Author Topic: Have questions about a new "cherokee medicineman"  (Read 10742 times)

Offline Emmia

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Have questions about a new "cherokee medicineman"
« on: July 04, 2009, 06:41:50 pm »
Hello everyone,
long time no see. I haven't been around for a while. I hope everyone is doing good and enjoying summer.

Got a question from friends regarding someone who wants to come to Sweden to teach.
Personal comment: we need teaching just like everyone else but we would prefer the real thang!!!!

His homepage is in German which I don't speak even though i get the main idea. What I see first of all is celtic and a German version of schaman which to me brings up a very big and very red flag.   http://www.indianermedizinmann.com

Anyone who's heard about this guy before?

Take care,

Mia

Offline Ric_Richardson

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Re: Have questions about a new "cherokee medicineman"
« Reply #1 on: July 04, 2009, 07:21:46 pm »
Tansi;

I cannot say anything for or against this apparently young man.  I did notice that his website speaks of ancestry from the Appalachian area, but the music in the background is about Lakota.  In my own Culture, we have music, even contemporary music, that is about our people, so I can only wonder why he is mixing other Cultures into his advertising.
Ric


Offline Defend the Sacred

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Re: Have questions about a new "cherokee medicineman"
« Reply #2 on: July 04, 2009, 07:27:19 pm »
Oh, he may be young but he's not new to defrauding people. We have quite a lot on him here.

Start with: http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=948.0

Then, if that's not sickening enough, use the search function on "Firewalker" for yet more mentions of the appalling things this guy has done. Don't forget to check out the photos.

Offline Emmia

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Re: Have questions about a new "cherokee medicineman"
« Reply #3 on: July 04, 2009, 08:58:22 pm »
Thanks for the info, I have checked out the posts in the earlier thread as well. Does not sound good at all!
I have emailed my friends who asked about him and forwarded a brief of the information. And told them that it's their decision, depending on if they want someone genuine or not.

Take care,

Mia

Offline BlackWolf

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Re: Have questions about a new "cherokee medicineman"
« Reply #4 on: July 05, 2009, 01:56:26 am »
Here's a translation of whats on the homepage of the "Medizinlehrer" site.  I just used one of the Google Translation tools.  Just go to the main google website and click on "Language Tools" if anyone wants to translate the rest.  The translation is not perfect, but it is close and you can get the idea.  Anyways, what a fraud!  As if we Cherkoees don't have enough to worry about here in the United States, we have these frauds running around Europe misrepresenting us!


Quote
TURTLE QUVTLE HEVGOLO WINDS, was born in 1966. He has Irish and Native American ancestors. His grandmother was full-blooded Cherokee. His Native American ancestors lived in the Buffalo Mountains (Appalachian Mountains) in eastern Kentucky. Very close to his hometown once led the "path of tears" over. Winds Turtle father came from Ireland and was in the Celtic culture overgrown. For both, the ancestral sacred Mother Earth at the center.

So Turtle Winds shamanic skills from two different worlds and cultures inherited. Both the Celtic way, and the American Indian way of communicating with nature. Turtle Winds grew up in an Indian family in the mountains of the Appalachians on. His grandmother taught him everything about plants, herbs and medicine.

Winds are skills Turtle: Dream Interpretations, herbal medicine and various shamanistic practices. He is a ceremonial head, meditation teacher, practiced various massage techniques, works with energy, runs Schwitzhütten, heals and guides Vision Search.

For 25 years he traveled through the entire United States and organized Native American Schwitzhüttenzeremonien. As a descendant of two old world cultures, he was able to his talents in shamanic understanding of Mother Earth to convey. Winds Turtle is not only a talented orator, but also an expert in the field of Native American ceremonies.

He studied with the best Native American medicine men and medicine women. Winds Turtle led many American Indian ceremonies, and is still in contact with Medizinmleuten to show his skills again and again to expand.

Disclamer / Legal Disclaimer: The intention of this site is of spiritual nature, a medicine man or medicine teacher is a spiritual teacher. Here are given only general information, people with medical problems should consult a doctor. This website is an American website on a U.S. server and is governed by the laws of the United States. The operators of this site are also not responsible for and can not be liable for the content of external links.

Offline Emmia

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Re: Have questions about a new "cherokee medicineman"
« Reply #5 on: July 05, 2009, 06:29:44 pm »
Thanks for the translation!

One thing that buffles me is that if he was born in 1966 (43 years of age right now) and he travelled around the States for 25 years arranging sweats and other cermonies.... would anyone go to a sweat that has an 18-year old guy who's responsible unless he has a major reputation?

My take is that someone who claims to be an expert of Native American cermonies is a fake. As a matter of fact, anyone who's rep comes from ads instead of word of mouth and pure respect is a fake.

Take care,

Mia

Mizheekay

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Re: Have questions about a new "cherokee medicineman"
« Reply #6 on: October 13, 2009, 12:34:45 am »
Well --  even though it is'nt that new [here], I'll take the chance to make myself visible for the first time here...
and send my greetings to everybody  :)

With the translation.... you could have choosen the 'easy way' =
http://www.nativeamericanindianassocation.com/  {Luxembourg}
>> but be aware =  the original 'english' causes some giggles as well ~
especially with posts in groups and forums !!

If it is'nt for "entainment" this man should deserve 'sympathy' !
(instead of the Bear, he now wear a "Warbonnet" like those you find at ebay)

You may also visit:
http://www.myspace.com/indiancamping

and if you have'nt enough try these:
http://vivid-living.ning.com/profile/indianerfire
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/dir/william/firewalker
http://www.meetup.com/de/members/5697147/
http://www.meetup.com/de/members/2556859/
>>http://photos1.meetupstatic.com/photos/member/9/4/a/3/highres_998051.jpeg
>>http://photos3.meetupstatic.com/photos/member/5/a/6/d/highres_1103149.jpeg
http://www.meetup.com/de/members/4558860/  {{ yeap = the third 'profile' }}
>>http://photos2.meetupstatic.com/photos/member/b/1/b/b/highres_4425499.jpeg
http://www.justlanded.com/deutsch/Luxemburg/Kleinanzeigen/Sprach-Tandems/native-american-indian-club-of-luxembourg
http://www.topix.net/forum/world/germany/TVLUBBAN7CR9ENSQK
http://www.topiccraze.com/topic?topic=naturismineurope (All the Rage #5)
http://www.care2.com/c2c/group/nude
http://www.interpals.net/firespeaks?&unum=&query=&from=search

=>  yet I can't assure that every single link is still valid...
      since all of them are a result of my searching started at the beginning of 2009.

No, I'm not in a lack 'better things to do'... but this poor person appeared (again) on my desktop during that time... yet with the -allmost similar- german version of his website - where he claimed:
Thus he [Sun Bear, aka Vincent LaDuke..**] can live by Firewalker and he can teach other people by Firewalker. --- while that specific page was taken down after questions were forwarded !
(funny though:  the page {.../sunbear.html} still belong to the german website, while no link is visible).

He (meanwhile, I 'call' him Firecracker) --still-- use many names in social networks around Germany, Europe, but even within the US. He's a "member" and/or initiator of several Groups within networks and forums. He (I should say: his "office-manager" Yvonne who is german) also create fake-profils / accounts within this groups and forums. Bad though:  he MISuse the name of a real living person of age 80+ from the US, who visited Germany last year for the first time. (calling him a friend) This poor? Elder has no idea about Firecrackers behavior [virtuallky though] but I learned that he became informed.

Much more to share about him  /  his 'activities...  yet I unfortunately did'nt had the chance to meet him eye-to-eye (a chance during early February passed, after he withdraw his presence just one day prior to an schedulled 'event' in the mid-south [for me] of Germany  :o
(meanwhile a 'carpool' is requested within a german forum to enable ppl to meet him by the next chance - lol)

So -- yet to return to more seriosity --  MIA...  for sure it's your swedish friends decision ---
while they're well advised to close the doors and shut off the light when it comes to Mr. Firecracker !


**  Ouch... yes:  Sun Bear has been a topic here before... but I prefere to grant him peace -in Spirit- !  IF he'd hurt? anyone... I ask for healing since the 17th anniversary of his physical passing was seen.
And it is therefore that I recommend [!] to "update" lists (and topics)...
I can't see any effort of never ending repetitons of 'fraud-warnings' towards humans who passed...
passed long time ago in cases !

And while I am here =
PLEASE,  avoid stereotypes like "crazy europeans" [topic] - or "stupid germans" [created / topic?] !!!!

Remember:  whenever one say "Indian" - refering to north/south US indigenous residents....  a great, emotional yelling occur !
Guess:  "Europe" is created by Nations and 'Tribes' ---  even Germany (i.e.) is / was created by 'Tribes' !
.. you only need to google.... and your 'knowledge' increases beyond 'words' !

So.. yes:   I'm of "german" origin (upon my understanding)... which should be said within another forum {introduction}?!  Well, a good idea though - for I have more to say !

Blessings be ~
Mizheekay *
 
(( * Ojib:  Turtle  // Ger:  Schildkröte  ==>>> where's the one ndn, who can pronounce the german word (or my birth-given name) 'correctly' ?? ))   :D

Mizheekay

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Re: Have questions about a new "cherokee medicineman"
« Reply #7 on: October 13, 2009, 12:55:28 am »
sorry - I failed =  pls read:

".... also create fake-profils / accounts within this groups and forums...
to "confirm" his own integrity !"  (yet with the very same "unique" english....)

... weird


But... here's one for the (my) night =
> a "Cherokee" response upon my request for 'Woodland Duck Clan"

(qu)
"I allways said if it looks like a duck and quaks like a duck it must be a duck.."
(/qu)

 ;)

Renee

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Re: Have questions about a new "cherokee medicineman"
« Reply #8 on: October 13, 2009, 06:29:02 am »
sorry - I failed =  pls read:

"....  'Woodland Duck Clan"---

in a german forum somebody posted his bio...is a fake...

Mitzeekay, can you translate,thanks

(hier ein Teil seiner Biographie:www.indianermedizinmann.com)
Turte Winds stammt aus dem Woodland Duck Clan der Cherokee. Dies war einst der Medizinclan der Cherokee. Der Woodland Duck Clan floh während der Trails of Tears in die Berge und lebte nie im Reservat. Da die Cherokee sehr verstreut lebten, gibt es noch heute viele Cherokee Kommunen ausserhalb des Reservates, die nie Teil des Reservates waren. Neben dem großen Reservat in Oklahoma, gibt es noch viele weitere Cherokee Kommunen und kleinere selbständige Reservate auf Stadt und Landebene...
ANTWORT:
Unsinn! Woher hast du den das nun? Erstens hat die Cherokee Nation in Oklahoma KEIN Reservat. In Oklahoma gibt es naemlich ausser dem Osage Reservat KEIN Reservat. Das liegt an der Geschichte Oklahomas, das einst insgesamt als "Indian Territory" gedacht war, sozusagen als "Indianerstaat", bis die Siedler auch dorthin wollten und es in einer Art von "Rennen" freigegeben wurde (siehe Film mit Tom Cruise, fuer diejenigen denen Geschichtsbuecher/-websites dazu fremd sind  ). Es gibt auch keine "vielen kleinen selbstaendigen Reservate", sondern es gibt in ein oder zwei Bundesstaaten Gruppierungen die auf einzelstaatlicher Ebene anerkannt sind, z.T. aber trotzdem umstritten sind. Dass nicht alle Cherokee den Trail of Tears mitgemacht haben ist bekannt, aber hoch umstritten ist, ob deren Nachfahren in Stammesform weiterlebten oder aber sich zertreuten und in der weissen Bevoelkerung voellig aufgingen.

more information here:

http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=948.0




Renee

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Re: Have questions about a new "cherokee medicineman"
« Reply #9 on: October 13, 2009, 09:24:19 am »

(hier ein Teil seiner Biographie:www.indianermedizinmann.com)
Turte Winds stammt aus dem Woodland Duck Clan der Cherokee. Dies war einst der Medizinclan der Cherokee. Der Woodland Duck Clan floh während der Trails of Tears in die Berge und lebte nie im Reservat. Da die Cherokee sehr verstreut lebten, gibt es noch heute viele Cherokee Kommunen ausserhalb des Reservates, die nie Teil des Reservates waren. Neben dem großen Reservat in Oklahoma, gibt es noch viele weitere Cherokee Kommunen und kleinere selbständige Reservate auf Stadt und Landebene...
ANTWORT:
Unsinn! Woher hast du den das nun? Erstens hat die Cherokee Nation in Oklahoma KEIN Reservat. In Oklahoma gibt es naemlich ausser dem Osage Reservat KEIN Reservat. Das liegt an der Geschichte Oklahomas, das einst insgesamt als "Indian Territory" gedacht war, sozusagen als "Indianerstaat", bis die Siedler auch dorthin wollten und es in einer Art von "Rennen" freigegeben wurde (siehe Film mit Tom Cruise, fuer diejenigen denen Geschichtsbuecher/-websites dazu fremd sind  ). Es gibt auch keine "vielen kleinen selbstaendigen Reservate", sondern es gibt in ein oder zwei Bundesstaaten Gruppierungen die auf einzelstaatlicher Ebene anerkannt sind, z.T. aber trotzdem umstritten sind. Dass nicht alle Cherokee den Trail of Tears mitgemacht haben ist bekannt, aber hoch umstritten ist, ob deren Nachfahren in Stammesform weiterlebten oder aber sich zertreuten und in der weissen Bevoelkerung voellig aufgingen.


website: www.indianermedizinmann.com
 
......he came of the woodland duck clan fled during the Trails of Tears into the mountains and never lived in the reservation. Since the cherokee lived very scattered there are this very day many Cherokee municipalitis outside of the reservation. Apart from THE LARGE RESERVATION IN OKLAHOMA, there are still many further Cherokee to municipalitis and smaller independent reservation on city and land level............
 
Somebody wrote in a german forum:
Answer: Nonsense! From where do you have that now? First of all the CHEROKEE nation in OKLAHOMA DOES NOT HAVE A RESERVATION. In Oklahoma there is no reservation expect the Osage reservation. That is because of the history of Oklahoma, which "once altogether as Indian territory was meant, as it was "indianstate", until the settlers wanted also there and it "in a kind of run" one released (see film with tom cruise, for those to those history books/webstis in addition are strange). There are also none many small independent Reservations, but it enters two federal states groupings in or on level of the individual nations is appreciative, partially however is nevertheless disputed the fact that not all cherokee took part in the trail of tears is well-known but is highly disputed, wether ther descendant in master form lived on or however itself and came up in the white population.
 
translation (bablefish translation)

Mizheekay

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Re: Have questions about a new "cherokee medicineman"
« Reply #10 on: October 13, 2009, 04:21:38 pm »
Renee --  I'm very sorry, but there's allmost no time available for me to do 'longer' translations !!
( but I may respond to your pers. message tonight ?!  ;) )

Well - the english 'bio' of this "funny" person was on below site..
while one can read the following at mySpace:

www.nativeamericanindianassocation.com is taking a break.
Am [posted] 28. August 2009

= ???   ;D

Nevertheless...  we should'nt pay much more attention upon him....
so far eveerything was said !

Blessings ~

Mizheekay

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Re: Have questions about a new "cherokee medicineman"
« Reply #11 on: October 13, 2009, 11:23:52 pm »
OK -- one more time...  ;)

Maybe there's some confusion (easily though....) coming along with websites ?!

the ..nativeamericanindianassocation.com/  (the one, that is "taking a break")
is / WAS the english version of the -german- site: ..indianermedizinmann.com ----
where the bio of Firecracker got an own page.

Yet -- someone in the already mentioned german forum "saved" and pasted the english bio on Jan. 21. 2009..  :D

>
QUVTLE HEVGOLO TURTLE WINDS, Firewalker was born in 1966. He is of mixed bloodline (Native American and Irish Celtic). His grandmother was Cherokee. She comes from the Buffalo Mountains. His native ancestors have been living for centuries in the Appalachian Mountains of Eastern Kentucky. Once the Trail of Tears led through that land. Turtle Wind‘s dad came from Ireland and was a Celtic druid. So he inherited the shamanic abilites of two worlds and two cultures, which both are in intensive connection with Mother Nature.
Turtel Winds leans more into the Native American spiritual path, having grown up in a Native American family in Appalachian Mountains and having been trained by his grandmother in the art of herbs and medicine.
Turtel Winds is skilled in the art of omens, dream interpretation, herbal medicine and different shamanistic practices. He is a ceremonialist, meditation instructor, practices different massage technics, energy work, sweatlodge (inpi) ceremonies, healing and vision quests,
Turtel Winds traveled around the United States for 25 years {sic}, performing Native American sweatlodge ceremonies. Being of mixed blood, having ancestors of two different worlds with indigenous cultures, he has increased his talents in shamanic understanding of Mother Earth. Turtel Winds is not only a talented speaker, but also an expert in the field of Native American ceremonies.
During his journey he had the great opportunity to study and practice with some of the best Native American medicine people, living during his life time. Turtel Winds conducted countless Native American ceremonies that were taught to him from childhood to this present time. He dedicates his work to all the generous people who shared their precious knowledge with him and especially to the Native American Indians.
<

{{ somewhere... in the unknown depth of my pc.. I saved those parts about the "Woodland Duck Clan" -
    ... I need to search but would believe that the shared 'bablefish translation' is good enough to get a sense about, how his mind? is working ?! }}

 
But still...  the "friends - site" is online -
http://www.nativeamericanfriends.com/   where one find the very same addy under *contacts' - Mr. Firecracker use (along with several others)


I just 'read back' in the "William Jervis" topic.... where "indianer" spoke for *his son* [17-1-09 # 9:41:13 AM] ----  yet clearly understood it should be "He Wo Knows".
Well - it was written by Mr. Firecracker (or initiated by him) ! 
The only reason I bring up this again is to point out that "He Who Knows" {IYE TUWE SLOWAY = ??} is a real person.... with no clue what Firecracker is posting by using his name !  After 50 years of rodeo riding [?] he might be good trained with horses, but necessarely not with the internet. He even might not know that there are vids at YouTube - showing him shaking hands with a few in an empty room {'nature conference 2008' -- the first time, when he was invited to Europe} etc. ?!  How sad is this ??

And again:  there are several MORE "Profiles" in the cyberspace, pretending to "know" Mr. Firecracker... and his integrity - while those blessed *Indians* can effort an e-mail account with the -german- telecom, which IS'NT free as Hotmail, Yahoo etc. is !!  LOL

Enough !


Oh NO.....

May I ask....  why is "cherokee medicineman" still in this section ???
IF one deserve to be called 'fraud'... it is Mr. Firecracker, aka Firewalker, aka Turtle Winds, aka William Jervis, aka William Burchett, aka ~ aka ~
(( gosh -- I must ask him to pay ME for all the time I spent meanwhile ! ))

done ~   ;D

Offline Ingeborg

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Re: Have questions about a new "cherokee medicineman"
« Reply #12 on: October 14, 2009, 08:39:08 am »
May I ask....  why is "cherokee medicineman" still in this section ???
IF one deserve to be called 'fraud'... it is Mr. Firecracker, aka Firewalker, aka Turtle Winds, aka William Jervis, aka William Burchett, aka ~ aka ~

Oh, you may ask, but using the board's search function may have answered the question: Jervis has been in the fraud section for years.

http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=948.0

You just found an inquiry which did not get moved to the main thread on Jervis.

Renee

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Re: Have questions about a new "cherokee medicineman"
« Reply #13 on: October 14, 2009, 02:59:32 pm »
... 'Woodland Duck Clan"...


is firewalker the last member of the woodland duck clan of the Cherokee???

http://www.forumromanum.de/member/forum/entry_ubb.user_288051.2.1106205530.1106205530.1.native_american_power_training_from_woodland_duck_clan-indianer_nordamerikas.html

native american power training from woodland duck clan, 31 Dec. 2008 15:37 

indianer sprituality training

native american indian travels europe teaching

the ways of woodland duck clan

anyone wanting to learn these rare ways

oyisofirewalker@yahoo.com
 

Offline Ingeborg

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Re: Have questions about a new "cherokee medicineman"
« Reply #14 on: October 14, 2009, 03:29:29 pm »

is firewalker the last member of the woodland duck clan of the Cherokee???

Jervis is the first, the last, and the only member.

The Cherokee do not have a Woodland Duck clan.