E. P. Grondine

[E.P. Grondine]

As to why Cusick did not mention by name the Shawnee in his account of the Five Nations embassy to Chillicothe, and their was with them - it was because they had just sold the Shawnee lands to the "loyal" Virginia Company.

As to why the Shawnee "wandered", it was because they were attacked by the Five Nations, who were armed with guns by the Puritans.

The reason they called the eastern Lenape "grandfathers" was because the Shawnee remnant who Martin Chartier gathered together were allowed refuge among the Lenape by the Provincial Governors after their arrival at Point of Rocks, Maryland.

Other Shawnee returned directly to Ohio after the defeat of the Five Nations by the Three Fires.

Come right on....

[earthw7]

Well, now that everyone is here.

I as much as I am historian, was a journalist, and am of 1/8 shawnee descent.

And that I have never claimed to be a spiritual guide

And that the people who usually shout at me are spiritual thieves who concoct
fake histories, but now I find you shoutring at me in an effort to thrown doubt on the traditional histories about the Andaste and Shawnee...

The Colonists policy of conquest has been to diviide and conquer.
Thus people within the Ohio Historical Society has been leading other native
peoples into claiming Shawnee remains in Ohio.

If you look back here, you can find my discussion with Oestriecher about his version of both Shawnee and Lenape histories- in particular his claim that the Lenape medewak did not exist, and his version of Shawnee history.

Ostreicher's work has been funded by Lenape cassino interests for years.

So when the manger of the Lenape casino in Oklahoma shows up and tells me that the Loyal recieved that name because they were loyal to the union in the Civil War. And when Brad Lepper seeks Lenape support for the Ohio Historical Society, and promotes the Lenape memory of a "white road", at the same timeworking his hardest to concoct fake native history on the dime of the people of Ohio...

Let us start by examining the Sioux claims. They are based on the Siouxian tribes who lived back east at the time of European contact. for the southern Siouxian tribes, Catawba and Saponi, their arrival was remembered by the Cherokee.
For the Monocan, the difference between Lenape and Shawnee remains are quite well known to the archaeologists of western Maryland, who know them as Monongahela Late Woodlands and Keyser Late Woodlands respectively.

The Sioux (mengwe in Lenape, any other people later used to describe the mingo, mostly members of other nations who were fleeing the colonists such as Chief Logan) who accompanied them are shown by the catlinite flat disk pipes. The documentation of these in easwtern Ohio may be found in Bob Converse's book "The Archaeology of Ohio" a book which Mr. Lepper plagiarized from (either intentionally or inadvertently) and then suppressed.

Ok now you cross into my life I know my history and I did not learn it from a book --there are no Sioux people. We are not from the east and so far I can not find a connection to the east in our oral stories beside someone wrote it in a book so its true NOT. Our people before 1800 were only referred to as PteOyate then after the French and the "Rum Wars" we were referred to a the Sioux which mean snake or adder by the Chippewa who were invading our county. so after in the 1800 we were called Sioux. So if you claim to be a part of our nation before 1800 and call yourself Sioux I know you don't belong to us. No matter what THE WHITE HISTORIAN SAYS, we were  mound builder I know that and continued to build  mounds in Minnesota and the Dakota. I can show you them. I know our villages along the Mississippi River to our travels from South American 2000 years ago. We never fled the americans or the English. Shame on you for lying

[E.P. Grondine]

Hi earthw7 -

Thanks for sharing.

I do not know which nation you are a part of : Lakota, Nakota, Dakota, Omaha, Oto-Misouri, Ofofgoula or others.

[E.P. Grondine]

Remember, the technique of conquest was and is divide and conquer.

Brad Lepper of the Ohio Historical Society was askde by Chief Glenna Wallace of the Eastern Band to return known Shawnee remains from the contact period to her for proper re-internment.

Instead of doing that, Brad entered into negotiations with the manager of the Lenape casino.

[E.P. Grondine]

Next item - it appears that people of "distant native ancestry" were not the only people conned by Jerry Pope.

It has been reported to me by several sources that the former leadership of the Eastern Band bought land in Ohio near Zane's Caverns with the intention of setting up a casino there.

I have not checked the land records yet to see if this is so, but.. it seems likely...
of course, no one like to admit that they have been played by a conman, and often their memories if events are changed with time. Thus one always has to check the legal records.

[E.P. Grondine]

Hi DoesDrugsWithHippies -

Shouln't you be out following the Dead on their farewell tour?

In any case, it is rumored that county coffers are dry, and that both marijuana enforcement and DWI enforcement will be tight at the rock concert which is going to be held at Zane's Caverns, the land which Jerry Pope stole.

I need to add here that this is just a rumor so far.
We'll all get to see if it turns out to be true or not.

[AClockworkWhite]

Still talking as if he's Native. LOL I'm so glad he was unbanned. :D

[Diana]

Still talking as if he's Native. LOL I'm so glad he was unbanned. :D

He's talking gibberish! Does anyone know what he's talking about? Maybe he's having another stroke.

@EP Grondine,  if you can't refute the records and write a coherent sentence maybe you should leave this forum.  We've proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that you're white and "you" yourself unwittingly provided us with proof that you are not a published author or are peer reviewed. Nor are you a historian, regurgitating irrelevant pieces of history that you did not write does not make you an historian.

Be happy with who you are. You have a very impressive ancestry, your lineage goes all the way back to colonial times. You have done your family a grave disservice by denying who you are. Shame on you. Your family deserves better.

[educatedindian]

Next item - it appears that people of "distant native ancestry" were not the only people conned by Jerry Pope.

It has been reported to me by several sources that the former leadership of the Eastern Band bought land in Ohio near Zane's Caverns with the intention of setting up a casino there.

I have not checked the land records yet to see if this is so, but.. it seems likely...
of course, no one like to admit that they have been played by a conman, and often their memories if events are changed with time. Thus one always has to check the legal records.

This belongs in the appropriate thread. Let's stay on topic, and also provide proof.

For what it's worth, Grondine did send me scans of his press passes issued to him by NASA. I have no reason to doubt they are real.

[earthw7]

if you go back to the introduction you will see that I am Dakota and Lakota,
7/8 from my tribe and 1/8 Oglala I come from six different band of the Dakota and Lakota
I was born on my reservation and live on my reservation

[Defend the Sacred]

E.P. Grondine... I don't know where to start. You asking earthw7 who she is... is insulting. Again, it's clear you don't pay attention to what goes on here. She is a respected person and shouldn't have to spend time getting you up to speed.  *smh*

[kahtboosted]

Regarding this person's supposed or non-existent NDN ancestry, this thread is going nowhere.
I have no reason to defend either side, for the reasons that I am not related to the histories and tribes in question, and E.P. does not seem to be a new-age fraud, but rather a history writer who may be making dubious claims of his background. Its just getting silly, people post his ancestry records, and he keeps stating he is 1/8 without addressing the records.
Well, maybe somebody would take the claim more serious if he would list which ancestor was supposedly Native. Then somebody could check or debunk the claim of that specific ancestor too (who's probably already been listed in the records shown here). There is absolutely nothing wrong with being a person of distant ancestry and learning about your ancestors' cultures. But someone with verified NDN ancestry in one of their lines can tell you exactly what family member came from which tribe and when.
Just sayin, repeating 'I am 1/8th' without any real info like a mantra isn't really much different from repeating 'my grampa was a cherokee princess and thats all there is to it!'. Not much of an argument there.

[AClockworkWhite]

Regarding this person's supposed or non-existent NDN ancestry, this thread is going nowhere.
I have no reason to defend either side, for the reasons that I am not related to the histories and tribes in question, and E.P. does not seem to be a new-age fraud, but rather a history writer who may be making dubious claims of his background. Its just getting silly, people post his ancestry records, and he keeps stating he is 1/8 without addressing the records.
Well, maybe somebody would take the claim more serious if he would list which ancestor was supposedly Native. Then somebody could check or debunk the claim of that specific ancestor too (who's probably already been listed in the records shown here). There is absolutely nothing wrong with being a person of distant ancestry and learning about your ancestors' cultures. But someone with verified NDN ancestry in one of their lines can tell you exactly what family member came from which tribe and when.
Just sayin, repeating 'I am 1/8th' without any real info like a mantra isn't really much different from repeating 'my grampa was a cherokee princess and thats all there is to it!'. Not much of an argument there.

And there's your answer. He can't post which ancestor is Native, he can't be verified or it would have shown up already. I have no reason whatsoever to doubt the accuracy of the research done on this man's claims after all the successful and accurate research by members of this forum in the past. In fact, in my view, this forum's participants (researchers) are fricken amazing with the speed and depth of their searches. Not to mention the verifiable proof they provide. If he was actually Native, he would be exonerated already and we'd be apologizing. And no, there is nothing wrong with people coming across different ancestry. I myself have been informed by family of a vastly complex family history that makes me question a lot about what I've been told about certain sides of my family. So, that isn't what is in play here. It's now simply a case of yet another wannabe (albeit an educated/experienced one) claiming that which cannot be proven. We've seen it before, we'll see it again. Respect to all here and to the mods and Al. I am in awe most days at the sheer volume of inaccuracies and lies exposed here every single day I log in. I'm not even a quarter of the way through reading about all all the frauds yet.

[Diana]

Regarding this person's supposed or non-existent NDN ancestry, this thread is going nowhere.
I have no reason to defend either side, for the reasons that I am not related to the histories and tribes in question, and E.P. does not seem to be a new-age fraud, but rather a history writer who may be making dubious claims of his background. Its just getting silly, people post his ancestry records, and he keeps stating he is 1/8 without addressing the records.
Well, maybe somebody would take the claim more serious if he would list which ancestor was supposedly Native. Then somebody could check or debunk the claim of that specific ancestor too (who's probably already been listed in the records shown here). There is absolutely nothing wrong with being a person of distant ancestry and learning about your ancestors' cultures. But someone with verified NDN ancestry in one of their lines can tell you exactly what family member came from which tribe and when.
Just sayin, repeating 'I am 1/8th' without any real info like a mantra isn't really much different from repeating 'my grampa was a cherokee princess and thats all there is to it!'. Not much of an argument there.

Heavy sigh,  I do agree with you that this thread is going no where. But if you had read thru the entire thread and I know that is hard to do because of EP Grondine's flooding the thread with irrelevant gobbledygook you would have come to the conclusion that 1. EP Grondine is white, as he was the one to provide us with his mother's name and grand mother' s maiden name. It was his claim that his so called "Shawnee/Indian" blood/descent came from his mother. So in answer to your query yes some did provide a list to which ancestor was native. EP GRONDINE himself. 2. We can't find any news articles professional or scholastic that EP GRONDINE has written or published.  Again EP GRONDlNE himself provided us with nothing but an office newsletter, some online blogging, him responding to the comment section of other bloggers and yahoo chat rooms. 3. As for his claim of being a historian ...We cannot find any academic records, college records or even a high school diploma. In order to be an historian one must have a academic or some sort of  work history in that field which we cannot find nor has EP GRONDINE provided us with any proof.

I hope this answers your concerns with the EP GRONDINE thread as we are just as tired and exhausted as you.

[kahtboosted]

gotcha, and fully agreed.
I have been following the thread since it was posted, but it appears to have turned into EP mostly repeating that he's 1/8th when his info was debunked, but still repeating it. Repeating something doesn't make it true, unless we consider mantras to alter reality, lol.
While I mostly follow this forum to keep up on the spirituality and new age frauds, it does seem it wouldn't hurt for there to be more open inquiry into writers, academics, and the sort. Considering the academic frauds in the media lately, I'm not afraid to say I've met a couple teachers and professors I felt should have been investigated because of stereotypes or bad information they seemed to be promoting in the name of this or that culture. I think NAFPS, while having being formed for the new age frauds, may be the most centralized forum to be able to discuss these sorta things on the web. Even the new age frauds are interrelated with researchers and writers (ie. Castaneda and his legacy for a blatant/extreme example), so maybe such a section would prove rather useful. I think we can agree that a person's work as a historian does not need to rely on whether or one is a certain race, as much as it requires being honest and citing sources. But still most people will probably assume there is more credibility when someone talking about NDN history claims to be NDN. For that reason, one can understand why these claims need to be debunked just like the new agers' claims.