NAFPS Forum

General => Research Needed => Topic started by: Piff on July 09, 2017, 09:29:51 pm

Title: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: Piff on July 09, 2017, 09:29:51 pm
Intro thread here: http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=5037.0

Info concerning his site lightningthunderbow.com :

Name:
Gerald McLaren
Organization:
McLaren
State:
AZ
Postal Code:
86442
Country:
US

https://www.whois.com/whois/lightningthunderbow.com

Navajo Medicine Man reference: http://lightningthunderbow.boardhost.com/viewtopic.php?pid=118#p118

Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: Piff on July 09, 2017, 10:12:53 pm
GM has an ongoing pattern, seen also in other forums and blogs discussing cultural appropriation.

His themes are:

Critics have "personal psychological issues".

Criticism of cultural appropriation is angry and paranoid.

Criticism of cultural appropriation is "no different than the angry words of I.S.I.S."

Criticism of the New Age Movement is a paranoid rant.

We are all wrong, he is right. He is of the Heart, we are blind bullies.

https://2012spiritinaction.wordpress.com/2012/10/08/native-american-spiritual-truths-in-the-new-age/ especially the comment  Thunder Bow
December 1, 2014 at 11:57 am   
Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: Diana on July 10, 2017, 02:54:05 am

Here's Gerald Mclaren's geneaology.  From the whois info Piff provided (address was included) it was fairly easy to find out who this "Navajo Medicine Man" was.


Gerald Francis Mclaren in the California Birth Index, 1905-1995

Name:   Gerald Francis Mclaren
Birth Date:   24 Jan 1947
Gender:   Male
Mother's Maiden Name:   Skondeen
Birth County:   Alameda
SAVE & CREATE TREE   Cancel

Mother:
Vera M Shkondeen
 
in the 1930 United States Federal Census
VIEW 1930 United States Federal Census
View blank form
Add alternate information
Report issue
Name:   Vera M Shkondeen
Birth Year:   abt 1922
Gender:   Female
Race:   White
Birthplace:   California
Marital Status:   Single
Relation to Head of House:   Foster Daughter
Home in 1930:   San Francisco, San Francisco, California
Map of Home:   View Map
Street address:   Andover Street
Ward of City:   A. D. 23
Block:   211
House Number in Cities or Towns:   637
Dwelling Number:   176
Family Number:   179
Attended School:   Yes
Able to Read and Write:   Yes
Father's Birthplace:   Russia
Mother's Birthplace:   Russia
Household Members:   
Name   Age
John T Denahy   66
Elizabeth A Denahy   50
Ruth E Denahy   13
Vera M Shkondeen   8
Neighbors:   View others on page

Well there you are. His mother's parents are Russian immigrants. I also looked at the 1940 census and her name was spelled like on his birth record Skondeen.

Father:
Raymond Mclaren

in the 1930 United States Federal Census
VIEW 1930 United States Federal Census

Name:   Raymond Mclaren
Birth Year:   abt 1920
Gender:   Male
Race:   White
Birthplace:   California
Marital Status:   Single
Relation to Head of House:   Son
Home in 1930:   San Francisco, San Francisco, California
Map of Home:   View Map
Street address:   Tara
Ward of City:   Assem. Dist. 24
Block:   553
House Number in Cities or Towns:   324
Dwelling Number:   287
Family Number:   290
Attended School:   Yes
Able to Read and Write:   Yes
Father's Birthplace:   New Jersey
Mother's Birthplace:   California
Able to Speak English:   Yes
Household Members:   
Name   Age
George Mclaren   30
Jane Mclaren   28
Raymond Mclaren   10
George Mclaren   3
Neighbors:   

Here's Gerald Mclaren's grandfather from the same 1930 census and guess what??? His parents are from Scottland.

George Mclaren

the 1930 United States Federal Census
VIEW 1930 United States Federal Census
Name:   George Mclaren
Birth Year:   abt 1900
Gender:   Male
Race:   White
Birthplace:   New Jersey
Marital Status:   Married
Relation to Head of House:   Head
Home in 1930:   San Francisco, San Francisco, California
Map of Home:   View Map
Street address:   Tara
Ward of City:   Assem. Dist. 24
Block:   553
House Number in Cities or Towns:   324
Dwelling Number:   287
Family Number:   290
Home Owned or Rented:   Rented
Home Value:   20
Radio Set:   Yes
Lives on Farm:   No
Age at First Marriage:   24
Attended School:   No
Able to Read and Write:   Yes
Father's Birthplace:   Scotland
Mother's Birthplace:   Scotland
Able to Speak English:   Yes
Occupation:   Printer
Industry:   Printing
Class of Worker:   Wage or salary worker
Employment:   Yes
Veteran:   Yes
War:   WW
Household Members:   
Name   Age
George Mclaren   30
Jane Mclaren   28
Raymond Mclaren   10
George Mclaren   3
Neighbors:   View others on page

And grandmother Jane Jacobsen Mclaren.

Jane Mclaren
 in the 1930 United States Federal Census
VIEW 1930 United States Federal Census
Name:   Jane Mclaren
Birth Year:   abt 1902]
Gender:   Female
Race:   White
Birthplace:   California
Marital Status:   Married
Relation to Head of House:   Wife
Homemaker?:   Yes
Home in 1930:   San Francisco, San Francisco, California
Map of Home:   View Map
Street address:   Tara
Ward of City:   Assem. Dist. 24
Block:   553
House Number in Cities or Towns:   324
Dwelling Number:   287
Family Number:   290
Age at First Marriage:   22
Attended School:   No
Able to Read and Write:   Yes
Father's Birthplace:   Norway
Mother's Birthplace:   Utah
Able to Speak English:   Yes
Household Members:   
Name   Age
George Mclaren   30
Jane Mclaren   28
Raymond Mclaren   10
George Mclaren   3
Neighbors:   View others on page

Now Gerald Mcleran's great grandmother was born in Utah her name is Clara Proksch Jacobson. Her father is from Austria and her mother is from Ireland. I will show a marrige record to connect the two and her maiden name on another post as this one is getting so long.




Navajo Medicine Man reference: http://lightningthunderbow.boardhost.com/viewtopic.php?pid=118#p118

Intro thread here: http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=5037.0

Info concerning his site lightningthunderbow.com :

Name:
Gerald McLaren
Organization:
McLaren
State:
AZ
Postal Code:
86442
Country:
US

https://www.whois.com/whois/lightningthunderbow.com

Navajo Medicine Man reference: http://lightningthunderbow.boardhost.com/viewtopic.php?pid=118#p118
Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: educatedindian on July 10, 2017, 11:28:34 am
Repeating what I said in the other thread about his forum Hanblecheya:

Even without his impersonation, the forum of his is obviously Nuage trying to pose as Native. The funniest part is his recommending a Disney movie to understand power animals. The title also is an obvious tip off, a Lakota ceremony but led by someone posing as Navajo.

The forum's other members include an English woman calling herself Star Wolf Medicine Woman (seriously...?), Native in Past Life, Native Spirit, etc. There's also threads about the paranormal, remote viewing, Reiki, survivalism, and an experience with a Peruvian curandero that a white Nuager thought was a shaman.

I don't see any sign of Gerald selling ceremony, but his forum is mostly Nuagers trying to convince themselves what they're doing is OK, or even helpful to themselves instead of frantic thrashing around and wishful thinking. Like many such places, it saddens me to see people so lost and desperate and being taken advantage of.

More on him. FB where he claims he graduated from Ship Rock HS on the Navajo rez.
https://www.facebook.com/gerald.talltree

Youtube channel of his, with lots of knockoffs of Lakota beliefs with slideshows of Hamilton Mint paintings.
https://www.youtube.com/user/GrowingTreeAz/videos
Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: Thunderbow on July 10, 2017, 05:48:18 pm
From a domain registration, you tried to identify the author of the site. Then you put it out here. In your angry attempt to invalidate people, you do great harm. What kind of hackers will you release on Mr. Gerald Mclaren? He is the person paying for my site, thus his name is there. He gave me the password and I maintain the site. I meet Gerald while I was working at the Grand Canyon. Interesting seeing the information, but you do great harm. Gerald Tall Tree is my name.

You people are bullies and are forcing your concepts on Native People. That is all about control. You knowing nothing about "New Age". I am not here to defend their concepts, but using the Label "New Age" is political, and is harmful. You people know nothing about New Age concepts or what New Age really is. You are blind in your anger and need to CONTROL. Your blindness keeps you from seeing deeper thoughts, your blindness and anger threatens all Native People. YOU are defining Native People to Native People. But what makes you so knowledgeable? What right do you you have to tell others who is Native? and what Native is. What right do you have to pass judgement on something you know nothing about?

You Judge my Forum out of blindness without really reading it. You have your preset ideas about New Age without understanding it. Understanding does not mean agreeing, it means knowledge. You employ Powerful Propaganda Tools, but as a result, truth is lost, and so is the knowledge that goes with it. This is what destroyed the 1st Nations years ago. Today, people like you are continuing this destruction.
Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: RedRightHand on July 10, 2017, 08:51:24 pm
Gerald, no one's buying it. You're not Dineh. You're not Native. You're a newage scammer. If we're wrong, tell us your clan and Elders and we'll talk to them about why you're posting newage and fake Lakota pan-Indian crap on the Internet and telling gullible white people it's "Navajo Medicine".

For Gerald's forum members who may have come here: His advice to take DNA tests to find out if you're "Cherokee" is totally bogus. DNA tests cannot tell if you are from a specific tribe. They cannot even determine for certain if you have Native American ancestors. While there are markers and alleles that are found most commonly among indigenous people, there are also factors that can lead to false positives. As Native identity is about community, family, citizenship and in-person, living culture, no legitimate tribe accepts DNA as proof of Native identity.

Don't believe anything this guy tells you. If he has asked you for money or given you weird advice, feel free to contact people here about it.
Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: educatedindian on July 10, 2017, 09:08:44 pm
Let's hear some more of what he believes. Bold is mine:

"The Noble Hollywood Indian Warrior Image is much more Healing than those harsh words in that [AIM] manifesto. The feeling I get from fury fussy purple dream catches, are far more healing than the bad feelings I get from reading that manifesto. Cute wolves and Indian lovers surrounded by them, is much more healing than having native thoughts about others and one self. I do not understand this war on feeling good. How can feeling good be exploitation of the Indian Nations? I don’t care New Age people use our warrior image to feel good, even if it is a bit to romantic. They are not exploiting us. Only the Sales People do that by producing the goods that sell....

If a bunch or white people are in a drumming circle, pretending to be Indians, and it makes them feel good, what is so wrong with that? No one can steal our ways doing that pretending. To me, feeling good is healing. If they can heal by doing a fake drumming circle, so much the better.

I am into healing. I say go with the Romantic Noble Warrior and the good feelings it gives you. Go ahead, and sleep with that furry fuzzy purple dream catcher next to you. Go with the warm fuzzy feelings you get when you see a Photoshopped image of Indian Lovers surrounded with cute furry wolves. Warm fuzzy feelings can heal you! The world really needs this kind of thing."

And of course, what we see so often. Once the mask is taken off, out comes words far angrier than anyone here has ever said. That same thread see Gerald go into a racist rant, ironically attacking someone for having white ancestry. But he argues it's not racist, just that part white ancestry makes one colonized. Yet the spiritual colonialism of Nuage he defends at length. He has since at least 2010, despite his dubious claims of no internet skills, despite having built a Youtube channel and another website.

One of the more curious things I found was his insisting on a psychology forum that being gay is a choice. That is a very westernized fundamentalist POV. There's quite a bit of psychological projection in his vicious bullying attacks and ways, both here and elsewhere:

"I love Nuage, and if you criticize it you are destroying Native tradition."
"Gays are choosing to be gay [following the fundamentalist argument] but if you criticize Nuage you are being like ISIS fundamentalists."
"You knowing nothing about New Age. I am not here to defend their concepts" when he does nothing but that.
"using the Label New Age is political [said by those who avoid politics] and is harmful" when it's their own term.

As said before, he doesn't sell ceremony. He just likes their stroking his ego and spends every spare moment seeking it out across half a dozen forums. That leads him to do sometimes very unethical things, such as posting the location of spots for vision quests.
Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: Thunderbow on July 10, 2017, 09:16:50 pm
GM has an ongoing pattern, seen also in other forums and blogs discussing cultural appropriation.

His themes are:

Critics have "personal psychological issues".

Criticism of cultural appropriation is angry and paranoid.

Criticism of cultural appropriation is "no different than the angry words of I.S.I.S."

Criticism of the New Age Movement is a paranoid rant.

We are all wrong, he is right. He is of the Heart, we are blind bullies.

https://2012spiritinaction.wordpress.com/2012/10/08/native-american-spiritual-truths-in-the-new-age/ especially the comment  Thunder Bow
December 1, 2014 at 11:57 am

Clear misinformation taken out of context with the glib addition: "Criticism cultural appropriation" to my quoted comments. Gerald Mclaren was my roommate at the Grand Canyon. I thank him for his assistance. Lies and personal invalidation is what this site is all about. Everything is taken out of context and twisted to suit your hate and misinformation. All 1st Nations are endangered by this kind of bullying and propaganda. Who are you to say who's Native? Who are you to say what being Native is? You impose your lies on other Natives. That means CONTROL and anger. Shame on you!
Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: Thunderbow on July 10, 2017, 09:30:13 pm
More Misinformation and editorial lies again. You take my words out of context with no understanding of what I am trying to say. You are all about CONTROL. Be as nasty as your like, quote someones name to invalidate me. You are all about INVALIDATION and ANGER. You use that to CONTROL others with lies and misinformation. Now I know what Hillary Clinton feels like. The 1st Nations are very divers, there no one set rule to follow. Your imposing rules is destructive to all.

It is pointless to defend myself, and I will not. But what this site is all about is CONTROL and ANGER. Shame on you!
Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: Piff on July 10, 2017, 09:44:20 pm
Quote
Thunder Bow
November 30, 2014 at 11:01 am   

Quote
I do use Tarot Cards and other decks in my work here on the Rez. Yes they aid me, help me see what I did not think of before. I suggest you try using Tarot Cards. Your posts would be much more thoughtful. Many have asked me for Tarot Reading here on the Rez. When I was working at the Grand Canyon, people would drive up from the Rez for a Tarot Reading by me.

https://2012spiritinaction.wordpress.com/2012/10/08/native-american-spiritual-truths-in-the-new-age/

So a man who claims he is a "Navajo Medicine Man" offers tarot card readings.

Questioning this  is not "invalidation", "control", "anger", or anything to be ashamed of.

We always have the right to learn, question, evaluate, and make choices.

Why does Gerald react so dramatically when asked routine questions? Why is he lashing out?


Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: Piff on July 10, 2017, 10:05:27 pm
Quote
Gerald Tall Tree I am of the Tsinaiijii Clan

· April 13, 2016 at 10:29am

Facebook comment on https://www.facebook.com/gerald.talltree
Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: Thunderbow on July 10, 2017, 10:10:02 pm
[Irrelevant rant] Being small time, I had nothing to lose. My forum will go on, what I say in other forums remain valid. My website stays up with Gerald's assistance. It will stay Valid. My Forum will stay Valid! I do not care if you think I am Native or not. Many other Natives may get hurt because of this site. They can seek assistance in my forum.

Your argument is hollow [personal attacks removed] It has nothing to do with being Native, It has everything to do with, CONTROL, ANGER, and the "Ain't it awful" Game. It is sad to see this kind of stuff, but it is all to common. [empty bluster removed]
Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: Thunderbow on July 10, 2017, 10:21:29 pm
When are accusations are routine questions? You know what you are doing. Card readings are common on the big rez, go there and see for yourself. Do I have to follow your definitions on what is Dine'.? You are ignorant.
Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: RedRightHand on July 10, 2017, 10:25:57 pm
Gerald can't even get the most basic terminology right. The more he talks, the more he reveals himself as a fraud.

Gerald seems to have come here trying to get some more followers. Tragic that he has any, really.


[identifying ip data redacted]
Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: Piff on July 10, 2017, 10:36:48 pm
Gerald, you say that you are a Navajo Medicine Man of the Tsinaiijii Clan.

Those are very specific claims that involve community identifiers. These are not claims to be made in personal isolation.

Asking you who your people are (in response to your claims) is a normal, informed response. You may try to paint this as anger but you are incorrect.

Hey, maybe some of us know your people! That would be cool, right? Community would be shared.

The Navajo Nation is a real Nation with real people in it. They really have their own enrollment requirements and their own Nation to Nation relationship with the USA.

If I was Navajo I would have lots of experience talking about who my people are. I would enjoy talking about family and community, as a member.

If I had heritage but not enough to enroll, I would be upfront about that. I would not make any dishonest claims. I would work to be a good community member.

If I said I was Navajo but I was not, I would be lying. My lies would be horribly rude and disrespectful to The People & Nation I was misrepresenting.

Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: Piff on July 10, 2017, 10:45:26 pm
Archive of a past forum run by Gerald - Native American Paranormal View https://web.archive.org/web/20121121014721/http://www.bigorb.com/orbs/society-and-culture/religion-and-spirituality/nativeamericanparanormal

Gerald used the names Thunder Bow and Mountain Lion. https://web.archive.org/web/20120217221246/http://www.bigorb.com:80/member/profile/9649

As for his claim that we are playing the  "Ain't it awful" game, he has used this phrase to troll people since at least 2012: https://www.google.com/search?q=thunderbow+%22ain%27t+it+awful%22&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8

He identifies elsewhere as a "Navajo Shaman".

Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: Thunderbow on July 10, 2017, 10:58:24 pm
Gerald, you say that you are a Navajo Medicine Man of the Tsinaiijii Clan.

Those are very specific claims that involve community identifiers. These are not claims to be made in personal isolation.

Asking you who your people are (in response to your claims) is a normal, informed response. You may try to paint this as anger but you are incorrect.

Hey, maybe some of us know your people! That would be cool, right? Community would be shared.

The Navajo Nation is a real Nation with real people in it. They really have their own enrollment requirements and their own Nation to Nation relationship with the USA.

If I was Navajo I would have lots of experience talking about who my people are. I would enjoy talking about family and community, as a member.

If I had heritage but not enough to enroll, I would be upfront about that. I would not make any dishonest claims. I would work to be a good community member.

If I said I was Navajo but I was not, I would be lying. My lies would be horribly rude and disrespectful to The People & Nation I was misrepresenting.

Those remarks of mine were all taken out of context. You are being Misled. I will NOT expose my family to invalidation in this form, or will I expose my clan relations in this forum. Read the whole  links for yourself, not the the copy paste fragments. The Invalidation and Anger is see here is Intense! Worse than any political campaign.
Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: Piff on July 10, 2017, 11:20:13 pm
Gerald:

are you Navajo?
Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: Thunderbow on July 10, 2017, 11:51:07 pm
Of course I am Navajo. It is interesting to see, that they left out my Facebook posts that I attended Shiprock High School. That I lived in Shonto AZ 86053. Gerald mclaren was my roommate in the Grand Canyon. I think the housing office put him with me because we had the same 1st names. The selective misleading quotes and accompaning misinterpertations are fun to read and learn from. Please post more here, please dig up more. This is interesting. Oh, don't forget my spelling errors!
Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: educatedindian on July 11, 2017, 12:17:22 am
Your spam posts and the more childish rants are removed. We don't reward immaturity.

Your age claims are a bit off. On FB, it's 64. On your NAFPS profile you claim 70. Given your posts, your emotional age is closer to 17, sometimes 7.

The "Tsinaiijii Clan"...I'm guessing you meant Tsinajinnie. That's not a typo, it's a different way of saying the word, with three added syllables. No one else uses that spelling or pronunciation anywhere. Just you.

And you should have known we would spot that. Do you know just how many famous Tsinajinnies there are? Delphine the famous singer, Andrew the painter, and his daughter Hulleah also an artist and educator. But it seems you don't know any of that.

Just as important is that your mindset and beliefs are colonialist, including some racism and anti gay ideas. If you want to debate you can. We are an open forum. The attacks we don't allow.
Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: Piff on July 11, 2017, 12:59:06 am
Gerald, are you enrolled in the Navajo Nation?

Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: Thunderbow on July 11, 2017, 01:03:42 am
Of course I am enrolled.
Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: Thunderbow on July 11, 2017, 01:08:57 am
Note: My name is incomplete as listed. This is for my protection, a lesson proven here.
Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: Thunderbow on July 11, 2017, 01:54:04 am
Your spam posts and the more childish rants are removed. We don't reward immaturity.

Your age claims are a bit off. On FB, it's 64. On your NAFPS profile you claim 70. Given your posts, your emotional age is closer to 17, sometimes 7.

The "Tsinaiijii Clan"...I'm guessing you meant Tsinajinnie. That's not a typo, it's a different way of saying the word, with three added syllables. No one else uses that spelling or pronunciation anywhere. Just you.

And you should have known we would spot that. Do you know just how many famous Tsinajinnies there are? Delphine the famous singer, Andrew the painter, and his daughter Hulleah also an artist and educator. But it seems you don't know any of that.

Just as important is that your mindset and beliefs are colonialist, including some racism and anti gay ideas. If you want to debate you can. We are an open forum. The attacks we don't allow.

You don't allow attacks? I was attacked personally right from the start. Innocent Peoples names were disclosed and personal info posted for all to see. Subject to identity theft. Almost everything I posted on the internet was attacked and invalidated, and displayed. With nasty little opinions attached. I E. Mailed Mr. Mclaren as to the disclosure of his personal information. Shame on you!
Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: educatedindian on July 11, 2017, 11:11:32 am
McLaren's name is public, for anyone to see.
The public information on McLaren, posted by him, includes his age. It is 70, identical to Thunderbow/Tall Tree.
4 more spam posts were removed. An emotional age closer to 7 than 70...
Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: Piff on July 11, 2017, 07:31:53 pm
Thunderbow / Gerald McLaren's 2013 defense of Hyemeyohsts Storm/ Charles Storm http://www.spiritualinspiration.org/t8594-vision-quest
Our coverage of Storm here: http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=899.0

When this information was brought up http://www.psiram.com/en/index.php/Hyemeyohsts_Storm , Gerald responded in a fashion that we now also seen on NAFPS. I bolded some of the repeated themes.

Quote
I think the term "Plastic Shaman" is over used to invalidate much. I always considered Storm to be a writer, not a "Shaman". I knew he gave workshops in Santa Cruz CA at on time. The Story is Cheyenne, and if you read the book he states that fact. People who gets to close to the truth gets ridiculed all the time.

I want to discuss the Story and how it relates to perceiving and the Vision Quest, rather than about H. Storm personally. How does the Story of Jumping Mouse relates to the Vision Quest? I do think this story is an Old Story. If we invalidate so much out of life, we will learn nothing. Lets break out of culterually imprinted negativity and learn.

Quote
The Internet has so much Negativity on it, that it makes me sick. It seems many like to dump their anger and sour feelings there, because they know they can get away with it. Also it is a way for them to have some Control. We must be very-very careful when quoting things from the internet.

Never Ever consider what you read on the internet to be truth. Form your own opinions, and research even more. Also I suggest you read "Seven Arrows" cover to cover before making judgement because what others say anbout it on or off line.

Quote
We are now totally lost forever in the Mean Spirited Invalidation of Seven Arrows. I knew only a little of the conterversy, but not much. After reading your quotes I am only more saddened. I done independent research on some of the stories, all though not exact, they are close. Most Native stories are changed, and none are told in the old ways. Thus who are those in the quote are really right?

By seeing the Name calling, in the quote only alerts me to Mean Spirited accusations. Storm is a half breed, half white, half Cheyenne. I will not defend him personally for I feel the accusations are not important to the issue. There is to much of this Mean Spirited stuff going on in the modern world as it is. Those who accuse never had any real connection to what was said in the stories. They are Angry people who are going around finding people and places to dump their anger on.

I will NOT let those kind of people rob me of the connections I found in some of the stories in "Seven Arrows". If you want to let that crap you quoted  influence you, go ahead! I do will not let that kind of crap influence me. It only robs me of seeing and learning. It only keeps me blind, lost in an angry world of accusations. I Never Ever, will let those kind of remarks influence my thinking, on any book, way, or a people. I don't care what "Authority" those in your quote may have. But when people speak in the way they do, I begin to question them. I will not let others define "What Is Indian" to me.

Quote
All the stuff you been posting is just Modern Angry People who are very ignorant of their true heritage, who are seeking control in cyber space.

I am Traditional, thus I see differently than you do when it comes Native American Stories. I can tell what is more true to the older ways of a hunting gathering people. I can tell the difference between stories influenced by the modern world, and those that survived from our ancestors. I see this in all other Tribes, as well as my own. One needs not to be knowledge able in other tribes teachings to know what teaching is adapted to the modern world, and those that came from the Ancestors of long ago.

In my Nation this is also a problem I am always battling. To preserve our original teachings, I must battle the modern adaptations that show up on the internet, that change their meanings. The truths in original stories such as "Jumping Mouse" as told in Seven Arrows, do apply to modern times as well as the old days. Look into your mind and your feelings to see this, and don't just react to Negative write ups you read on the internet.
Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: Piff on July 11, 2017, 08:47:03 pm
One of Gerald's earlier sites is archived here: https://web.archive.org/web/20040215121907/http://stormrunneraz.tripod.com:80/growingtree/id8.html

Contact info here: https://web.archive.org/web/20040215121635/http://stormrunneraz.tripod.com:80/growingtree/id7.html which gives us an email and name to google on. Which leads us to a comment he posted in 2003, with now familiar themes:

Quote
Ya'at'eeh! I have read your  Web Site enough! I assume your Lakota. Some parts of you web page is very beautiful. RosePhoto directed to your pages. I see your Sickness clearly. I dug into your "Rantings" about Politics.I seen this kind of Anger Sickness in the Political Rooms on AOL. Seems most Bush supporters have this Sickness. I see a commen thread of intense Anger. I don't mean to be cruel .. but your Blindness may be because you don't want to see. Anger is Blinding .. take my word for it. You got alot of it in You. If you can view my web pages at: I am Growing Tree so See what life can be without the kind of Anger I see in you. Walk in beauty; Growing Tree

http://www.snowwowl.com/gl3.html
Title: Re: Thunderbow / Gerald TallTree / Gerald McLaren "Navajo Medicine Man"
Post by: RedRightHand on July 11, 2017, 08:49:26 pm
Pretty weird when some unhinged white stranger shows up on your doorstep, screaming, "You do not intimidate me!!!! "

Uh, who are you again?

Right, another crazy white man. Never heard of you.

Look, dude, we meet your kind every day. Nothing new about you. You want attention, we get it. You've reached the state where negative attention feels better than being ignored.  It's hard living all alone when you're 70. That's sad that you're so lonely.

But it's not sad enough to look the other way while you lie to people and misrepresent Dineh and other Native cultures. That's harmful to the cultures, and the cultures are worth more than you, or any one of us as individuals. Maybe you've found some personal comfort in your fantasies but the comfort stops when you start spreading these lies online and giving horrible, harmful advice to vulnerable people as fake "medicine".

You showed up here to start this. No one came after you and your tiny little message board. No one knew about you and no one cared.  Clearly you thought stirring up some kind of battle here would work in your favor. Sorry to disappoint you, Mr. McLaren. You've earned yourself some pity, and now some genuine criticism for the psychological harm you've caused on those message boards. You've managed to work up your blood pressure, waste our time and annoy some good people. It's too bad that these are your goals for the final years of your life.