Author Topic: Was this spiritual abuse by a shaman?  (Read 4768 times)

Offline kris7

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Was this spiritual abuse by a shaman?
« on: February 04, 2015, 12:04:21 am »
Hello. My name is Kris. I went searching and found your forum.

I have been through a difficult relationship in recent years. To my surprise, just as those wounds begin to heal, my thoughts have returned to something I haven't thought about in years.

First, some background: I was harmed by an unscupulous surgeon in 2007. He had said he was going to remove a sinus polyp, but instead removed alot of bone from my face, ruining my face and causing me severe breathing problems. My inner nose--the turbinates which are the organ of breathing--had been removed. I had numerous serious infections from the butchery. I was very sick, distraught, and suffering intensely from the breathing problem. I later discovered there was no medical reason for the surgery.

I had been helped by a spiritual director--trained by a Christian Spiritual Directing organization, Wellsprings--previously, through a difficult period, of about 3 years. I had not seen her for about 4 years when I returned, in this condition. I was unable to work during this time and had only a little money left to live on. I asked her if I could pay less than she normally charges as I was in a bind. She agreed, but I could tell she wasn't happy. This surpised me as the woman was very well off.

At first, she was helpful in affirming my feelings about what had been done to me. She remembered my face and said that the man who had done this to me had not made a mistake. He was a madman. This was the way I felt.

Over about 5 more one-hour sessions, my crying and expressing of anger did not cease, and I talked about wanting to sue the doctor. In about the sixth session like this, she became very disgusted with me, and told me I needed professional counseling, not spiritual direction, that I had mental health issues. I was gutted. I was in so much pain, didn't have my real face, couldn't breathe, was sick from the infections, and she had labeled me neurotic. I attempted to disagree, to get her to see that I was in a spiritual crisis because my strength had been tested beyond the limit. I felt I needed love and attending, though obviously attending me was not pleasant.

She turned very cold and angry, bristling, I could see and feel intense dislike. She said very stiffly that she could make me a referral to a professional who could try to help me, but there was nothing she could do. "I take care of souls," she said hatefully. I stumbled out of the session. I couldn't believe what had happened.

Later at home, I fel absolutely sick. She had made me feel unacceptable to myself. I believed she had made a mistake. I thought we were friends. I called her to talk about what had happened, and how I felt, and she spat at me, "I'll gladly send your money for the session back."

The spiritual director is also a shaman. Some months later, to my surprise, I received an e-mail invitation to a "drumming circle" she was holding at her home. There was a special invitation for me to have a spiritual reading by one of her shamanic students after the drumming. I felt this was a peace offering. I was very ill, but determined to attend.

When I arrived, she told me to go to the basement and wait. I sat in the basement by myself. All of the others stayed upstairs until everyone had arrived. Then they came down together. I was having so much trouble breathing in the airless basement, I could barely cope. I felt horribly self-conscious, like a lesser person than the others. Then there was the drumming, and though I was suffering, it was nice. One thing that bothered me, however, was how much everyone fawned over the shaman, telling her how powerful she was, how great, how elevated, how Godly.

Then there was the spiritual reading, done by her student. The student began to describe a large bird soaring over a hilly area as people were gathered below. I felt very happy as this was a reading of my spirit. It was soaring. Then the student said, "Then the bird...I am sorry...I don't know how to say this...releases its bowels upon all the people below." I almost ceased breathing. I can still remember my heart clenching against the pain.

I had to wait for the gathering to be over. I stumbled upstairs with the others. I turned to my former spiritual director for a good-by, but she hugged everyone good-by except me.

I am a poor driver and night blind, and by this time, I really couldn't breathe. I got lost. It took me 3 hours, gasping for air, to drive the half hour home. I recall that, during this period, I could not have a nice expression on my face because I was in so much pain. Plus, it wasn't my face. I had felt self-conscious about that. It had been quite an undertaking for me to go out at all.

Somehow, I went on. I got better, and had other life experiences. I am now one year out of an abusive relationship, and just as I start to feel better, this experience came to my mind.

Was this spiritual abuse? HAD I done something wrong--being negative--to warrant being treated this way? Why would she do this? Any and all feedback is welcome. Thank you for listening.

Offline debbieredbear

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Re: Was this spiritual abuse by a shaman?
« Reply #1 on: February 04, 2015, 02:58:35 am »
Sure sounds like it to me! The only thing you did wrong is to trust the wrong person, and that can happen to almost anyone.

Offline kris7

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Re: Was this spiritual abuse by a shaman?
« Reply #2 on: February 04, 2015, 03:32:11 am »
Thank you, debbieredbear, Your response helps me, as I think this is a long-buried wound underlying subsequent bad experiences. As I heal from the bad relationship, this is what I find at the bottom of the wound.

Offline earthw7

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Re: Was this spiritual abuse by a shaman?
« Reply #3 on: February 04, 2015, 03:35:41 pm »
I am so sorry this happen to you, you never pay to pray and most these people called shamans are fakes.
my husband has some of the same problems in which a doctor removed most of the sinus glans he could not sleep or breath good made him miserable they said there was no reason for this doctor to do this, he has a CPAT to sleep with now and doing the best we can.
In Spirit

Offline kris7

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Re: Was this spiritual abuse by a shaman?
« Reply #4 on: February 04, 2015, 05:25:14 pm »
earthw7, ENT's are performing that surgery purely for money. It is a terrible medical crime. If your husband has not come across the the term Empty Nose Syndrome, that is the name for it. There are a number of forums for sufferers, and here is my blog about ENS: https://ens3.wordpress.com/ I am very sorry this happened to him.

I think the spiritual director/shaman who was cruel to me was very serious about her work and felt it was a calling. She was married to a minister of a very large Methodist church, and was very involved in the church. She was helpful to me in the earlier years when I saw her, but even then she got weird towards me in the last...about 6 months. She had begun to treat me disrespectgully, not letting me in her home until she was ready for my appt... not hugging me good-by.

I am looking back on this now. Her cold behavior hastened my leaving her direction.  When I returned years later, I believe I was remembering the whole of the experience, which was good, and not the weirdness at the end. Now I think she had begun to dislike me at the end of the first period of me being a client. I don't know why. When I returned, able to pay less than half her fee, I feel that was unbearable to her, as she both didn't like me, and did like money. She buried these issues beneath a veneer of compassion. After all, she considered herself a Christian.

He real feelings took over, in short order. Between her resentment over how little she was making from my appointments and having to listen to me cry and vent, her disgust must have overwhelmed her.

The special invitation to the drumming circle takes the picture alot farther into her inner darkness. That appears to have been a planned and calculated assault on my spiritual well-being. This, from a "healer." Within that picture, also, was a huge amount of stomach-churning fawning by her students and followers. That, I know, is an unhealthy sign in any gathering of a spiritual leader and followers. That means the leader has been placed above the message and is being worshipped. In other words, ego is in charge, not God. The fact she planned to hurt me is indicative of even worse, I think that her ego had taken over her practice. Her ego was running the show if it was allowed to plan and execute a spiritual attack upon a suffering soul.

She had felt attacked, in her ego, when I attempted to tell her she had been mistaken in her guidance, and she planned an elaborate retaliation, in a setting where I could see how great and revered she was. These are my thoughts.

Thank you for your reflection.

Cheesy Little Life

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Re: Was this spiritual abuse by a shaman?
« Reply #5 on: February 05, 2015, 11:49:50 am »
Hello Kris

Do you feel able to tell us the name of this ‘shaman’?

Mmm hmm ... nuage group followers and fawners competing strenuously in different ways (eg drumming circles) for status and approval, plus ego tripping and drama-queening ... scapegoats, put-downs, getting picked on etc ... all depressingly familiar.

Quote
Then the student said, "Then the bird...I am sorry...I don't know how to say this...releases its bowels upon all the people below."

Most depressing of all is when some fawner in a group picks up the filthy ideas of the leader and dumps them on another participant.

Quote
I thought we were friends.

I do not think one can be friends with self-appointed nuage ‘shamans’ etc. They know nothing of value and are not interested in equal relationships. Forget it. Stay away from all of them.


Offline earthw7

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Re: Was this spiritual abuse by a shaman?
« Reply #6 on: February 05, 2015, 03:14:22 pm »
earthw7, ENT's are performing that surgery purely for money. It is a terrible medical crime. If your husband has not come across the the term Empty Nose Syndrome, that is the name for it. There are a number of forums for sufferers, and here is my blog about ENS: https://ens3.wordpress.com/ I am very sorry this happened to him.

I think the spiritual director/shaman who was cruel to me was very serious about her work and felt it was a calling. She was married to a minister of a very large Methodist church, and was very involved in the church. She was helpful to me in the earlier years when I saw her, but even then she got weird towards me in the last...about 6 months. She had begun to treat me disrespectgully, not letting me in her home until she was ready for my appt... not hugging me good-by.

I am looking back on this now. Her cold behavior hastened my leaving her direction.  When I returned years later, I believe I was remembering the whole of the experience, which was good, and not the weirdness at the end. Now I think she had begun to dislike me at the end of the first period of me being a client. I don't know why. When I returned, able to pay less than half her fee, I feel that was unbearable to her, as she both didn't like me, and did like money. She buried these issues beneath a veneer of compassion. After all, she considered herself a Christian.

He real feelings took over, in short order. Between her resentment over how little she was making from my appointments and having to listen to me cry and vent, her disgust must have overwhelmed her.

The special invitation to the drumming circle takes the picture alot farther into her inner darkness. That appears to have been a planned and calculated assault on my spiritual well-being. This, from a "healer." Within that picture, also, was a huge amount of stomach-churning fawning by her students and followers. That, I know, is an unhealthy sign in any gathering of a spiritual leader and followers. That means the leader has been placed above the message and is being worshipped. In other words, ego is in charge, not God. The fact she planned to hurt me is indicative of even worse, I think that her ego had taken over her practice. Her ego was running the show if it was allowed to plan and execute a spiritual attack upon a suffering soul.

She had felt attacked, in her ego, when I attempted to tell her she had been mistaken in her guidance, and she planned an elaborate retaliation, in a setting where I could see how great and revered she was. These are my thoughts.

Thank you for your reflection.

yes that is what we were told it called Empty Nose Syndrome the doctor who did this moved out of the area, it changed my husband life. just from what you erasing this is a fraud could you gives us her name please
In Spirit

Offline kris7

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Re: Was this spiritual abuse by a shaman?
« Reply #7 on: February 05, 2015, 05:34:13 pm »
Thank you for your replies.

After some self-debate, I decided to say. Her name is Deborah Ling.

At one time, she was an excellent spiritual director (this is a spiritual type of counseling). She was warm, compassionate, insightful, very caring. I believe I saw her 2000-04 about. In the last six months, she was different. I point this out, as she may have evercome her intermediate issues, and again, be very good at her work.

I returned in 2008 very ill, my face butchered almost beyond recognition. She seemed compassionate at first, but given her quick  turnabout (about the 6th session), I don't think the compassion was genuine at this time. Also, her response to my attempt to disagree with her and refocus things inspired such anger, as if I had insulted her, which has no place in a spiritual guiding environment.

The last thing--the drumming circle and the spiritual reading--that clears up any confusion I might otherwise have about what took place. In our 8 years of acquaintance, this was the first and only drumming circle I was invited to by her. The invitation came, I believe, a few months after her angry, hurtful words to me, both in the session and on the phone. The reading itself was so cruel and uncalled-for, it leaves little doubt about the intent. These readings, were developed before the drumming--under the direction of the shamanism school's director, Deborah Ling, as I recall in the e-mail invitation. There was some sharing of information and some sort of spiritual process that led the student to recount this disgusting metaphor, as description of my spirit, before the large group.

I did not realize I still held a wound from this until recent weeks. I thank all of you who have responded. I think the shamanism activity darkened the spiritual director's soul. I hope she has set this activity aside and cleared her soul.

Online Sparks

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Re: Was this spiritual abuse by a shaman? [Deborah J. Ling]
« Reply #8 on: November 03, 2020, 07:03:45 pm »
After some self-debate, I decided to say. Her name is Deborah Ling.

The day after the quoted post a new topic, referring to the present thread, was created in "Research Needed":

http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=4563.0 [Deborah J. Ling - Center for Shamanic Practice, Inc.]