Author Topic: Mala "Spotted Eagle" Pope & Nanish Shontie  (Read 14460 times)

Offline educatedindian

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Re: Mala "Spotted Eagle" Pope & Nanish Shontie
« Reply #15 on: October 05, 2008, 05:58:24 AM »
Yet more allegations of sexual assault, rape, and this time of the molesting of young children. The charges come from two of the mothers of the children involved, who are stating their own names publicly. They in turn say numerous others have daughters who've been abused the same.

Given the seriousness of the charges, I have to stress that so far these are still unproven charges, although one mother does vow to prosecute.

If true, I urge all victims to come forward so that no others will be harmed and justice is done. If anyone knows the people involved, please contact them to urge them to go to the police and DAs and seek prosecution.

And anyone who is in any contact with people who may be near Pope or his projects, please warn everyone as a precaution.

------------------------------

http://www.indybay.org/newsitems/2007/08/06/18439218.php?show_comments=1#18539068

mala spotted eagle pope is a child molester
by spring duckett
( free_mother_earth [at] yahoo.com ) Wednesday Jul 30th, 2008 12:14 PM

three years ago my family lived at nanish shontie. there is a big long personal drama involved in all of this, but the reason i am here is because my daughter, who is now almost 10, claims that mala molested her. she never said anything while we were there, in fact it didnt come out until a year later when she was living with her father (my exhusband) and she told a counselor. due to strained and legal problems with my ex i have not been able to get ahold of the medical records and go to oregon to press charges, but i believe my daughter and i am caught between severe anger and great sadness. i am joining and posting here because apparently in the past year people have posted about mala being a fraud and quite frankly, i am at a loss as to how to handle this. i will not let it go, there will be retribution of some kind; i am hoping to find some way in the indigenous community that can offer suggestions other than the us goverments idea of justice. if anyone would be willing to talk with me about this, please contact me. time is not an issue, as long as i have breath in my body i will work on finding a way to deal with this so that he takes responsibility for sexually abusing my 6 year old ON HER BIRTHDAY.


shoshone tribe
by spring duckett
Thursday Aug 28th, 2008 10:51 AM
Mala Spotted Eagle Pope is indeed Shoshone, the son of Rolling Thunder. He is not lying about his heritage. however, i don't know that i would call him an elder, as he is middle aged. Poohabah was a healing center in tecopa hot springs, california, that he was affiliated with but was not his. It was a place started and run by Shoshone elder Corbin Harney, who has at this time crossed over. Corbin was one of the most amazing people i have ever known, and i am ever thankful for my brief time learning with him. i don't know what has happened with the place since then. I am not a member of any tribe, i am simply a young American woman who shares the belief that we all would be nowhere fast without our Mother Earth. I am no saint, and i am not here on this planet to fight with anyone. I am looking for a way to heal, and for my young innocent daughter to heal from the great wrong done to her by a man whom my husband and i had great respect and admiration for, that we trusted. i do not agree with or believe in the american government's ideas of justice, nor do i believe in violence, and i will continue to search for the right way to deal with this. if anyone who reads these threads has any suggestions at all i would be so thankful for their input. What is the way of the tribes to deal with something like this? I continue to pray to the Great Creator for answers, and peace in all this.


Spring, your daughter is not alone. Mala Spotted Eagle Pope is a sexual preditor.
by Teresa Maijala
Tuesday Sep 16th, 2008 11:21 PM
Spring, first of all I want to say I am so sorry for what Mala did to your daughter. I don't doubt your story at all. I am reaching out to you, as another Mother with knowledge of what Mala Spotted Eagle Pope has done to your daughter and many other young girls over at least the past 30 years. I lived at Meta Tantay along with my then Husband and two children. A son and a daughter. I know of at least 4 girls he molested there, all under the age of 5. My daughter was 3. I won't name names at the moment. But I know all these beautiful young women, and their Mothers. The thought of what these girls have had to carry and live with at this mans hands is more then I can bear being silent about.These girls have had to live with the emotional scarring, years of torment while he is free to play Spiritual leader and continue destroying the hearts souls and emotions of our daughters. Then parading around the country like someone we are all supposed to honor and learn from. It is time for his reign of terror on little girls as well as grown women to come to an end.

There are allot of people who know about his behavior from Meta Tantay. He has many enemies. We all knew and respected his father Rolling Thunder. I have to say I don't understand how he has gotten away with this for so long. Why none of us adults, intelligent men an women allow this man to continue. Honestly, I don't understand why Rolling Thunder let it go on.

I am very sad to say that his wife Sky has to know about this. If she is really a "Clan Mother" why is she letting her husband get away with this? She is in a position in these communities to leave little girls at his mercy, while she has their Moms and Dads off working here and there. Is this what a Clan Mother does? Isn't it her job to protect children? She is a teacher, right? In these communities where Sky and mala are set up as trusted leaders, where we bring our sweet babies to try and find a way to live a better life. They desecrate our families like this? Please it's time to quit keeping dirty secrets, wake up and call it what is really is! There is strength in numbers.

We don't have to be perfect people to demand justice. None of us are perfect people, including Rolling Thunder. The hard part for me was admitting we were foolish to trust them, and having my precious daughter pay with her mind, emotions, heart and soul for my dreams of a better world. My heart just dies every time I think of it.

Personally, I think prison sounds fabulous. There grown men are willing and able to do to him what he has done to our daughters. Then let him spend the next 20 years in therapy trying to get back his will to live, healing. I am putting this on the WWW because I want to go to court over the matter! I will ask every girl he has molested to come forward, and we will do it together. How many young girls will we be saving? How many don't we know about?

My beautiful daughter has suffered so deeply, I can only imagine how many others there are.
With deep sorrow,
Teresa


Mala Spotted Eagle
by Hermy Jes
( hermyjes [at] telfort.nl ) Sunday Sep 21st, 2008 11:38 AM
I'm very sorry to read all the stories about sexual abuse by Mala Spotted Eagle Pope. I've known mala for 10 yeas and spend many summers (6-10weeks) with him and his wife Sky. The big dream was to build a community for all people for a better earth.
During my time there I did notice his strange way of reacting to women in general. His first comment when I got at Nanish Shontie was: 'did you know that Shoshone men can have more then one women?' Of course I was surprised and asked him with what intention he would tell me this. He did not answer.
Also we worked a lot in the 'community' and for the 'community'. to discover no improvement whatsoever. Nothing in 10 yrs. I did however get to hear a lot of stories about sexual abuse. Some of them heartbreaking. Using 'healing' as an excuse (elkmedicine). None of the women dared to go to the police, they were threatened in diffirent ways. One was to think of what his father Rolling Thunder was able to do. mala was able to do those things too! And even when the women in question were living in another country, he would know how to hurt them if they told.
When I heard the stories I told as many people as I could and being the contactperson in Holland for Nanish Shontie, this brought me the threat from mala too. He told me that if I would come to the States again, he would tell Native people that worked for him, how to find me and deal with me the 'native'way!
I had very good contact with Corbin Harney and he would turn in his grave if he knew even half!
The only thing I can think of is to get all the women (young and older) to get together and report together. I really think that prison is the only place this man is in place!!
I know what it is to be molested and I feel deeply for you daughter. She is lucky to have such a brave mother!
 

Mala Spotted Eagle is, was and always will be nothing but a huge fraud
by Just Don't Buy It
Thursday Oct 2nd, 2008 3:34 AM
Thank you for having the courage to come forward and post what you know!

It's very difficult to stop these new age frauds because they are very clever and devious and they know how to manipulate white people psychologically.

I would never judge a woman who has been sexually violated and I would never demand that she come forward.
However, there are white people who have given money to Mala who could come forward and help to document how much money has been taken in for the phoney non profit Nanish Shonte. They could demand that the IRS investigate Mala and return all the money to the Shoshone people.

Almost all of the victims of Mala's scams are white and they are too embarrassed about being fooled by this charlatan to admit it openly.
Religious scam artists, like Mala, count on this.

White people need to get over their need to always be right and to admit they've been fooled. Until they develop the humility to do this, native peopel will continute to suffer and our religious will continue to be polluted by the lies that frauds like him spread.

Nanish Shontie is an illegitimate non profit. Mala explointed Corbin to make money. Native people have tried to expose him for years, but the laws require that someone who has been victimized by the scam come forward and ask for their money to be returned. No matter how many native people denounce Mala for his fraud, no action will be taken by the racist U.S. government against him until white people who have been bilked of their money are willing to admit they are wrong.

In a racist society, this will take a long, long time.

November 2008 it buy nothing new age month.

I hope that white people will voluntarily refrain from buying anything new age for this one month and reflect on how their blind consumerism hurts native people.

Please spread the word - November 2008 - BUY NOTHING!

Thank you

http://www.justdontbuyit.bravehost.com


elders speak up!!
by spring duckett
( free_mother_earth [at] yahoo.com ) Thursday Oct 2nd, 2008 9:36 AM
thank you mothers for speaking out. i would like to ask that if any elders have eyes to see these posts or ears to hear our cries that they share their wisdom, the old ways to deal with these things. prison is an ugly place but it is white justice. now dont get me wrong i am white but i dont think that it is justice, i cant pick and choose what's okay for the government to dictate and i havent seen anything that they do that would be considered of the spirit. as nice as it is to envision him in prison, i prefer to envision him forced spiritually to face his own monsters and the Great Spirit, to be healed of his demons, not consumed by them. if its just to hurt him i got better ideas than prison...thats too good for him. if any one has suggestions of where to look for elders to speak with, i will travel to them. i know they arent going to be online, but i dont want to just walk up into tribal community with these accusations, i want to go in a good way. i will honor the wisdom that comes. corbin was the most amazing person i have known and if he was here we would pray together at sunrise about it. who else will come forward to pray with me at sunrise? newe sogobia, i call to you, rise and honor your ways. they are not forgotten.

Offline Kathryn

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Re: Mala "Spotted Eagle" Pope & Nanish Shontie
« Reply #16 on: October 05, 2008, 10:46:55 PM »
quoting Hermy Jes ( hermyjes [at] telfort.nl ) Sunday Sep 21st, 2008 11:38 AM
<snip>
I did however get to hear a lot of stories about sexual abuse. Some of them heartbreaking. Using 'healing' as an excuse (elkmedicine).

Oh, great. Blame the Elk again. I do not know Pope, but I heard another abuser use this same excuse. Because of course rape is so healing for the victim. And rapists are really just spreading the "love medicine". *pukes on keyboard*

Quote
None of the women dared to go to the police, they were threatened in diffirent ways. One was to think of what his father Rolling Thunder was able to do. mala was able to do those things too! And even when the women in question were living in another country, he would know how to hurt them if they told.

The most skilled and successful predators learn to pick out the ones they think are weak, the ones they think are least likely to fight back or go to the police.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2008, 10:11:26 AM by Kathryn NicDh? na »
Trí caindle forosnat cach ndorcha: Fír, Aicned, Ecna

Offline spring duckett

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Re: Mala "Spotted Eagle" Pope & Nanish Shontie
« Reply #17 on: October 19, 2008, 06:22:18 PM »
thank you for reposting my threads from indymedia.  i do not want to see this keep happening to innocent children.  of the several emails i have received from women, i know of at least one more incident since i lived there in 2005. 

in looking at your site it seems that you try to research things a good bit. if anyone is genuinely interested in more information i am always happy to read and respond to emails and back up my story with proof.  spring duckett will not get you far on finding anything about me personally, but the people that know me including the popes, know who i am by seeing that. 

i hope he sees and knows i am speaking out.  i look forward to the day when he has to face judgement.  man's courtrooms dont do justice but i know he will see a mirror one day. 

as i said in my postings i am seeking elders to speak with about this, preferably from the shoshone since that is what he says he represents. if the big people dont protect the little people then something is wrong. 


Offline educatedindian

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Re: Mala "Spotted Eagle" Pope & Nanish Shontie
« Reply #18 on: April 04, 2013, 02:04:44 PM »
One of the people who accused Pope of molesting and abusing children, Hermy Jes, just sent a series of messages. The first few asked that we remove his/her message. Now they are actually threatening to sue if we don't remove them.

Not sure what to make of this. At no point does Hermy Jes deny that these abuses happened. They are just saying that it hurts Pope's family.

The threat to sue is just plain delusional. Whoever heard of suing someone for simply reposting what they themselves publicly posted online elsewhere?

I have no idea what Jes hopes to accomplish or their motives. Most of the accusations are not from Hermy Jes anyway, they are from multiple other people.

Offline Late Worm

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Re: Mala "Spotted Eagle" Pope & Nanish Shontie
« Reply #19 on: July 15, 2013, 10:44:15 PM »
I've known Mala since he was a kid.  The child abuse allegations surprise me - but I wouldn't know anything about that since I haven't seen Mala for 30 years.  But I can clarify the question about his heritage.  Mala's mother Helen was indeed Western Shoshone.  His father John (Rolling Thunder) was Shawnee/Cherokee/Cajun from the Ozarks.  "Pope" is a common surname among the Shawnee and he also had some "Blue Jackets" in his family tree.

Offline Piff

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Re: Mala "Spotted Eagle" Pope & Nanish Shontie
« Reply #20 on: July 16, 2013, 12:08:17 AM »
His father John (Rolling Thunder) was Shawnee/Cherokee/Cajun from the Ozarks.

Do you know where John W Pope was born, the names of his ancestors?

Offline Late Worm

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Re: Mala "Spotted Eagle" Pope & Nanish Shontie
« Reply #21 on: July 16, 2013, 01:20:03 AM »
I knew John well - over a period of many years.  I don't remember him ever telling me just where in the Ozarks he was born.  But it was very rural and remote - a cabin in the woods sort of thing.  As I mentioned "Pope" and "Blue Jacket (it might be "Bluejacket) are the only family names I heard.  It is likely that either of the families were Cherokee/Shawnee as the Cherokee "Old Settlers" immigrated to Arkansas a few years before the trail of tears removal.

As a child John developed a keen interest in herbs - I'm sure that both the Indians and Cajuns in his community used herbs for medicine in those days.  He also was a avid reader.  He really mispronounced a lot of the words he used - he learned the phonetically and they were words that people in his community didn't use.  Like if he talked about "pagans" he would say "page ins".  He told me that he had a "terrible wound" on his finger but he prounced it "wound" as in "wind up" something.

Offline educatedindian

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Re: Mala "Spotted Eagle" Pope & Nanish Shontie
« Reply #22 on: July 18, 2013, 01:00:21 AM »
This is the first I've heard of any Cajun or Shawnee ancestry. His Cherokee claims were based a supposed Chickamagua ancestor. Various Cherokee over the years have said he's a liar and that any supposed Chickamaguas hiding out in the woods are a falsehood. And there are a few Cherokee that Trisha Jacobs, a former member, talked to who believed his claims.

ETA: These supposed Chickamaugas were claimed to have hidden out further east, not part of the Old Settlers in Arkansas. Pope also had a loony claim of fighting in the Yaqui Wars. The last Yaqui War ended when Pope was 8 years old.
I don't think much of the Grateful Dead thinking him authentic. Pope was a retired railroad worker until he set himself up as a hippie guru and they all lived in an old brothel in Nevada.,

Offline Piff

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Re: Mala "Spotted Eagle" Pope & Nanish Shontie
« Reply #23 on: July 18, 2013, 04:47:19 AM »
Rolling Thunder's grandson Sidian Morning Star Jones wrote a book with Stanley Krippner "The Voice of Rolling Thunder: A Medicine Man's Wisdom for Walking the Red Road". They say John Pope was born in Stamps, Arkansas on 19 Sept 1916. Mother white, father Cherokee and Cajun. They write that "according to sources I consulted, his father's Native name was Yankkiller, and RT's grandfather used the same name".

According to this book, John Pope/Rolling Thunder claimed that his grandfather was a "traditional Indian chief" murdered "by soldiers and agency police". Also that his father belonged to a resistance group called Snake, and was killed during one of their protests. And that he himself was raised on a reservation in Oklahoma and began learning the "ways of the medicine people" there.

I believe I found the family in census, if so, they were white. But will have to find an obit or other confirmation to make sure.

Name:    John W Pope
Titles and Terms:    
Event Type:    Census
Event Year:    1920
Event Place:    Ouachita, Polk, Arkansas, United States
District:    109
Gender:    Male
Age:    3
Marital Status:    Single
Race:    White
Race (Original):    White   
Relationship to Head of Household:    Son
Relationship to Head of Household (Original):    Son
Birth Year (Estimated):    1917
Birthplace:    Arkansas    
Father's Birthplace:    Missouri
Mother's Birthplace:    Texas
Sheet Number and Letter:    3B
Household ID:    57
Line Number:    100
Affiliate Name:    The U.S. National Archives and Records Administration (NARA)
Affiliate Publication Number:    T625
GS Film number:    1820074
Digital Folder Number:    004293674
Image Number:    01114
     Household    Gender    Age    Birthplace
Head    Clarence W Pope    M    33    Missouri
Wife    Blanche A Pope    F    24    Texas
Son    John W Pope    M    3    Arkansas

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/MDF9-ZWQ?cc=1488411
« Last Edit: April 15, 2014, 05:48:06 PM by Piff »

Offline Late Worm

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Re: Mala "Spotted Eagle" Pope & Nanish Shontie
« Reply #24 on: July 18, 2013, 07:00:28 AM »
Educatedindian:

You're opening up a can of worms.  Cherokee history is very complicated and rife with myth and tall tales.  I would say one authority to consider - considering the immigration of Eastern Indians to Arkansas before the Indian Removal - is the Arkansas Riverbed Case (Choctaw Nation v. Oklahoma 396 U.S. 620).  I've never read the case personally - only writings about it - but I am certain it contains much credible evidence about the presence of Cherokees - Shawnee - Delaware etc people living Northeastern Arkansas as early as 1780.  Whether or not they are referred to as "Chickamaugas" or not I don't know.  In the legal case they use the term "Old Settlers."


Offline Late Worm

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Re: Mala "Spotted Eagle" Pope & Nanish Shontie
« Reply #25 on: July 18, 2013, 07:25:45 AM »
Piff:

Interesting.  I don't know Sidian - he must be one of John's daughter's kid.  There were two daughters I never met as I recall.  Also I've never heard the name "Yankkiller." 

But you know - RT was a cult leader after he went all BillyJack on us.  Part of cultism is being paranoid- there always has to be an enemy that's out to get you.  I can imagine John getting carried away about murder and agency in his biographical musings. 

Offline Piff

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Re: Mala "Spotted Eagle" Pope & Nanish Shontie
« Reply #26 on: July 18, 2013, 02:00:24 PM »
Stanley Krippner said in an interview about Rolling Thunder:

Quote
His temper was legendary as was his sexual appetite.


http://beforeitsnews.com/paranormal/2013/06/medicineman-rolling-thunder-2452750.html

Late Worm can you describe what you saw of RT being a cult leader? Mala was born in 1952, the first Billy Jack movie  came out in 1967, Mala then would have been raised in this cult environment.


Offline Piff

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Re: Mala "Spotted Eagle" Pope & Nanish Shontie
« Reply #27 on: July 18, 2013, 06:29:27 PM »
Rolling Thunder was John W. Pope, he used that name for the non profit corporation records of Meta Tantay. He used the name John Rolling Thunder Pope when he married Carmen Michelle Clevenger in 1996. He's in the Social Security Death Index as John W Pope born 10 Sep 1916, died 23 Jan 1997.

Quote
Rolling Thunder was an authentic healer and a fascinating character, whose flagrant lechery made him all the more interesting.

http://books.google.com/books?id=sWCRWJnTTF8C&pg=PA309&dq=%22rolling+thunder%22+%22john+pope%22&hl=en&sa=X&ei=UizoUZSlGaKNigKknoDoAw&ved=0CFcQ6AEwBw#v=onepage&q=%22rolling%20thunder%22%20%22john%20pope%22&f=false

Mala Spotted Eagle Pope was president of the non profit corporation Nanish Shontie, now Sandra Katherine Sky Pope is. There also is a Nanish Shonti Land Trust, Abram Heard is president, Winter Pope secretary.

Abram Heard http://www.nanish.org/Pages/abram-heard.html

Offline Late Worm

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Re: Mala "Spotted Eagle" Pope & Nanish Shontie
« Reply #28 on: July 19, 2013, 07:08:13 PM »
I met John in 1969 and then at Battle Mountain in 1971 while I was traveling with Mad Bear's "Spiritual Indian Unity Caravan."  He joined the caravan and went as far as Salt Lake City.  During this time (from Battle Mountain to SLC) we were talking about the destruction of the Pinyon Pines in Nevada - so important to the Shoshone - and strategies to organize a protest move to stop this practice ("Chaining " in which three D7 Catepillars would drag a huge "Ely Chain" through the Pinyon groves - 20 acres per hour - and destroy the trees ostensibly to improve "marginal range land" for cattle.  So I showed up the next year at John's home to get started on our project.  At this time I think he was just getting into "commune" idea that he had dreamed up with Lawton for the "Billy Jack" script.  You have to remember that there was a lot of "Indian Movement" going on in those days and Indians were traveling all over the country.  Everyone knew that they would be welcome at John's - to camp out or what ever.  But he was also courting the Hippies at that time.  And making his plans to buy some land out side of Carlin for the commune.

Mala was about 18 or 19 when I first met him in 1971 and I don't think you could date "the cult environment" earlier than 1973 or 74 - so he would have been in his early 20s.  So I wouldn't say he was raised in that environment.  When I first knew Mala he worked at a gas station in Carlin.  As far as learning a trade of skill for his livelihood it looks like his position at the commune was it.  So it's not surprising to me that he would start another one after the Nevada commune fell apart.  The big difference between Mala and his Dad in my opinion is that John always worked - on the railroad - and essentially used his own salary to underwrite his projects.  In other words he was a "working man" while Mala was not.

Offline earthw7

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Re: Mala "Spotted Eagle" Pope & Nanish Shontie
« Reply #29 on: July 20, 2013, 12:41:31 PM »
I wonder why? people want to be like us so bad that they will go though great lengths to pretend to be us,
our lives are hard, then they pick these so called things to support but none of it helps the native people,
i just get disgusted with these people they no right to our ways
In Spirit