Mary Thunder's bunch

[raven]

After looking at the list of ministers. Being in IL. I will see what I can find out about those that live here that are in her group. If I can obtain the info on those living here I believe I can set up a"meeting "with those here in IL.

[raven]

P.S. k wesho-baur. So that is how your mother taught you to be, disrespectful to elders. I believe a huge apology is owed to Joseph. Good thing you're not in my house, you would have gotten thumped on the head. So go out and be a wagon burner, but don't dsrespect elders in the process.
Not only a apology, but you need to send a bundle to him. If you don't know what I mean go ask an elder.

[k.wesho-bauer]

Al,

I see now how this board has become a public forum anyone can post and those who are exploiting our ways can claim to be who ever they want.

k. wesho-bauer

[raven]

You have missed my point entirely. Read again what I wrote. It is not about Mary Thunder's group it is your actions, No they are not right in what they do, however you need to learn how to respect elders that are trying to tell you something. They are elders for a reason. Even if you disagree with an elder, never never speak to them in the way you did. That tells me you are not prepared to deal with anyone. If you can't deal with an elder, who can you deal with. Do you know what traditional people are? If not go find out. I'll say this one more time, apology and a bundle, ok. That's what a real NDN would do.
Don't use Mary Thunder's group as your excuse for being disrespectful to an elder.

[Barnaby_McEwan]

I think it might be time to let this discussion cool off a little.

[yellowthunder_bolt]

Barnaby,

I'm not sure what you are referring to here. I do understand Ravens reference to Elders. It is our tradition as an American Indian to always respect, honor and defend our Elders, in fact to say nothing  and be silent speaks loud and clear in it's self and dishonors our Elders which is never stood for. Are you suggesting that honoring an Elder here is not to be spoken ??

While we can discuss and debate all the ugliness we post and read here and I must say there is a lot of Sh... tossed back and forth, the exposers of these groups are in most part being very effective. However it seems that when an American Indian tries to teach the right way from the wrong ways they should "cool off". Raven is of the Walking-Stick family, Cherokee. If you check all the threads you will see that. In fact there are a lot of American Indians on this site with a lot of wisdom. While I am Tsalagi, I will nver quite learning.

Just wanted a clarification. Also the group refered to in Arkansaw, is that the Ridge group we have talked about? The guest never said or I simply missed it.

I feel this group with Mary Thunders group, perhaps may have guess on line to draw attention away from the real discussion, seems there is a lot of smoke screens here at times.

Just my 2 cents......                       Wado Thomas

[Barnaby_McEwan]

Hi Thomas; thanks for your input. I wasn't talking particularly to Raven when I made that remark, and I'm sorry if I've caused anyone offense by it.

I was just concerned that people's remarks were becoming un-necessarily personal.

[educatedindian]

K. and Thomas, as much as I respect both of you and your opinions, I think you misunderstood what was being said. I don't see any sign of anyone being part of Mary Thunder's bunch, or defending them. Just the opposite, I know both Joseph and Raven have taken on their share of exploiters before.

Before either of you take my words to be on the side of one or the other, I just want to be clear that I'm just hoping everyone reads posts more carefully. I honestly don't know how this became so personal so quickly.

[raven]

K wesho-baur,
If I may I would like to address the issue of my posting. In it when I asked you if you mother taught you to be disrespectful. That was not a personal attack on your mother. My comment was based on I believe on the most part we are a reflection of our upbringing, however I do know that is not always the case, ? what I should have added to that comment was...... if this is not how you were taught, then when and where did you learn disrespect?
So if there are no more misunderstandings I would like to leave it at that. ?  Thank you

[JosephSWM]

Here is a letter that was sent to someone who passed it on to me. This 'barn' is in Frederick, MD.
 and this took place this year.



Dear Relatives - We are all off to Vision Quest at the Ranch this weekend, but just wanted to send out a reminder of the upcoming Yuwipi healing ceremony with Chief Richard Grimes at the Barn on Saturday, March 25.  The lodge should start at around sundown, but all are welcome to start arriving around 3-4 p.m. to help with lodge and help our healees make their prayer ties.
 
Once again, a reminder to all that, though this ceremony is open to all, we are coming together to support and pray for the healing of those who have specifically asked for a healing.  There is a protocol one must go thru when asking for a healing, so if you are interested in asking for one, you must contact us ahead of time.
 
For those of you who have never attended a Yuwipi, we ask that you please let us know so we can send you a little write-up about what to expect, what to bring, etc.  We remind everyone to bring sweat clothes (long cotton dresses for women, long shorts, cutoffs or bathing suits for men) and remind all women that the appropriate attire for the Yuwipi is a dress or skirt (below the knee) and a sarong or shawl to wrap around your waist.  Any women who are moon time (menstruation) are welcome to attend, but will be unable to enter lodge or Yuwipi, though we welcome your participation!  Please do let us know when you arrive if you are on your moon, so we can give you clear instructions.
 
We remind to everyone to please bring a covered dish (made with lots of love and enough to feed a large group) to share for the feast and we are also making a special request for rocks, if any of you can also bring!
 
The Chief will be in town for a while after the Yuwipi and is available for any small or quick construction jobs (to help support his program, Future Seed), as well as give estimates for larger jobs that can be done later.  If you are interested, please call 301-834-7373 or email me.
 
Please do keep in mind that we are out of town until March 22, so we won't answer emails until then.  So if you need directions, we won't be emailing them out until then also.  We are looking forward to the first Yuwipi of this year and having the Chief back, as well as seeing all our old healees and meeting our new ones!  Looking forward to seeing you, Gaby.
Dear Relatives - We are all off to Vision Quest at the Ranch this weekend, but just wanted to send out a reminder of the upcoming Yuwipi healing ceremony with Chief Richard Grimes at the Barn on Saturday, March 25.  The lodge should start at around sundown, but all are welcome to start arriving around 3-4 p.m. to help with lodge and help our healees make their prayer ties.
 
Once again, a reminder to all that, though this ceremony is open to all, we are coming together to support and pray for the healing of those who have specifically asked for a healing.  There is a protocol one must go thru when asking for a healing, so if you are interested in asking for one, you must contact us ahead of time.
 
For those of you who have never attended a Yuwipi, we ask that you please let us know so we can send you a little write-up about what to expect, what to bring, etc.  We remind everyone to bring sweat clothes (long cotton dresses for women, long shorts, cutoffs or bathing suits for men) and remind all women that the appropriate attire for the Yuwipi is a dress or skirt (below the knee) and a sarong or shawl to wrap around your waist.  Any women who are moon time (menstruation) are welcome to attend, but will be unable to enter lodge or Yuwipi, though we welcome your participation!  Please do let us know when you arrive if you are on your moon, so we can give you clear instructions.
 
We remind to everyone to please bring a covered dish (made with lots of love and enough to feed a large group) to share for the feast and we are also making a special request for rocks, if any of you can also bring!
 
The Chief will be in town for a while after the Yuwipi and is available for any small or quick construction jobs (to help support his program, Future Seed), as well as give estimates for larger jobs that can be done later.  If you are interested, please call 301-834-7373 or email me.
 
Please do keep in mind that we are out of town until March 22, so we won't answer emails until then.  So if you need directions, we won't be emailing them out until then also.  We are looking forward to the first Yuwipi of this year and having the Chief back, as well as seeing all our old healees and meeting our new ones!  Looking forward to seeing you, Gaby.

[JosephSWM]

Here is another letter forwarded to me. The "Gaby" is Gabriela Perezzo. Sorry that the letter in the last post pasted twice.



Hi All - We have moved the next sweat lodge to Saturday, April 15th, starting at about 3 pm, so as to not have it Easter Sunday.  All are welcome, please bring appropriate lodge clothes, towel, covered dish to share for feast (made with love) and good cheer!
 
We would like to ask that everyone say a prayer for the good health and complete healing of Nancy Toman and Reginald Littlebrave.  Chief Richard will be performing a Yuwipi ceremony Thursday evening in Arkansas, so it would be great if you could say a prayer for them at around 9 pm Eastern, but any time is great too!
 
We have postponed the inauguration of Cooking with Spirit until May 20th due to Andrew's need to be with his sister during this time, since she has been hospitalized.  Due to postponement and scheduling conflicts of prior attendees, we have 6 openings for this seminar, so please let us know if you are interested.
 
Anyone requiring any further information, please call 301-834-7373 or email prnmedi@aol.com or cookingwspirit@aol.com. Thanks for your prayers and hope to see you on the 15th!  With thanks, Gaby.

[JosephSWM]

The website that goes with one of the email addresses is one of those survialist style websites. The address is

www.prnmed.com

[JosephSWM]

Someone just sent me the following email they received from on of the branches of Thunder's group. I know someone here wanted to confront these folks and so here's some info for them.


"Hi All - We have just gotten back from Texas Sun Dance, a very hot dance, temperatures reaching over 105 degrees, so it was hard.  Thanks to all of you who prayed for us during this time!  
 
Our next sweat lodge at the Barn in Knoxville, Maryland, has been moved to one week from tomorrow, next Saturday, June 24th at 5 pm.  All are welcome, please also feel free to bring your kids!  We will gather at 5 pm to start the fire and prepare lodge.  If anyone can help by bringing rocks, that would be greatly appreciated!  Don't forget sweat clothes, towel, beverages and a wonderful dish to share for the feast (we have been having utterly delectable dishes lately - great job everyone).  Cotton cloth in the seven colors and loose tobacco is also greatly appreciated for making prayer ties.  Oh, and did we forget to mention... bring smiles, laughter and an open heart!  See you then, Greg and Gaby.
 
RSVP to prnmedi@aol.com or 301-834-7373."