I need to communicate with you in honesty about my experience on the retreat. 

If I pay to go on retreat I have certain expectations that I would hope be met.

Firstly that I would be respected and not have to tolerate others 'wanting to see tits' as Anthony mentioned within about 5 mins of our car journey. If that is the energy Spirit Horse attracts then this needs to be made clearer on the website.

I also don't expect to be propositioned with 'can you give us ideas for 100k and make 30%'. I felt pressured and confused that this should be presented as part of my role in attending the retreat.

The use of LSD without me knowing this was happening is a major safety consideration. I wasn't consulted and as it was winter with small numbers and not many other places to hang out, this felt not ok on any level.

I really didn't come on retreat to have your intimate relationship quite so in my face. A respect for others clearly went by the by.

When I tried to tackle you about an apology I was shut down with 'that was last night'. Hardly an open discussion where each takes responsibility for their part in the proceedings.

I got the message loud and clear that if I didn't do things your way, then what was I even doing there? I shouldn't be reading a book I brought - only the text you provide. One minute I'm encouraged to go out in nature in silence, the next I'm 'escaping' being with you all by climbing the mountain.

Finally, you had zero idea I was even coming. This was not a good opening impression but I was willing to go with that. We had to wake you up on the last day to say goodbye ...

In all honesty - across all of these varied experiences - I was left feeling unvalued, un-respected and violated. I am greatly concerned that that much damage could be done without you even realising, particularly to those who are more impressionable and perhaps vulnerable.

Perhaps with more people and Erika to balance out the energy things would be different. Sadly this wasn't the case.

I really feel very strongly that many things about the retreat were chaotic and unprofessional. I appreciate this is your valley and your rules reign, however this needs to be made clear in the information on your website.

I would appreciate an apology, and I would be grateful for a full refund. My payment otherwise condones behaviour that felt so at odds with my own personal and spiritual practice and development.

Separately from this I paid £500 pounds for this retreat, £80 in deposit and £420 to you in cash.

You now say the cost was £400, and on your website it says £300.

I suggest an apology that is still outstanding and a refund of the £100.

I appreciate loosing the deposit to cover costs.

I hope you are able to reply as this is sent, with an open heart standing in love

Lucia

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Yes they really say these things about themselves. Egos the size of mountains.

https://www.spirithorse.co.uk/who-is-spirit-horse
Shivam O'Brien
Founder Community Chieftain & Workshop Leader
Storyteller, carpenter, ritual poet, ceremonialist, Enlightenment Intensive master, tribal leader, writer, pilgrim and lover of the woods and the wild.
Shivam exemplifies the Celtic tradition, and brings a reverence for indigenous and spiritual traditions from anywhere that might loan us enough time honoured wisdom  to become real people again....
Shivam has worked with men and women and children in community and retreat for over twenty five years. He brings together wisdom gleaned from shamanic rooted culture and Indian and Buddhist sources....

Erika Brilliana
Co-founder & Women's Circle Holder, Feminine Presence of Spirit Horse

Thanks to Erika's bountiful nurturance, the generous guidance of wise wild feminine belly, and the effortless power of her medicine woman way's, the original vision was able to take root. Holding the feminine presence in the valley, the birth of the village could have not happened without her. Today, Erika is a driving force behind the scenes, and is courageously and gracefully returning this year to her ceremonial seat for Sacred Man Sacred Woman....

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Full Price: $320

Includes accommodation, all meals, and one private healing session with Kurikindi.
Kurikindi will give teachings, private healing sessions and medicine healing.

Kurikindi is a shaman from the Kichwa people who live deep in the Amazonian rainforest in Ecuador. He was born into a traditional shamanic family drawing on many generations of wisdom and knowledge. He has travelled extensively in South America to gain deeper understanding from other indigenous traditions....

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This pilgrimage prayerfully and wildly ventures into the soul memory. It is for understanding the bones of living culture beyond the poverty of the White Man's world....

You will encounter, the smell and feel of an ancestral dreamtime, the storied, sophisticated, courteous, ritualistic world that is the bedrock of all pagan, earth loving culture.

On an Enlightenment Intensive, you will face your illusions about yourself and in so raw and real a fashion as to awaken a bliss beyond the body mind identification....
If you undertake this initiation to completion you will never be the same again. As it says in the Mahabharata: (also part of the course) "if you listen to my story; you'll be somebody else at the end."

you'll go deeply into:
Ancient Traditions of Story.
Natural Culture: its roots and bones and blessing.
Breath: how to move beyond thought/control into feeling/knowing/being
Ritual: on a level you won't find anywhere else in the White Man's world.
Speech: which gives life to the earth, the people and the spirit.
Self enquiry/Self realisation: (how far you go is up to you)
Pilgrimage: the re-enchantment of the land - and happy wandering!
Celtic mystery: and a good few other old traditions too.
An exploration, celebration and even consecration of your sexual spiritual self.
Vigil and vision quest/night of power....

This course is also an initiation and introduction into the tribal world of Spirit Horse....

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By my count, that makes this group a mangling of Native, Hindu, "Celtic", Tantric, and Nuage. Amusing they keep saying White Man as though they are not themselves.

Shivam O'Brien is one of about 80 or so people in The Time of the Sixth Sun movie and related video series.

Sixth Sun discussion http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=5360.msg46320#msg46320

He comes across incredibly creepy. I've been watching several hours of this series over the course of several days, so many frauds, yet even within that context, he stands out as extra "wrong". I would not want him anywhere near me.

We live nearby. It's a great pity that they are creating a mess in a richly wooded Welsh valley by  building large, inappropriate and grandiose structures:-

https://www.crowdfunder.co.uk/spirithorseroundhouseproject#start

Incidentally, Kurikindi, the 'Ecuadorian Shaman' lives in London and charges high sums for courses:-

http://www.londonersathome.org/shaman.html

https://www.findhorn.org/programmes/walking-amazonian-shamanic-path/

Erika Indra aka White Buffalo Woman (!) is originally from Hungary.

These fantasists are right out of touch with reality and draw in others to pay for their dreams.

"Surrender Tantra" https://www.surrendertantra.com/shivam Shivam O'Brien and Miriam Annabelle Moncur

QuoteWe teach sacred sexuality, sharing our knowledge and experiential insight. Covering but not limited to;

- Awakening to the energy body

- The poetic history of the world, relating to sex and sexuality

- Energetic and physical boundaries

- Understanding openness

- Radical honesty in body and speech

- Full body orgasm

- Breathwork

- Orgasmic breathwork

- Hands on partnered work

- Prayer

- Prayer through dance

- Re-envisioning ancient cultural practice

- Yoni worship

- Lingam workship

- Discovery of the Priestess and Her role

https://www.surrendertantra.com/about

Event notices on the surrendertantra.com site lead to spirithorse.co.uk for details.

Long story short, the "Enlightenment Intensives" that Shivam O'Brien sells are dangerous.

QuoteShivam O'Brien follows the same techniques and format which were developed by Charles Berner in the 1960s. The Enlightenment Intensive provides a supportive framework within which participants are able to put all other concerns aside and focus deeply on their contemplation.

QuoteShivam O'Brien has over 20 years experience in leading Enlightenment Intensives and has helped hundreds of people to discover themselves and embrace life with their own unique energy and style. Shivam is one of the most experienced masters of this format, and trained with Jake Chapman in 1988 after completing many long intensives.

https://www.spirithorse.co.uk/enlightment-intensive

Charles Berner http://www.charlesberner.org/

Jake Chapman appears to be one of Charles Berner's top students. https://relating-manual.com/relationship-path/our-history/ There might have been some sort of schism or disagreement between them, I'm not clear on the details.

According to some essays on Chapman's site, he is fond of using Ecstasy (MDMA).

I've looked through some Enlightenment Intensive training manuals and discussions. Described are very stressful large group awareness trainings.

Participants put in long, very active, highly regimented days. Choice is taken away because choice is considered a distraction.

People with epilepsy are encouraged to not take their meds, they are told that meds may make it more difficult to reach enlightenment. Yes, they are also told that not taking meds may trigger a seizure due to stress, but this is in the context of being in the middle of a paid event to get enlightened.

Monitors can end up "crazy or hysterical or just babble".

Participants hallucinate, cry, shake, and get physically ill. Berner describes situations that should have resulted in medics being called but they were not.

http://www.charlesberner.org/EIManualApril2006_1x.pdf

So Shivam O'Brien has been leading these trainings for over 20 years? After going through many long intensives with Chapman? ("Long intensives" are at least 10 days.) That's nuts.

Large group awareness trainings (LGATs, like EST, Landmark etc.) are bad enough. What Shivam O'Brien and crew are doing is even worse.

Quote from: BobAmser on September 24, 2019, 05:51:46 AM
We live nearby. It's a great pity that they are creating a mess in a richly wooded Welsh valley by  building large, inappropriate and grandiose structures:-

https://www.crowdfunder.co.uk/spirithorseroundhouseproject#start

Incidentally, Kurikindi, the 'Ecuadorian Shaman' lives in London and charges high sums for courses:-

http://www.londonersathome.org/shaman.html

https://www.findhorn.org/programmes/walking-amazonian-shamanic-path/

Erika Indra aka White Buffalo Woman (!) is originally from Hungary.

These fantasists are right out of touch with reality and draw in others to pay for their dreams.

Thank you for this information, it is very helpful.

I see that in the past O'Brien has been in trouble for a building he built in Ireland, he did not properly apply for permits.

Shivam O'Brien says he used to be a carpenter in London and that he then went off on spiritual quests to India and elsewhere.

I don't know what his birth name is. I think "Shivam" is from his association with the founder of Enlightenment Intensives - Charles Berner "Yogeshwar Muni', who was a disciple of Swami Kripalvananda.

Many people in this group adopted Hindu names but most have reverted back to their original names. Shivam is unusual in this regard.

He built a building on his property in Galway, Ireland without getting proper planning permits. He refused to abide by the council and instead did dramatic fasting, fundraising, and complaining. https://www.indymedia.ie/article/106510 It sounds like he is doing a version of this in Wales also.

He is quite impressed with his carpentry skills but actually the constructions look kinda ugly and unsafe.

The Enlightenment Intensives are crazy and surely crazy making. Some participants end up in the psych ward.

I've watched several of his videos. He and his people are doing a "tribal" hippie communal "pre-industrial" anti-establishment trip.

O'Brien plays the part of "wild man". He is called the "Community Chieftain".

He is a master of b.s. He can hold forth endlessly. The community holds long sessions where he talks and performs, with music and everyone dancing, looks like everyone goes into a trance state or passes out. Including children.

I imagine that he is a man with an excuse for everything. Maybe this can all be summed up as his belief that rolling in actual mud is good, properly applying for building permits is bad.