General > Research Needed

Luzia Krull

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Epiphany:
I've listened to about half the audio clip so far. At first she spoke in what seems to be her usual speech pattern but as she began telling the story of when she first took Santo Daime in Boston her voice changed quite a bit. Noticeably so. Entirely different speech pattern and rhythm. As if she both has regressed age wise and also as if she is pretending to be someone who hasn't spoken English her entire life. Stagy and affected.

Possibly also a sign that she isn't all that mentally stable.

Towards the end she says she recently initiated in Umbanda. Her voice is different yet again as she talks about this.

Manicman:
She seemed plenty stable to me, but yeah from my experience the Native American accent was a put on.

Defend the Sacred:
Some traditional Lakota and Dakota we are friends with were down in the countries where the tribes traditionally use Ayahuasca, and they met with traditional people from those tribes. The traditionals down there are *very* concerned about the abuse of Ayahuasca that is taking place.

Ayahuasca is one of their medicines. The safe use of it, and the ceremonies involving it, have belonged to their people for many generations. Perhaps forever. Now that it is being commercialized, the plant and the spirits are being abused. The medicine is being taken out of its traditional context and misused by pay to pray exploiters. It is also being harvested by these exploiters in an unsustainable manner - which is putting the medicines, the  traditions, indeed a huge part of these people's lifeway, in danger of extinction.

We have a number of threads on here about the abuse of Ayahuasca, and Ayahuasca tourism. Westerners who think they can and should buy access to these experiences are disrespecting tribal sovereignty. The traditional people who have inherited and maintained these ways are the ones who have the right to say how it is to be used, and when and with whom it is appropriate to use. The people who are bringing in outsiders and selling these ways are abusing the source of the medicine. If this exploitation continues, people fear the medicine will be lost.

On a related note, some of the exploiters who are selling "Ayahuasca" trips are not even dispensing Ayahuasca. There have been cases of them dosing people with other hallucinogens instead, or in addition to, plant medicines, and messing with people's minds and bodies while they are tripping.

Here at NAFPS, we have seen some of the results of this exploitation, and heard from damaged people who trusted these pay to pray types to lead them through exploitative Ayahuasca tourism. This is all very sad, and very harmful, both to the traditional people, their traditions, and the naive seekers who trust the exploiters.

educatedindian:

--- Quote from: Manicman on October 31, 2012, 11:21:53 pm ---During this time with Luzia, I met the man she talks about, Hugo, and he was actually a great guy, although he had also been drawn into Luzia's trip. I also worked with the Santo Daime which I would consider a plant spirit rather than a drug, and in all honesty I got a lot of benefit from the work with the Santo Daime. I would be dishonest if I didn't mention that the Santo Daime did me an enormous amount of good during a very messed up period of my life.

But Luzia herself was playing all sorts of games. She kept telling me that it was important that I get baptised in the Santo Daime, in order to keep away bad spirits, or become part of the Daime lineage. Again, I got a lot of benefit from the Daime, but the only real reason to go through a baptism or conversion is if you want to make it a part of your long term path. At the same time, Luzia repeatedly insisted that she had no investment in whether I chose to come to her. She also told me that she knew God and the spirits had sent me to her, which seems to contradict the no investment part.
It was a very odd situation, in that I genuinely was deriving benefit and personal healing from in depth work with spiritual forces. But Luzia herself had very little insight into the nature of my process, and in many ways seemed like a religious fanatic.
I have also heard (second hand) that the Jyoti you mentioned of Kayumari has cut ties with Luzia. Though I am interested to know why you describe Jyoti and the thirteen grandmothers as a manipulation. Most of these people I only have heard of second or third hand.

--- End quote ---

The church has been around almost a century and its practices based upon older traditions around probably for millenia. It's no surprise if it helped you, but also no surprise there might be one less than helpful clergy among that church.

We have a thread in here on the 13 grandmas. Some are genuine activists, some are not what they claim to be. The group was put together by Jyoti to give her more credibility and a better image.

Umbanda as well? That makes the list of her supposed beliefs or studied expertise to now include:
Zen, Taoism, yoga, quantum physics, kibuttzim (Zionist socialism), Vipassana meditation. "restructured families", women's groups, psychotherapy, entered in Bio-energetic therapy, "Native American rituals," spirit guides, Mother Ammachi, satanic cults, massage, Santo Daime, Kayumari, Divine Light from Heaven, living off the grid, Golden Light Chapel, and now Umbanda.

Epiphany:
The audio lecture is from Nov 2011. No talk of legalities, safety issues, or the drug bust.

Towards the end she says "I myself also work in the tradition of Umbanda" and goes on to say that she went through a spiritual initiation to receive her Orixás: Oxum, Obaluaye, Oxalá (my spelling choices might not be accurate). She doesn't say who initiated her or where the ceremony took place.

Her speech pattern is extra labored as she describes this. Admittedly she'd been talking for quite awhile at this point, but the labored speech sounds like she is imitating someone else or at least her bad version of someone else. I assume she does this to sound extra spiritual and authentic, but it really backfires.

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