Author Topic: Harold "White Horse" Thompson  (Read 39029 times)

Offline Ingeborg

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Re: Harold "White Horse" Thompson
« Reply #15 on: April 14, 2010, 10:50:02 pm »

The name of the person is Winfried Alessi Narr, sometimes Winni/Vinni/Vinnie, and he seems to change between the family names of Alessi and Narr. Narr is a German, or as some sites say, a German-Italian.

There is one site advertising ceremonies with both Narr and Thompson:

Winni Alessi Narr

Recognized medicine man with the Lakota people, lives in the USA, in South Dakota.

He is a German-Italian and married to Karen Swan, a Lakota woman. At the age of 15, he was adopted by a Lakota family and since then has sought knowledge with the elders of the Lakota, and found it. For him, it is important to acquire as much unadulterated knowledge as possible, to pass it on in the same way.

He is a Sun Dance leader and Yuwipi man.

Besides Archie Fire Lame Deer, they also claim Harold Thompson as their teacher:

Harold White Horse

Lakota, medicine man of his people, lives in the USA, South Dakota.

He teaches in a wonderful, light and simple and very humozrous way. Much of this knowledge he gained by accompanying medicine men as a ceremonial singer for 20 years, and he continuously seeks to broaden his knowledge with the elders, of whom not many still exist.

Harold lives at White River with his wife Elva, and there tries to keep up the ancient knowledge, and to introduce children and youths to this knowledge. He realizes this at Rosebud reservation, and also at Pispiza Wounspe Project in the Black Hills.

He brings us his knowledge through ceremonies, sweatlodges, and the sun dance.

This is the site of a naturopath claiming to have been taught by Narr:

Further training with Rhea Powers, sweatlodges Inipi Ceremony in the Lakota tradition with Thomas Winkler, John Fire Lame Deer, Vinnie Narr and others. Vision quest.

Apparently Narr seems to be interested in as little publicity as possible as an alleged medicine man. The same seems true for other endeavours, as e.g. a charity he claims to run.

Pispiza Wounspe is a project founded by Winni Narr. They got a site, but there's nothing much than a note the site was under construction. I'm not certain about how long construction work may take, but this note has been up for a looong time already.
You can click at two links which will lead you to page 1 and 2 of their flyer:

The name of Pispiza Wounspe also comes up with an entry of Narr at LinkedIn, but despite all these nice claims of PW being a youth project, this sounds different:

Vinny Alessi

Owner, Pispiza Wounspe, Inc
Rapid City, South Dakota Area
Vinny Alessi’s Experience
Pispiza Wounspe, Inc
(Retail industry)
Currently holds this position

Vinny Alessi’s Contact Settings
Interested In:
job inquiries
expertise requests
business deals
reference requests
getting back in touch

There is a description of the project, basically the text of a flyer which gives quite a different impression of the project than Narr's 'retail industry':

Pispiza, South Dakota USA
Help and support for children and youths of the Lakota people

Project to support and keep up the tradition and language of the Lakota Indians

German-Italian Vinny Alessi Narr and his wife Karen are the founds of Pispiza. Karen Swan is a descendant of the Lakota people. She grew up at Rosebud Indian Reservation in South Dakota, USA.

The population at Rosebud reservation amounts to about 10,000 enrolled members. There is no infrastructure, no job possibilities and no perspectives for a future for young adults. This causes despair and abuse of drugs and alcohol with many young persons. Children and youths suffer most at the reservation. Exhaustion, neglect, sexual, mental and physical abuse are shared by many Lakota youths. Furthermore, the religion of the Lakota is dying. The younger people do not speak their language and do not take part in any ceremonies any longer.
Pispiza Project predominantly aims at the children of the Lakota Indians and works for a dialogue between the different cultures.

"Pispiza" (Prairie Dog)
Old songs and lyrics are translated and Lakota language is getting taught. Traditional tipi camps introduce the children to their own culture and help to increase their self esteem. Pispiza is built up at two places. A school at White River is being built which will also offer a home for children in need. Producing Indian craft and teaching agricultural abilities mean to ensure self-reliance.

In the Black Hills which are a sacred place for the Lakota, a patch of land has been bought. By doing spiritual activities coming from the tradition of the Lakota, it is a place of emotional and physical healing for the Lakota. In order not to lose bordering land to other buyers not respecting the earth, the animals, or the humans, monthly payments of USD 900 have to be paid. Donations are very welcome.

Pispiza is open to all people. Only by cooperation, our world will become a better and safer place for our children and the following generations. It teaches compassion for other human beings and a better understanding for animals and plants.

Teaching a bit of farm work, huh. Sounds like a repetition of Carlisle....

Offline merci

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Re: Harold "White Horse" Thompson
« Reply #16 on: April 21, 2010, 09:28:01 pm »
Thanks Ingeborg for your good information and well done research.

It almost sounds like as if that Vinni-type has something to hide....

I´ve done some further research myself and found out this:
Vinny sold a pipe to his followers in Germany for 15.000,-€ - claiming it was Sitting Bulls pipe. I´ve been told that its just a regular pipe he bought on ebay.
Pispiza is another strange thing. People who have been there and looked at it, say that there is nothing going on. But he is still collecting money for it.

This is new:

The video shows Harold Thompson White Horse ( that´s what a medicine man and chief looks like in reality).

Strange that Harold Thompson White Horse wants to preserve Lakota ceremonial artifacts for Lakota people - after he himself has been seeling exactly such items to non-Indians for years!
Even his "German shepherd" Spak Kreutzer has been openly selling such items for him at the sundance in Germany which Harold Thompson ran. Everybody who was there knows this, he didn´t even try to hide it.

Offline Cetan

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Re: Lakota-ceremonial chief Harold Thompson Whitehorse ON TOUR 2010
« Reply #17 on: April 21, 2010, 11:41:42 pm »
Lakota-ceremonial chief Harold Thompson Whitehorse ON TOUR 2010

...just found this:

After his winter break Lakota-ceremonial chief "Harold Thompson Whitehorse" (Rosebud reservation) is on money tour in Europe again. He starts out with a workshop in Denmark from May 14th-16th 2010.

Program:Lecturing about Lakota spirituality and culture and conducting sweat lodge and lowanpi ceremonies, each night.
Costs: 1500,- Kronen = 275,- Dollar each person not including the "Lowanpiceremonierne" -  Lowanpi ceremonie.

A few weeks ago he did a fundraising for needy people on Rosebud. Does anybody know if he passed the money he raised on to the people? I also heard that he made a lot of money conducting sundances in Germany the last couple of years. He is said to be associated with a certain Vini Alexi Narh an Italian or Hispanic who also conducts Lakota ceremonies in Germany. Who knows more? Does anybody know more about that guy?

I contacted Alfred Boneshirt in St Francis and he has not heard of Harold distributing any funds on Rosebud.  I watched the video and I do not know what spiritual bundles of Chipps he is talking about; the descendents,the Chipps family, is living near Wamblee and they shpould be the ones to have any surviving bundles and have the say of what should happen to it.

Offline merci

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Re: Harold "White Horse" Thompson
« Reply #18 on: April 28, 2010, 03:10:48 pm »

I agree with you and I wonder where Mr. Thompson got all these sacred items from and why they are with him and not with the rightful owners. Or did they all give them to him or have they legally sold them to him? I hope Mr. Thompson will explain his right to have these items.
As far as I know the repatriation law requires such items to be given to the descendents of the original owners. That raises the question: Has this already happened? And have these people given these items to Mr. Thompson or has he acquired those items in some questionable or immoral manner?
It would be interesting to hear the opinion of the Chipps and other families who´s ancestral medicines Mr. Thompson claims to own. (There was a link explaining the project, in which Mr. Thompson claimed possession of sacred items not only Chipps but also Crazy Horse, Gawl, Rain in the face and others as well as other objects “too sensitive to talk about” – whatever that means!)

I hope this fundraising thing was for real. If it was just a rip-off (of both Germans and Indians) it would seriously draw into question Mr. Thompsons claim of working for the benefit of his people.

Offline MrPiz

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Re: Harold "White Horse" Thompson
« Reply #19 on: April 28, 2010, 06:27:53 pm »
I have met Vinny Narr, though I dont know much of him. He is of Italian and swiss or german decend. He speaks Italian, German, Englisch and Lakota fluently. He and his wife - Karen Swan - own a shop in Hill City SD. They both very kind persons. I dont see them fit into the picture showed here.
Dont know. Maybe, you people from this area just go by and talk to them... I dont belive in them being as bad and greedy for money.
I dont belive that anyone who comes to meetings with people like John Fire Jr. for instance would pay 15.000 for a chanupa, no matter from whom it supposedly was. At least this Information must be a hoax, belive me. No one in germany would pay so much money for participating in a Sun Dance, sweat lodge, Vision  Quest or seminar as reportet early in this thread, this you can sincerly belive me to.
I know there is a so called Vision dance in Toscany, Italy. This whole thing became a joke, but people go there. They charge about 1.500 Eur for two weeks, including organic food.

Swan's Organic Market
Trading Post 243 Elm St
Hill City 57745

Got the adress from:

Walk your talk

Offline merci

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Re: Harold "White Horse" Thompson
« Reply #20 on: May 19, 2010, 04:42:34 pm »
Dear MrPiz,
after some further research, I can assure you that the information about the alleged Sitting Bull - pipe is not a hoax, actually it is a fact well known in certain spiritual circles in Germany. It is only unclear wether said pipe was really Sitting Bull`s (most likely not, though) and how much exactly was paid for it (even though it was certainly a substantial amount - information varies between 10000 and 17000, either dollars or euros).
This pipe was purchased by the same people, who have paid Thompson and Narr substantial amounts of money in the past for conducting sundances in Germany and they have been explicitly secretive about how much they paid them (they even refused to tell the dancers, wich made some of them reasonably angry).
That may be the reason why the exact price of the alleged Sitting Bull - pipe is uncertain, but the deal as such is definetly not.

Besides, if the Vision - dance in Italy turned out to be a joke, yet people are willing to pay 1500 euro for it, than how can we assume, that followers of John Fire jr., or Thompson and Narr, or anyone else, would not be willing to pay lots of money for pipes or participation in seminars or various sorts of ceremonies?

And expierience shows, that people craving for spiritual advancment are usually very willing (and very much able) to pay up, if they are lead to believe that their desires ::) will be met, their dreams fulfilled.

Research indicates that this even goes as far as selling / purchasing the right, power or ability to conduct Lowanpi and Yuwipi ceremonies! Apparently, many people are aware of this and feel somewhat uneasy about it, but are lacking the courage or sufficient knowledge to speak up against such practices.
Seems like money is the bottom line of spirituality, and to believe anything else is just plain naivite.

Offline samsara1902

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Re: Harold "White Horse" Thompson
« Reply #21 on: August 26, 2014, 02:17:13 am »
hello, do you know if vinnie alles Narr gives yuwipi in germany ? thank you so much for your help... :)

Offline Defend the Sacred

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Re: Harold "White Horse" Thompson
« Reply #22 on: August 26, 2014, 02:32:06 am »
"samsara1902" please go to the Member Introductions section and introduce yourself. Thanks.

Offline Cetan

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Re: Harold "White Horse" Thompson
« Reply #23 on: August 28, 2019, 09:50:55 pm »
Well I just found out this past weekend that Harold Whitehorse Thompson has a group of followers in Michigan, they bought land for him in the Upper Peninsula and he runs a Sundance there.

Offline ska

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Re: Harold "White Horse" Thompson
« Reply #24 on: August 28, 2019, 10:24:25 pm »
so creepy.

Here he is in a video calling himself a "subchief" of the Rosebud Sioux and saying he is considered a spiritual authority.  ;D ;D ;D ;D

says he's got a bundle that he wants to take apart and explain the articles within.

just creepy.

Offline ska

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Re: Harold "White Horse" Thompson
« Reply #25 on: August 28, 2019, 10:27:53 pm »
oops sorry, I think that vid was already in the thread. 

Offline Cetan

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Re: Harold "White Horse" Thompson
« Reply #26 on: October 02, 2020, 12:44:10 am »
I have heard more about his so called Sundance in Michigan. They used a birch tree, not a cottonwood and Harold was selling eagle feathers and fans to some of his followers. The dance was run by and Italian and a white man that Harold made a supposed yuwipi man and taught him how to untie the leather thongs and shake the gourds so it would appear as if the spirits were there

Offline Sparks

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Re: Harold "White Horse" Thompson
« Reply #27 on: June 25, 2022, 12:09:42 am »
American Indian Chief Performs Healing Ceremony for Upper West Siders

Earlier in 2007 there was already a thread about Harold "White Horse" Thompson:
[American Indian Chief Performs Healing Ceremony for Upper West Siders]