Author Topic: Cleargreen Cult  (Read 57111 times)

Offline educatedindian

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Re: Cleargreen Cult
« Reply #15 on: May 06, 2008, 01:32:24 am »
Ari, have you considered giving serious thought to taking Cleargreen to court? Perhaps Shambala Center as well. I'm also a member of a site that includes many cult survivors and cult experts, and what many ex Scientologists and ex Moonies (among others) have done once they left their cults is take the cult leadership or organization to court, suing them for damages or lost income.

There haven't been any cases of Nuagers taking exploiters to court as far as I know because most are too embarassed to admit they were used or abused. And in many cases they never know. Also many just want to get on with their lives.
 
Keep in mind, this is not a step to take lightly. Court cases can take time and energy. In the worst cases the cults retaliate with more harassment and abuse. But many cult survivors find the step very liberating. And the threat of a lawsuit may make Cleargreen change its ways. They may wind up giving you the money back just to avoid a suit that could set a precedent and lead to others taking them to court too.

The best case scenario might see Shambala cutting its ties, or Cleargreen being forced to publicly admit that Castaneda was a liar.

Offline Ari

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Re: Cleargreen Cult
« Reply #16 on: May 07, 2008, 03:42:24 pm »
Yes, Al, I'm giving serious thought to taking Cleargreen to court. I would do it years ago, but was pinned down all the time to be practically able to.

Well, now i'm out of the trap. I've already gone through all possible extremes of harassment, so i would not bow out of emotional stress. Yes, to bring this malicious theater of absurd to the end feels liberating. I knew what it did to me, but before i found your site, i was not deeply aware that they actually ripping off and cynically disrespecting what they claiming to be their treasured source...

This is truly disgusting thing to discover...

Now is good moment to act because before we confront Cleargreen in US court, we got chance to prepare the ground very well.

With new regulation on protection of consumers rights in EU, Cleargreen's activity there is under the question.

According to the new regulation which will be voted on May 26, all profiteers on magic can be asked on consumer's demand to prove truthfulness of their claims:

~

" Stricter regulations for paranormal industry
April 18 2008
Psychics and alternative practitioners will face their toughest regulation yet under new rules expected to come into force next month.

"Businesses that make promises they cannot keep - or even prove - will be subject to new European consumer protection regulations in the biggest shake-up of consumer rights in a generation.
Spiritualists, if the new regulations are approved by the UK Parliament, will have to offer numerous riders about their services if they are to avoid civil actions.
The new rules will bring to an end the Fraudulent Mediums Act, a 50-year-old law introduced to replace 18Th-century witchcraft legislation.
Providers of alternative therapies will also be expected to adhere to the new regulations."

Seems that in the EU at least this will make the new age scammers much more responsible for their claims:

"The Fraudulent Mediums Act (1951) is set to be replaced by the EU Unfair Commercial Practices Directive on the 26 May. Under the new legislation, mediums will have to prove they have not misled or coerced vulnerable consumers. Previously it was the prosecutors' responsibility to provide evidence that the medium had intended to be fraudulent."

~


The obligation of proof will lay on businesses, not on consumer or authorities as before.

Since the process is started, business activities of the company will  be suspended until the court decision.

Everything could be challenged... starting from the name "Magical Passes" According to the new regulation Cleargreen can be asked to show what is magical about them...

So, if Cleargreen intending to continue their enterprise in Europe, they would have to turn inside out and shrink into funny petty nonsense and considering their history as reps of Father of New Age, their case and possible attempts of dodgery could attract considerable media attention.

There is Cleargreen workshop scheduled to happen soon in UK:

http://www.tensegrity.org.uk/

So, Cleargreen can be asked to show their skill in the art of modern day accountability really soon.

Then... i think we should not ignore embarrassing for Buddhists fact of association  with Cleargreen.

Should say that from my own experience i know that not many people are truly aware of how deeply to the core Cleargreen's fraud goes. I suppose and hope that Shambhala Mountain Center is simply unaware of seriousness of the issue and got caught into believing in authenticity of Cleargreen's connection to the Native American Shamanic tradition and actually believing that by association with Cleargreen they taking pride in standing together with Native American Shamanism.

I believe that if Shambhala Center would be properly informed, they would refuse to continue association with pretenders and exploiters of Spirituality.

I don't really know much about Shambhala Mountain Center, but Tibetan Buddhism, which they seems to be representing is world wide respected Spiritual Tradition and even if Shambhala Center would refuse to acknowledge an error in accepting association with Cleargreen we can apply to Wisdom of Dalai Lama and ask him to give his opinion on this issue.

I already wrote to Shambhala. I think other people, especially Indians should write to let Shambhala Center know about the error.

I'm sure they would not ignore the issue and will be willing to take higher course in Spirituality than mixing with cultural and Spiritual appropriators.

This seems to be right strategy on confronting Cleargreen fraud before going to US court.

 



« Last Edit: May 07, 2008, 03:58:54 pm by Ari »

Offline A.H.

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Re: Cleargreen Cult
« Reply #17 on: May 08, 2008, 10:03:09 am »
I noticed that this forum unleashed all its power on some easy prey new-agers like that Suraj Holzwarth and similar. She is plain simple idiotic fraud that many of the NAFPS members are having almost fun in fighting against. To which I don't object - just observe. 

I am asking this out of curiosity: I am interested what is the mechanism of choosing which fronts to fight more actively by NAFPS members? How do you choose your "prey"?

How come you don't pick on this Cleargreen scam  (or Michael Harner or any similar bigger "prey") with the same enthusiasm and extra engagement as you picked on that Suraj woman. Bombing the general public, media and Cleargreen  and Shambala themselves with emails, complaints, activists showing up at their events, protesting directly at their office, etc. would certainly be effective also with those bigger new-age businesses...


Disclaimer, hehe: I don't do that personally, because I don't "feel" it and I also think it is "pissing against the wind" - in the case of Shambala and Cleargreen even protesting one fraud to another - and even Dalai Lama is very political - I am not sure how would he address this if at all...  Do you have enough supporters for this cause or political power/background to be interesting to him?

But this forum does not have the many inhibitions that prevent such persons as myself in engaging actively in such activism...

So how come such mild reaction in regard to bigger new-age prey and lack of active engagement and activism as in that Suraj case?

 


« Last Edit: May 08, 2008, 10:11:14 am by A.H. »

Offline Ari

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Re: Cleargreen Cult
« Reply #18 on: May 08, 2008, 02:53:50 pm »
A. H. ,

I don't think there is this consciously cold choosing the prey method. Perhaps other members got entangled in some ways with other groups and cults to give them attention and ask others to support the protest. Because it is right thing to do...

I had misfortune to get in touch with Cleargreen and Castanedaism and got to experisnce their twist of nature through my being, so i feel i can't just leave it to be continued. I saw how bad it is from my own experience, so i feel i'm doing good thing trying to stop it.

It is a battle to confront fraud because fraud would not mind to squash you like a bug with no contemplation upon cosmic grief. It is natural to look for companionship and support in this battle and also for affirmation from other human beings that what you doing is good, appreciated and needed not just for your personal reasons. Not to loose the touch with reality and humanness...

When i came to look for such support, affirmation and friendship to the sites discussing legacy of Castaneda, i found total hell of aggressive unhealth. It came out to be that people who consider themselves to be Castaneda's followers are absolutely uncapable of anything humanly good in human relationship... so twisted their Castanedaistic menatlity came out to be. Poisoned...

They just jumped at me like flock of hungry scavengers, aiming to tear apart with no care they doing it to alive human being, not some image of insane idea in their heads.

Well... that was truly bad, it's still going on over their sites.

Over there i found angry, full of hissing hostility remarks about NAFPS and sure i wanted to check what this people are hostile about...

Have to say that before reading materials @NAFPS and getting to know opinion of Indians about Castaneda legacy, i was considering my battle with fraud of Castanedaism to be my own, private issue. After reading this site i got another perspective and broader view which sure confirming my stance.

I proposed to confront Cleargreen because i think it is really good thing to do. I would say it is good for humanity. Because Castaneda was a Father of New Age and father of the fraud of New Age and biggest figure in popularization of this fraud, role model for thousands of other pretenders and exploiters inspired by his success.

If we could bring Castanedaism to justice as a fraud, hundreds of other imposters who plagiarized Castanedian scenario and used to proudly refer to don Juan brand name to validate their own lies, would automatically shrink.

I think besides any personal and group interests it would be good thing to clean the world's awareness and Spirit from this wave of unhealthy delusion of New Age.

Indians got special role in this and special right to speak because they were specially affected by New Age mud as a whole cultural group, not just like individuals.

Actually, Cleargreen always have chance to change. Right now they can consider to stop perpetuating the lie and exploiting the Spirit and people who do mind to be exploited. They can gather the courage and start the dialog with humans like humans. They can explain their position and tell a tale of what all this was to them... Apologize... and ask if there is a way how we can relate after all this massive mud show.

They can do it, they are welcome...

Otherwise, why should we let them run the show if we see this is bad?

They can be stopped and recognized as a fraud by human laws.

I think the strategy i proposed is healthy and simple. I don't know how it will turn out to be and don't want to give too much thought to possible outcomes. Dalai Lama can be too politic, but i know it is good thing to write to him about this issue and i'll do it.

Lets give it a try... sincerely... 
« Last Edit: May 08, 2008, 02:59:13 pm by Ari »

Offline educatedindian

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Re: Cleargreen Cult
« Reply #19 on: May 08, 2008, 03:43:48 pm »
AH, I think quite a bit has been done regarding the Casteneda cult over the years. He's been exposed repeatedly more than any other fraud I can think of. What other exploiter has had a series of books, articles, and websites devoted to debunking him and showing his lies in as much detail as has been done to Castaneda? For all cults (not just Nuage ones) I think the only groups that have been exposed and combatted on the same scale are the Moonies and Scientology.

For Natives, understandably we want first and foremost to protect our own people and traditions. Holzwarth was making a series of incredibly disturbing claims that harmed and lied about a large group of tribes, Lakota, Navajo, Hopi, Chickaloon, even Australian Aboriginal. She personally caused a Native man to be beaten by the police, and then she used the man's blood in her offensive mockeries. Her claims were incredibly grandiose, pompous, and far reaching, so the Native community felt it had to act in a far reaching manner. After all, many of the people she preached to likely would have been allies of Native people, willing to take part in or help our struggles. Most of the people who went to her "prayerformances" were probably just naive, thinking they were going to see a cultural event, or honestly thinking they were taking part in something that would promote peace.

Honestly there is something particular about the Castaneda cult. I doubt I've ever seen a Castaneda-ist take part in anything to help other people, much less causes. Something about him and his books and cult attract very self involved people who use their intelligence as a shield against other people and prefer to live inside their own heads. Cleargreen is clearly harming them, but not nearly so much Native communities as the likes of Holzwarth are.

Offline Ari

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Re: Cleargreen Cult
« Reply #20 on: May 08, 2008, 09:04:12 pm »
Thanks for reply Al...

It feels that your opinion has this giving direction quality... Because exactly here, on this site we have chance to touch the core of New Age twist of reality. Boldly... As free from personal interests as it could be, yet down to practical earthy action.

Sadly it is a battle... with a fraud and abuse... which is nothing like joke and fun...

Again should say i truly was not aware of the issue of protest of Natives about  New Age dodgery. Knowing that Castanedian cult is abusive to human nature, i did not really know it has nothing to do with Indigenous mentality and culture. Actually for me all this abuse of humanness i was personally going through was connected with an image of an Indian. As for so many other people in the world who were not necessarily deeply involved into following Castanedaism, but learned to see Indian culture through drawn by Castaneda picture. Millions of people around the world were tricked to believe that this pictured by Castaneda fantastic character don Juan truly reflecting on Wisdom of Native Spirituality as a highest Wisdom of Native Culture.

As a foreigner i can say that Castaneda and his cult deeply affecting the way Native communities are seeing by people of other cultures. Which is, i think, one of the harshest outcomes of Castanedian enterprise.

Also it is giving such an attractive precedent for other exploiters wanna be Indians, who encouraged by Castanedian example, feeling so free to set their own little traps and don't mind to humiliate what they claim to be their treasured source, ignoring voices of protest.

Most of people falling for this traps and trapsters because they were confused by the fake image of Indian popularised by Castaneda and perpetuated now by insistent action of Cleargreen. Also exactly Castanedian fraud perpetuated now by Cleargreen giving this little trapsters such a righteous confidence that they can get away and even feel appreciated with whatever aggressive tyranny they could conceive referring to their roots in Native Spirituality.    If we could bring mass attention to the fact that Castaneda and Cleargreen are lying about their connection to Native Spirituality, people would be much more careful when they facing demand of another little pretender wishing to be accepted as authentic Native.

Also i think it will greatly contribute to the dialog and exchange between actual people of actual cultures, not playing pretentious games and delusions about each other.

It feels good!



 



« Last Edit: May 08, 2008, 09:08:03 pm by Ari »

Offline Thinker

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Re: Cleargreen Cult
« Reply #21 on: May 09, 2008, 12:11:47 am »
I think taking legal action is just one part of what has to be done...

Cleargreen is not only about making $$$ and celebrating the Castaneda, it's also about ripping off energy from tensegrity practicioners. I attended a workshop in Mexico City in February 1995, and when we were doing the "shaking pass" (which consists in shaking your body wildly and throwing out "disturbing" energy) a huge cloud came from behind and took with it the energy we released. I perceived it as being the spirits of Castaneda and his henchmen, who stole our energy.

I'm also sure that these standardized movements, for example described in the tensegrity book (by Castaneda, I forgot the title), or as shown in their videos, as being aimed at making the spirits or "energy bodies" (I'm sure there's a more adequate term among you) suitable for easier rendering them as prey for these energy vampires. For example, the "assemblage point" as described by Castaneda and as being used by tensegrity practicioners (there are specific movements in their system to handle it) doesn't exist naturally (and nobody who hasn't read Castaneda has ever seen it), it's an artefact they want you to produce in your aura (is this a better word?) in order to manipulate you and to steal your energy.

Of course, "stealing energy" is just a simply expression for something more complex, actually they get into your body and infiltrate it with their structures, in order to get more power, to have a broader base for their consciousness than just their individual body alone. (Which also happens when two or more people join voluntarily, when they share some spiritual energy, then all of them feel stronger. However, in the case of these criminals it's like annexion of our body/soul, into which they pour their ugly spirits.)

I've also seen things worse than that, maybe difficult to believe, but I hope to be able to contribute them here, for the time is right to put an end to their activity once and for all. In the moment they're attacked from all sides, pretty weak if compared to some months ago, so maybe a good moment for some of you warriors to help a little.

P.S.: I need to add this one observation which I just avoided because it might be hard to understand, but fact is that there is a Don Juan, who is not a Yaqui but one of Castaneda's cohorts, maybe a European because he also introduced himself to me as Caesar. Ok, I'm getting into a mess, let's make it short. Castaneda created a fictional character named Don Juan Matus for a certain person, one of his cohorts, and I was having quite a bit of interactions in visions with him (as well as with Castaneda and others of his cohorts), and a lot of these interactions showed me that he's evil, and one particular vision might be interesting to you:

I saw America, South and North, it was night, and Don Juan was a huge dark shadow (really huge), flying north and south above your contintent rapidly and repeatedly, skipping off the energy of its inhabitants (many of which are your Native people).

I don't know how you'll take this, or whether some of you have made a similar observation, also I'm not really sure whether this was a real vision that happened in the space as I saw it or whether it was a symbolic representation of what was going on, but fact is, and I have lots of evidence, that Don Juan (aka whoever uses this appearance) is a criminal whose activity has to be brought to an end.


Ari, sorry that I'm coming up with stuff you don't want to know about anymore, but your line of battle is just one among others, and maybe just the right thing for you to concentrate upon and leave the other lines to someone else, but I also wanted to let you know that you're not alone and that the other reality levels are going to be cleaned and cured, too. (And I'm happy and surprised that you're in such a good shape, that gives me lots of confidence, and is a good sign that their influence over others is just fading away.)

Offline garners

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Re: Cleargreen Cult
« Reply #22 on: May 11, 2008, 01:02:49 pm »
Cleargreen is an organization that is tied to (and still supported by the estate of) one of the originators of using Native American stereotypes to create shamanic role playing scenarios that confused people can easily access and play at.

Ari is asking this board for some help in protesting and stopping their false claims to Indian ancestry.
 And also to question their morbid use of dead and/or missing people as another part of  touting  their authenticity.

People doing Tensegrity are encouraged to role play as part of an ancient line of Indian sorcerers heading towards gaining power to shift dimensions and do incredible magical feats..
(like the previous 25 batches of old magical Indians.)

That Tensegrity is a continuation of one of the original exploiters should mean something as far as wanting to fight their abuse and appropriation.

I understand that discussing Tensegrity and Castaneda serves little to no purpose.

It has been discussed and it has been shown to be a ridiculous fraud.
And to keep discussing this tends to draw delusional nut cases here.

That is why .. while discussion of it serves no good..
acting against it has merit.

 Taking a few moments to complain to people hosting Tensegrity nonsense is not hard to do.

Nor is looking  into filing a complaint in Brittain that they are selling "magical passes" with false claims of ancient Indian ancestry.

If the new EU Consumer protection regulations are made law this month  it seems that groups like Tensegrity would have to prove that they came from ancient Indian sorcerers. Whereas before the complaintant against their business would have to disprove this claim.

Seems to me if this new consumer protection law goes into effect any claimant to Indianess selling ceremonies could be forced to prove the validity of their claims.
Not the other way around.

All it takes is some publicity that activists are using this law to draw attention to the problem of fraudulent new age Indians and the media will make a point of writing and reporting on it.

The more people see that there is a problem the more they can see that something should be done about it.
 Just like with other civil rights  and women's rights idssues.. it takes awareness to make change.
Awareness comes in large part by activists and people fired up by activists.. taking action.




« Last Edit: May 11, 2008, 01:09:05 pm by garners »

Offline Ari

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Re: Cleargreen Cult
« Reply #23 on: May 11, 2008, 06:54:54 pm »
Want to inform the board that i did not receive a reply to my last message to Shambhala yet.

apukjij

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Re: Cleargreen Cult
« Reply #24 on: May 11, 2008, 10:10:19 pm »
ari, i have linkages with the Shambala community, i was their liaison to the local Maliseet Elders when they wanted to bury a Peace Vase at the Old Maliseet Burial Ground in Fredericton, and i want to also follow up on this. There is a prominent Native professor on their council in fredericton, and with your permission, id like to contact them to inform them of the travesty that is happening at the Shambala Mountain Centre.

Offline Ari

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Re: Cleargreen Cult
« Reply #25 on: May 12, 2008, 02:27:16 am »
Hi apukjij,

Yes, sure, it would be very appropriate move to do. Please inform us on how it will go if you can.

Offline Ari

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Re: Cleargreen Cult
« Reply #26 on: May 14, 2008, 08:13:47 pm »
I posted it today  at Sustained Reaction intending to proceed with formulating charges against cleargreen fraud:



Oh God... how nice and clean here today... Feels gooood... People can breath in here!

Can enjoy uninterrupted energy flow, serenity of mind... look around to find a sight to contemplate upon...

So, what's up?

While we were brooming the place from the revelry of role playing individuals, what the sourcerers of cleargreen inc. were occupied with?

What have they done to this wonderful world where death is a hunter? What have they done to their wonderful followers? What have they done to those who pointing out on their errors? What have they done to those who feel bad as a result of what have been done? What have they done to the Spirit?

Cleargreen inc. did not answer any of my questions. The same as flock of TBs they can't discuss issues because they can't show any success in what they instructing people to do. For money... They also refused to take responsibility for providing me with requested refund.

They are busy to dream a community now... Dreamy community... When you dreaming in your mind of something so high, why pay due respect to the voice of individual protest, minding to contribute unrightfully and fraudulently ripped amount of money to prosperity of cherished dream of Carlos Castaneda and three female students of don Juan?

Why pay due respect to the voices of protest of Native people, minding Indian stereotype been used as a brand name for play pretend and insult Indians with misrepresentation of their true nature...

Why pay due respect to fulfilling well credited promises if you can just junk it all and shield your pettiness with a flock of TBs, ready to rage anybody out...



Offline Ari

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Re: Cleargreen Cult
« Reply #27 on: May 20, 2008, 04:45:47 pm »
Dirty raging letter of Cleargreen's fanatic follower to Shambhala Mountain Center was posted today at Sustained Reaction and deleted by administration.
The letter was throwing every possible dirt at people expressing protest against Cleargreen fraud.
The madness was obvious and speaking for itself... But, knowing that culties taking action, we need to be active too.
Your support is needed... Please write to Shambhala to support sane voice of protest against fraudulence. State your opinion. Even a short note will do. Voice of real Indians sure especially appreciated.

developmentdirector@shambhalamountain.org
« Last Edit: May 20, 2008, 04:47:40 pm by Ari »

Offline Ari

  • Posts: 39
Re: Cleargreen Cult
« Reply #28 on: May 28, 2008, 03:50:34 pm »
The law is in effect. Complaints can be filed.

http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si2008/uksi_20081277_en_1

"Misleading actions

5.-(1) A commercial practice is a misleading action if it satisfies the conditions in either paragraph (2) or paragraph (3).

(2) A commercial practice satisfies the conditions of this paragraph-

(a) if it contains false information and is therefore untruthful in relation to any of the matters in paragraph (4) or if it or its overall presentation in any way deceives or is likely to deceive the average consumer in relation to any of the matters in that paragraph, even if the information is factually correct; and

(b) it causes or is likely to cause the average consumer to take a transactional decision he would not have taken otherwise."




So, now all dishonest business people can be easily asked to take responsibilty...

In regards to Cleargreen inc., they advertising workshop in Great Britain this summer. All the ad material is going perfectly under the penalties of this new law.

We will go through this ad material point by point, but now i want to bring your attention to misleading by "it or its overall presentation in any way deceives or is likely to deceive the average consumer in relation to any of the matters in that paragraph, even if the information is factually correct; and
(b) it causes or is likely to cause the average consumer to take a transactional decision he would not have taken otherwise."


This is how cleargreen inc. picturing their session with the nagual Carlos and his unforgettable character... one can get high reading about such kinda cute little fella encouraging kids to dream good dreamy...

From cleargreen's advertisement of Bath workshop:



~unquestionable bodily knowledge that you are a dreamer. You feel you are a dreamer with all the cells of your body.

The Art of Dreaming

"What do you want?" the nagual Carlos Castaneda asked a group of students gathered in a movement studio in Santa Monica.
"What do you long for?" Florinda Donner-Grau asked them.
"You've been recapitulating, reviewing your lives, for some time. You now have energy…energy to dream…So I'm asking you the same question don Juan asked me, the same question I asked each of you when I first met you: 'What is your heart's desire?'"
The students paused for a moment.
"Maybe some don't remember that you asked them that before," Florinda Donner-Grau said to the nagual.
"It takes energy to pay attention," the nagual said, "to retain new information, or new questions. And it takes energy to know what you want-and even more energy to claim it! So-What do you want? Eh?"
"I want to dream!" exclaimed one student
"Dream what?" the nagual asked.
The student paused.
"I want to be part of a collaborative team that builds a community," another student said quietly, "where people can live well and they can… well, I don't know," she hesitated, "it's a really big dream…"
"What is it? Keep going!" said Florinda.
"Well, I'd like it to be able to generate its own power, and have fruit trees and vegetable gardens, and lots of community space, a place where everyone can participate in decisions, and where people don't have to work two jobs to pay their rent and feed their families."
"And?" questioned Florinda.
"And?" questioned the apprentice back. "Do I dare dream that?"
"Yes!" said Florinda and the nagual in unison.
Everyone laughed together.
"We get caught in our fear," the nagual said, "fear that we are not enough, or we fear that others will say 'No'! And we keep our dreams small."
"So, how are you getting along with your sister?" Florinda asked.
"My sister?" the student asked. "We're getting along okay," she stammered, "not too badly, fine."
"Really?" Florinda asked.
"Well, there's just this one thing. I really want her to come with her family and visit me in Los Angeles, and for several years now she just doesn't come."
"You mean she says No?" Florinda asked.
"Yes," said the student. "I always have to go and visit HER. But I wonder, what does this have to do with my dream?"
"Everything!" The nagual said. "If you want to get along in a community, you could start with getting along in the community of you and your sister-dreaming her, and your relationship with her."
"We are far more accustomed to nightmaring than to dreaming!" Florinda added.
"True," the nagual agreed. "Recently, we've been practicing the Plumed Serpent magical passes," he went on, "a mythic form allowing us the freedom to integrate earth and sky, the dreaming body and the self, recognizing that we are indeed in a dream. Now, let's learn its counterpart - The Singing Earth Serpent - a form designed to help us practice the art of specific dreaming…here and now, on this earth!"
The students spread themselves out in the room and began to move, following the movements of Florinda and the nagual, swaying from side to side, balancing from foot to foot, opening the breath and stirring centers that had long been dormant. At one point, while on the floor on their bellies, each student started to hum. Then they sat and hummed…stood and hummed…until finally the air around them was a vibrating mass of sound.
"What do you feel?" the nagual whispered after a lulling moment.
"That my insides are vibrating in tune with my outsides!" said one student
"I feel tingling in my cells," said another.
"I feel that we are all connected," said a third
"You are feeling your essence," the nagual said, "which is intent itself, vibrating, alive, delicious! Intent is affectionate, the organizing web of the universe. From here you can track the trail of intent in your life, and how it links with the trail of your lineage. You can begin to dream with purpose."
"All dreaming, in some way or other, is group dreaming," the nagual continued. "This takes us to the second gate of dreaming. We don't open up to a new dream in isolation. Even our thoughts are connected to others'. As don Juan pointed out to me, awareness is an actual environment, where information travels instantaneously, just as it does within any tensegrity system, from a single cell to the universe at large."
"Now, what about your sister? How do you feel now?" Florinda said to the student who had expressed her dream.
The student smiled, her eyes beaming: "Well, from this new place, this issue of her visiting is really not so important. I can go see her. My sister is really a great gift in my life-there are so many wonderful things we've done together…"
"Track those moments!" said the nagual, "stalk them-those events of 'YES!' Write them down! And share them. And focus on those events, where doors were opened, rather than focusing on the 'No' moments and getting in knots over them. Let those 'Yes' moments form the trail you follow with your sister, with everyone, with everything in your life."
"I want to feel this way, all the time," the student said.
"A part of you, a part of everyone here, HAS been feeling this way your entire life!" the nagual said. "You just didn't know how to access it consistently-that flame of infinity inside, reaching out to touch and intermingle with the dreams of others-those that are like yours and those that are different-interacting with all that infinite diversity. Yes!"~


And here is another picture of the session with the nagual Carlos and his dreams:

From notes of Corey Donovan:

" March 28, 1997, Dance Home, Santa Monica 8 - 9 PM

[All of Cleargreen, including Travis from Mexico, with the exception of Florinda, Barbara (the Moon Child) and Karina, were on hand, along with 13 of us from the Sunday class: Daniel, Larry, Paul, Greg, Marcos, Thorton, Virginia, Nina, Darby, Keith, Pablo, Kathleen Seligman and me.]

Bruce greeted us with the Star Trek "V" salute, saying "Hale-Bopp" as we arrived.

Castaneda started with a breath with square fists raised in front of the body at either side about shoulder level, then bringing them in so that the knuckles were facing out in front of the body, arms close together, for the inhale. Then exhaling out as you bring them out to the sides and look upward.

"I heard that several of the Heaven's Gate group had had themselves castrated some months before they 'left.' What is this? You need your balls to be able to journey. They were waiting for a spaceship to pick them up and take them to heaven. There is no heaven. Infinity is a constant battle, a struggle. There is no heaven where they're going to be taken care of, where everything is going to be made nice. This is the Flyers talking." Taisha mentioned that they had had quarters and five dollar bills packed near them. Kylie excitedly added that the brother of the actress who played Lt. Uhura on Star Trek was one of them. Castaneda said that the same issue of the Los Angeles Times that had so many articles about the cult "had on the cover a big picture of rituals for Easter in which people are acting out the crucifixion of Christ." Carol pointed out that it was on the cover of the "Life and Style" section. "The newspaper didn't seem to see any inconsistency in condemning the cultish behavior of this little group and celebrating this accepted cult and its rituals.

"The leader had been in a mental institution. We love that. So they cut off their balls so they didn't have to think about sex. To be pure. You need your balls. Don't cut off your balls.

"It's some weird mixture of awareness and technology, that they think awareness requires this advanced technology of the aliens. This idea that their pure souls, what was left from their bodies, was going to be 'collected by the mothership' reminds me of China, when they used to have someone come around each morning collecting the shit. 'Any shit today?' People would be paid for their shit, because they'd use it for fertilizer. Here they have the idea that the spacecraft is coming down to collect our shitty souls.

"It's like the way they killed monkeys where I grew up. They'd build these cement holes and put nuts in them. The holes were just big enough for the monkeys to put their hands in, but not big enough to pull their fists out. I saw it: the next morning you find these monkeys with their hands bloodied. Sometimes they manage to break their fists and pull them out, but they can't let go of the nuts. We're like that. We're not willing to let go of this little thing we see--these little idealities. We grab and hold on and they take us to our deaths, just like the monkeys.

"Travis has changed a lot. He can't be Memmo. They've got Memmo by the balls, his parents and his family and everybody. Memmo works for them all." Nury piped up, "And now he works for us!"

"You'd be happy if your family wasn't in your life. That would make it easy. So pretend they're not. If they call you, don't answer. If they send you a letter, don't respond. That's hard for us to do. We're just trained--what a horrible thing not to respond to a letter. But it's . . . it's wonderful, to get a letter and not even read it. Just look and see if there's a check in it, and throw the rest away. So if you get a letter from your parents, just don't read it.

"He [travis] found the sacred lake where the Dalai Lama goes to meditate that the other one [meaning Tony Karam] couldn't get to. But Travis had no problem. And they don't like him because he's not even spiritual. I'm sending him a load of energy. He's become Travis McGee. Memmo--I don't give a shit about Memmo. Memmo's not going anywhere. But Travis McGee is a big question mark." He gestured behind himself and said, "We're not a group. There are weird genetic connections," then gestured to Nury, "That one. It's not that I own her. It's not like your parents who think that they own you. Like Lorenzo's father Morton, who hasn't seen him in 30 years but calls when he realizes he's getting close to dying. Then the great scene the following day when he calls to tell Lorenzo to get some things and to tell him to charge him for them, and he keeps calling him 'Joshua,' which is the name of his son by another marriage."

"Lorenzo had asked me if he should get together with his dad, and I told him, 'Sure. He's not your father anymore. You've changed. You can be with him and be completely unaffected.'

"It's because the Blue Scout is a horrendous being, because she moves so fast. It's not just because of the genetic connection. If that's all there was, go fuck yourself. I don't care about that. It's the fact that she's such a fighter and moves so fast. That's what has me delighted, and gives me no end of pleasure.

"Travis found some Mexican curios, made of orange peels, that spell out 'Tensegrity.' They look like something that belong on a Mexican shrine, for the Virgin of Guadalupe. Hey, we should sell a Virgin of Guadalupe that says 'Tensegrity' on it! The Germans would love it. They'd buy them. And since French won't be allowed to the workshop, we'll have Germans and Dutch. They'll buy all these little trinkets." Zaia said she would buy one. Someone wanted to see it, so Talia said they'd bring it in the next day. Nury suggested that he find some cheap shoes they could sell, and that they call them "Travis T's." Castaneda joked they could be pointy on top, to keep off the Flyers, and someone suggested "steel pointed tips."

"As Pope Carlos the first, I should sell indulgences. Wouldn't you like to buy an indulgence," he spoke toward Nury and Zaia. "For an indulgence, you could eat anything. Anything!" Lorenzo piped up, "Indulgences for indulgence, huh?"

"Memmo is this fat creature, and Travis isn't. But there's still this fat other creature."

"Nyei, when we're on the phone, has this computer that starts quacking." Fabricio started laughing, guiltily, since he must have been the one who selected quacks as the error signal. "But she's really malicious. I'll ask her, 'Nyei, is that you?' and I'll hear her quack too, but she does it in a lower voice, it's not the nice, pleasant quack of the computer. It's the voice of 'Frank.'"

For about 10 minutes we were practicing on our own and chatting. I talked to Greg and Keith, and then chatted with Carol, because Castaneda was talking with Nury, after he gave her a kiss.

In the last 15 minutes, he had us practicing the long form, which had had some modifications since I saw him do it two weeks earlier. I couldn't do the jumping parts of it very well.

"I'm going that way, and I'm not asking you to follow, but how great it would be if you could go there too. But it requires remaking yourselves." -Carlos Castaneda


So, in this instance, Cleargreen inc. will have to prove that they pictured Castaneda and their relation with him not in misleading average consumer way to influence his(her) decision to buy the service.



« Last Edit: May 28, 2008, 04:09:17 pm by Ari »

Offline Ari

  • Posts: 39
Re: Cleargreen Cult
« Reply #29 on: June 18, 2008, 03:07:35 am »
I did it. The complaint is filed, administration of the Bath University is informed and asked to give contemplation to the issue of hosting unfair trader's enterprise.

I guess Cleargreen was contacted and questioned because the content of their ad of Bath workshop has been changed lately. This story from the ad of the workshop, i quoted in the previous post, was shortened. This is how it looks now:

"# You feel you are a dreamer with all the cells of your body. -- The Art of Dreaming

"What do you want?" the nagual Carlos Castaneda asked a group of students gathered in a movement studio in Santa Monica.
"You've been recapitulating, reviewing your lives, for some time. You now have energy…energy to dream…So I'm asking you the same question don Juan asked me, the same question I asked each of you when I first met you: 'What is your heart's desire?'"
The students paused for a moment.
"I want to dream!" excitedly exclaimed one student
"Dream what?" asked the nagual.
"I want to be part of a collaborative team that builds a community," she said. "Where people can live well and they can… Well, I don't really know,??? she suddenly hesitated, interrupting herself.. “It's a really big dream...I'd like it to be able to generate its own power, and have fruit trees and vegetable gardens, and lots of community space, a place where everyone can participate in decisions.???
"And?" questioned the nagual.
"And?" questioned the apprentice back. "Do I dare dream that?"
"Yes!" said the nagual laughing. "We get caught in our fear – fear that we are not enough; fear that others will say 'No'! And we keep our dreams small...We are far more accustomed to nightmaring than to dreaming!...Let’s brush this habit aside and practice a magical pass - The Singing Earth Serpent - a form designed to help us practice the art of specific dreaming…here and now, on this earth!"
The students spread themselves out in the room and began to move, following the movements of the nagual.
"What do you feel?" the nagual whispered after a lulling moment.
"That my insides are vibrating in tune with my outsides!" said one student
"I feel tingling in my cells," said another.
"...That we are all connected," said a third
"You are feeling your essence," the nagual said, "which is intent itself, vibrating, alive, delicious! Intent is affectionate, the organizing web of the universe. From here you can track the trail of intent in your life, your moments of YES! and share them and follow others like them with purpose.
"I want to feel this way, all the time," one student said.
"A part of you, a part of everyone here, HAS been feeling this way your entire life!" the nagual said. "You just didn't know how to access it consistently – that flame of infinity inside, reaching out to touch and intermingle with the dreams of others – those that are like yours and those that are different – interacting with all that infinite diversity. Yes!"


Other content of the ad was changed and shortened as well... to the minimum... a lot of pathetically ecstatic posing is removed now.
Anyhow, passes are still called magical and they still claimed to come from Old Wise Indian. Though Greens starting to shift the attention away from Native origin it seems, not playing with it so confidently...   
« Last Edit: June 18, 2008, 06:31:25 pm by Ari »