Author Topic: Tribe spacific belief system  (Read 8540 times)

Offline Alan

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Tribe spacific belief system
« on: September 07, 2008, 04:03:48 pm »
Dear sir,

   In the introduction page you made referance to the belief system to be communal and tribe spacific. I know from what a few friends who are members of the Eastern Band Cherokee that Cherokee is a matrilinial tribe. Another friend who is Kiowa has not mentioned hers. My question is (stupid though it may be) in the situation fo crosss tribal merriage between a patralinial and a matrilinial tribe does the family belief system revert to patrilinial or matrilinial or do the husband and wife maintain their own beliefs? I am interested in Native American culture and tradition so I ask this question for my own education. If it seems a foolish question I apologize.

Respectfully,
Alan

Offline Defend the Sacred

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Re: Tribe spacific belief system
« Reply #1 on: September 07, 2008, 04:23:06 pm »
in the situation fo crosss tribal merriage between a patralinial and a matrilinial tribe does the family belief system revert to patrilinial or matrilinial or do the husband and wife maintain their own beliefs?

They fight about it till they break up.

Offline Defend the Sacred

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Re: Tribe spacific belief system
« Reply #2 on: September 07, 2008, 05:31:32 pm »
OK, in more detail. I am not really joking with the above comment.

Hundreds of years ago, it would be more clear-cut: the couple would almost certainly have to decide whose people they were going to live with, and that would determine the social/outer forms that their cultural and religious lives would take. From what I know, in many tribes the old, traditional marriage ceremony is largely based on the physical action of one person leaving their home and going to live with the family of their spouse.

In modern life it's not always so clear-cut. We live in a more mobile society, and a lot of people live in urban environments, at least part of the time.

As to what sort of personal/inner beliefs the person who left their people would maintain vs adopt... that's hard to say. I can say from experience that, if one is deeply involved in a religious system, it really doesn't work to try and do more than one religion. Symbols and actions mean different things in different cultures. What's desirable in one culture/religion is taboo in another. While superficial involvement in multiple traditions, like politely visiting someone else's church, is one thing, deep involvement is a whole other deal. Spiritual workers trying to mix these things can become ineffective at best, or insane and dangerous at worst. Simple things, like some prayer and general healing, can sometimes be multi-trad or interfaith, imho, but the deeper things, the ceremonies that deal with specific spirits, need to be kept intact.

There are examples, both in the US and Europe, of tribal groups merging and combining some of their ways over time - but that's a different situation than a couple dealing with these issues in the short term.

As a woman who grew up with a sense of power and autonomy, and a woman who has also been brought into patriarchal situations where women were seen as second-class citizens... I have to say, I don't see why a woman who is used to being granted full autonomy would want to leave that situation for one where her life and choices become so limited. Sitting quietly while the men make all the decisions, when one is used to being an equal player, is not particularly attractive to most women who've known a more egalitarian life. Some women do it (I did it in the past) out of love for their partner and commitment to tradition, but it's not easy.

We can debate how much power and autonomy women are granted in the various patriarchal or patrilineal groups vs matriarchal and matrilineal ones - and I may be stepping on some toes by discussing this at all - but I have to say that it's not a transition I was too happy with. I'm a dyed-in-the-wool egalitarian, and unless there's a way for that to be a core value of the culture and relationship, I'm not going to be happy giving that up.

I've also seen men raised with the privileges of a patriarchal system be unable to accept egalitarian relationships. This has at times led to serious problems. There are men who are happy living in an egalitarian or matrilineal situation, but I think these men are quite rare.

Offline earthw7

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Re: Tribe spacific belief system
« Reply #3 on: September 08, 2008, 12:30:28 am »
There is no easy answer a long time ago if you CHOOSE to live with the wife family you became what they are if you CHOOSE to live with the Husband family you did what they did.

Today, it has not changed I am Lakota and patralinial and my husband is Chippewa and matrilinial. So NONE is in charge.
Like they said we fight until the end of time of course I am right.
In Spirit

Offline C Standing Bear

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Re: Tribe spacific belief system
« Reply #4 on: September 26, 2008, 02:31:10 pm »
There is no easy answer a long time ago if you CHOOSE to live with the wife family you became what they are if you CHOOSE to live with the Husband family you did what they did.

Today, it has not changed I am Lakota and patralinial and my husband is Chippewa and matrilinial. So NONE is in charge.
Like they said we fight until the end of time of course I am right.

I ask this with all serioussness, are your fights different that if the husband were Lakota and wife Chippewa? Meaning, does he try to get you to take charge and you try to get him to make the decisions?

I like how you explained things Kathryn. Interesting read.