Author Topic: Tanja Fehlauer & Francis Billington AKA Tonya & Grey Wolf  (Read 61334 times)

Offline earthw7

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Re: Tanja Fehlauer & Francis Billington AKA Tonya & Grey Wolf
« Reply #105 on: January 20, 2016, 01:02:43 pm »
As a native person i can tell no tribe has allowed DNA to be a part of enrollment Plus there is no europeans on the rolls because you have be born in america, if our own people go though this when they are in the military and child is born overseas it is hard to get them enrolled.
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Offline Defend the Sacred

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Re: Tanja Fehlauer & Francis Billington AKA Tonya & Grey Wolf
« Reply #106 on: January 20, 2016, 07:34:36 pm »
Some time ago, I read an article that in tests in Iceland, they found mt-DNA which had definitely haplo groups found in Native Americans. But this is the most that can be established from knowing a person's mt-DNA: that somewhere in the line of that person's ancestry, a native woman came into the family. You cannot tell of which nation this woman may have been, nor even the region she originally came from - and last not least: the ancestor passing this mt-DNA may have lived centuries ago (as was most probably the case with the persons found in Iceland).

So if Mr Billington brags about a DNA test having confirmed Tanja was native - that's BS. It only means that at the beginning of her ancestral line, the female involved was a Native American. This does not make her ndn.

Actually, it doesn't prove there were any distant Native American ancestors in Iceland, or in this person's line. It means there are DNA sequences that turn up in Northern, Arctic populations, probably tracing back to a prehistoric tribe of people wandering around waaaaay up north, and then different groups headed in different directions and settled the landmasses they wound up on, millenia ago. We're talking about shared prehistoric ancestors who predated any of the cultures in question.
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Little Crow

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Re: Tanja Fehlauer & Francis Billington AKA Tonya & Grey Wolf
« Reply #107 on: January 20, 2016, 09:02:19 pm »
Sorry to keep on just need to get this right, DNA even though the paperwork states she has Native American DNA or origins this would not prove Native American heritage just a DNA connection to a Native American family member somewhere in her direct past? So she could not say she is Cherokee German then? Or even indigenous Native American & German?
 What about GW and his adoption into the Backwater Band of the Lower Muskogee?  The membership card he shows everyone does look real, but how real is real in his case. I did read on an earlier post it was fake. I must admit I have never trusted GW but always thought better of Tanya such a shock

Offline Diana

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Re: Tanja Fehlauer & Francis Billington AKA Tonya & Grey Wolf
« Reply #108 on: January 20, 2016, 10:26:24 pm »
@ Little Crow, the blackwater band of the lower Muskogee is a fake tribe and no more than a culture club. We have a couple of threads on them here. Also the real Muscogee (Creek) Nation has denounced them as fake.
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1735.msg19058#msg19058
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=2083.msg15525#msg15525
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1424.msg8567#msg8567

One of our forum members Bonnie Singleton (now deceased) contacted the Muscogee Nation and spoke with a Joyce Bear Historic Preservation Officer, said "The Muscogee (Creek) Nation DOES NOT recognize the Blackwater Band of Lower Muskogee or any other State recognized group as a legitimate American Indian tribe".
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1735.85;wap2


Diana

Sorry to keep on just need to get this right, DNA even though the paperwork states she has Native American DNA or origins this would not prove Native American heritage just a DNA connection to a Native American family member somewhere in her direct past? So she could not say she is Cherokee German then? Or even indigenous Native American & German?
 What about GW and his adoption into the Backwater Band of the Lower Muskogee?  The membership card he shows everyone does look real, but how real is real in his case. I did read on an earlier post it was fake. I must admit I have never trusted GW but always thought better of Tanya such a shock

Offline Ingeborg

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Re: Tanja Fehlauer & Francis Billington AKA Tonya & Grey Wolf
« Reply #109 on: January 20, 2016, 10:51:58 pm »
Sorry to keep on just need to get this right, DNA even though the paperwork states she has Native American DNA or origins this would not prove Native American heritage just a DNA connection to a Native American family member somewhere in her direct past? So she could not say she is Cherokee German then? Or even indigenous Native American & German?

She cannot describe herself as "Cherokee German", or even "NA & German".

As far as I understood this haplo group matter, the mt-DNA is inherited in the female line. You have the same haplo group as your mother, she has the same as her mother did, and so on until the first female in that line who also had that haplo group. This means the person who was the first female in a line may have lived several hundreds or even several thousands of years ago. We're not speaking about a "family member somewhere in her *direct* past". Direct line - yes. Direct past - no way.

Furthermore, while Tanja has maintained her father was German and her mother Cherokee, she blew this with her inquiry in that legal forum in which she clearly said her mother was German. So where's any "Native" genetic material to come from?

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What about GW and his adoption into the Backwater Band of the Lower Muskogee?  The membership card he shows everyone does look real, but how real is real in his case. I did read on an earlier post it was fake. I must admit I have never trusted GW but always thought better of Tanya such a shock

The Blackwater Band never was a 'tribe' or part of any 'tribe', all they said on their website was they were 'descendants of Mvskoke'. This is a far cry from a statement like 'We are Mvskoke'. They also had neither state nor federal recognition, and they were not claimed by any recognised Mvskoke nation either. So we're rather speaking of a heritage club. Their website is down now and they seem to have stopped activities.

However, NAFPS discussed them, you will find the respective thread here:
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1735.0

As you can see from the thread, Billington was never *adopted* into the Blackwater Band - all he received was an *honorary* membership.

You will also find this post in the thread whose poster reports that the Billingtons lost their honorary membership with the Blackwaters because they assaulted ndn persons in Europe:

http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1735.msg11689#msg11689

Nope the Blackwater Band is not officialy recognized by the Federal Gov,yes Francis Billington and Tonya Billington were given 'honorary' membership by the Blackwater clan.Yes the Billingtons assaulted members of the Indian Nations residing overseas and their 'honary membership was revoked as a result and yes Tonya Billington still falsely asserts she is Cherokee.

Francis Billington also cooperated with and supported a fake Comanche plastic shaman by the name of John Colbert aka Pushican who also falsely claimed to have been in the Star Wars films. Billington even covered Colbert's behind on this when Colbert's involvement was being questioned by fan organisations, writing a confirmation on Colbert's behalf:

"... My professional name is Frank Billington-Marks ...
During my time in the industry I worked as a Prop Maker and Set Dresser first on the Star Wars film "The Empire Strikes Back" followed by "Return of the Jedi" as a prop maker ..."


Billington continued contacts to Colbert even after Colbert had been sentenced for sexual abuse of a young woman who was a minor at the point in time the abuse happened (further details - warning, it's no easy reading! - in the thread on this - errrm: person: http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=614.0  ). Colbert is deceased now, but before his death, fan organisations established that he never was involved in any of the Star Wars films. A fake from head to toe. What can we say? - Birds of a feather, perhaps?


« Last Edit: January 20, 2016, 10:53:31 pm by Ingeborg »

Little Crow

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Re: Tanja Fehlauer & Francis Billington AKA Tonya & Grey Wolf
« Reply #110 on: January 21, 2016, 02:38:55 am »
It gets worse, you can’t trust anything they say, I’m in shock.
Thank you for clearing up the DNA part with Tanya, she has only ever said to me it was her grandmother that was Native American and she feels drawn to the Cherokee spirituality, but she can’t prove her or her grandmother is Cherokee but has DNA evidence proving her and her grandmothers Native American heritage , she describes herself  to others at NAF’s that she is German Native American Heritage and try’s to honor her ancestors by living Native American spirituality, Something that seems is not true.
GW however states she is Cherokee German and so is her Mother and having all the paperwork and records to prove it, though I have never seen them only Tanya's DNA record. This is why I started to question and yes GW would get very aggressive when questioned why Tanya was saying different to him, now I know why.
The Blackwater Band is no longer in operation, says it all, though I would have loved a headed letter saying they kicked him out and why.
I’m so angry with them, him more than her Tanya just seems delusional, I feel so suckered in by them.
Yes he has said to me he was involved in films including star-wars.
This is a great help, I feel so shocked by all this, but thank you for your advice. 

Offline Ingeborg

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Re: Tanja Fehlauer & Francis Billington AKA Tonya & Grey Wolf
« Reply #111 on: January 21, 2016, 04:05:06 am »
It gets worse, you can’t trust anything they say, I’m in shock.

I'm sorry you feel suckered in by them, and at the same time I'm glad we were able to provide some information and facts for you.

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Thank you for clearing up the DNA part with Tanya, she has only ever said to me it was her grandmother that was Native American
That's actually a new turn in her legend - it used to be her mother.

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she describes herself  to others at NAF’s that she is German Native American Heritage and try’s to honor her ancestors by living Native American spirituality, ...
Tanja still hasn't learned that there is no 'Native American spirituality', no generic one, but one for every nation. Also, it's in no way honoring native ancestry to go and mix native spirituality with Newage garbage like selling healing stones which she called 'Indian stones'.

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The Blackwater Band is no longer in operation, says it all, though I would have loved a headed letter saying they kicked him out and why.
As far as I can remember, the story behind this was that some ex-pat Natives living in Europe went to confront the Billingtons at a European powwow and our most talented clearvoyant (another thing he did not foresee...) flew off his handle and did not stop at verbal injuries.

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I’m so angry with them, him more than her Tanya just seems delusional
I don't think she's just delusional. If you reread this thread, you will see she came up with lots of explanations and weaseled along (and around) the questions raised here. My impression is she knows quite well what she does and who she is and isn't.

Of course, living in England makes it easy for her to claim she speaks English with a German accent because she has lived here so long (how she could believe any English person could take her 'Vee heff vayz' accent  ;D  for a Native American one escapes me). But according to her legend, English was her first language, being born in the States - just no certificate to prove this, since they allegedly lived about half a mile short of the end of the world and the USA weren't civilised enough to have any civil authorities in the vicinity to register births and deaths. She don't say... Just HTF did she ever manage to get out of the USA with her mother, or get a passport without one? Easy - she showed her German birth certificate.

Tanja also claimed (or still does?) her mother took her to Wounded Knee II as a baby of a few months. Only thing is: WK II took place in 1973 - Tanja was born in 1969 or 1968.

In other words: she has tried serving us a number of lies, and got busted with every one of them. I do agree she was delusional regarding the assumption that she could pull the wool over our eyes, but she had to realise soon enough she was running out of eyes...

Offline Defend the Sacred

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Re: Tanja Fehlauer & Francis Billington AKA Tonya & Grey Wolf
« Reply #112 on: January 21, 2016, 05:06:22 pm »
The, "I was born waaaaaaay out in NDN Country, in a (tipi, hogan, cabin, under the stars) so I don't have a birth certificate" line has been used by criminals trying to hide their record from new victims. There are predators mentioned on here who have used that kind of story to try to hide their past and true origins.
"In the Great American Indian novel, when it is finally written, all the white people wil be Indians and all the Indians will be ghosts."

Offline loudcrow

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Re: Tanja Fehlauer & Francis Billington AKA Tonya & Grey Wolf
« Reply #113 on: January 21, 2016, 06:13:11 pm »
Tanja's mother (Veronika Rossman Siegal Griffin):

http://stayfriends.berlin.de/Personen/Darmstadt/Veronika-Griffin-Rossmann-P-GF3SV-P

I am hoping Ingeborg will provide us with a translation :).

Little Crow, I am wondering if you are the same man who  gave Francis the name "Grey Wolf"?

Offline loudcrow

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Re: Tanja Fehlauer & Francis Billington AKA Tonya & Grey Wolf
« Reply #114 on: January 22, 2016, 03:43:19 am »
A link to photos of Tanja's Cherokee grandmother:

http://butterfly-whisper-spirit.com/ode%20to%20a%20mother.html

Little Crow

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Re: Tanja Fehlauer & Francis Billington AKA Tonya & Grey Wolf
« Reply #115 on: January 22, 2016, 05:12:00 am »
I came across this forum when I was looking into Tanya and GW, joined to ask questions but I’m not Native American nor have I ever said I was and not being Native American I don’t know the truth of DNA or Heritage, so I’m asking, yes I have been and go to a few powwows and enjoy the atmosphere camaraderie but I have a Celtic family tree. The name Little crow is my Celtic name not Native American so no GW name was not given to him by me.
I meet them about five years ago at an event and believed what Tanya said at the time, until GW started saying other things not matching I said I would like a headed paper from the black water band as I could then copy this to give to others its more proof to give to organizers of events along with a link to this forum as I feel they have lied about so much now they need to be exposed, as I have said earlier they are giving everyone a bad name.
If as I was told by Tanya it was her grandmother who was native American looking at the picture link sent she served as a nurse so would not be hard for her to prove her heritage as she would have birth records, work records, just shows it’s lie after lie so glad I found this forum.

Offline Ingeborg

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Re: Tanja Fehlauer & Francis Billington AKA Tonya & Grey Wolf
« Reply #116 on: January 22, 2016, 05:34:57 pm »
Tanja's mother (Veronika Rossman Siegal Griffin):

http://stayfriends.berlin.de/Personen/Darmstadt/Veronika-Griffin-Rossmann-P-GF3SV-P

There's nothing much to translate. Apart from ads for the site's services, the info provided on Veronika Griffin is just:

Veronika Griffin attended the school Schuldorf Bergstrasse - Europaschule until 1962.

Schuldorf [school village] apparently was a model school, taking up services on May 3, 1954, and combined kindergarten, residential school, primary school, special school, mixed ability classes, three forms of secondary education, vocational school.

Judging from the year the school started and the year Griffin finished, I assume she will have attended the Secondary Modern branch of it. Although nowadays this school goes from grade 5-9 (with an optional 10th grade and a qualified sec modern certificate), back in that time, Secondary Modern only provided schooling from grade 5-8. In those days, English was an optional course, no compuslory subject at Sec Modern schools.

Offline loudcrow

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Re: Tanja Fehlauer & Francis Billington AKA Tonya & Grey Wolf
« Reply #117 on: January 22, 2016, 11:45:03 pm »
Thanks for the translation, Ingeborg. As I suspected, Tanja's mother, Veronika, went to school in Germany.

Tanja's maternal grandmother is the one in the photograph. Her married name was Hermine Rossman. I am not
sure what her maiden name was but will do some digging when I have time and see if I can come up with it.
She was born in 1920 and died in 2009.

Offline Defend the Sacred

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Re: Tanja Fehlauer & Francis Billington AKA Tonya & Grey Wolf
« Reply #118 on: January 23, 2016, 04:24:34 pm »
The tangent on "Celtic", "Indian" and pretendian names has been moved here: http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=4798
"In the Great American Indian novel, when it is finally written, all the white people wil be Indians and all the Indians will be ghosts."