NAFPS Forum
General => Member Introductions => Topic started by: Tsisqua on April 11, 2008, 09:34:16 pm
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Hello....
It has been brought to my attention that I have failed to introduce myself...and for that I am deeply ashamed and will do my best to correct....so I ask you to please accept my apologies.
People call me Tsisqua...or Tsissy...my real name is unimportant...as I find many of the issues we all deal with, are better kept AWAY from our personal lives....and since I have a family...with little ones...I will not put that at risk.
Most people here, already know from some of my past postings...I run the NAU site...and also created it...it is now maintained by myself along with a board of 12 other Native people. This site came about due to a need for a place where native people could gather, in respect...as equals...due to much abuse our people were suffering at the hands of many other sites on the web.
Our address is:
http://www.freewebs.com/americanunitymovement/
NAU Yahoo Group:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NAU_NativeAmericanUnity/
NAU Community Network:
http://nativeamericanunity.ning.com/
NAU Native Singles Network:
http://nausinglesnetwork.ning.com/
NAU Forum:
http://nativeamericanunity.aceboard.com/
We have a huge mailing list of members...which is steadily growing daily...however, we are not all interested in being vocal towards the wrongs inflicted on our people at NAU...but many of us are...our member list consists of ndn people...some enrolled....some not...some who wish to gain information on various subjects...some who wish to be more involved...and indeed, some who simply want a place to come to.....and we are always open to suggestions on how to improve our site.
We have many chat rooms on site...including youth rooms...and we arrange weekly times to meet there...we are not a dating site...more of an informative site, and a place for native unity.
We also run a NAIS program...(Native American Inmate Support)...of which many members actively get involved in....NAIS has been ongoing for the past 6 years now...and we reach as many of our brothers and sisters in the Iron House as we possibly can...also encouraging others to do the same through supportive letters...to the inmates and their family members....also by speaking out against the injustice many of our people face whilst incarcerated...ie lack of spiritual freedom, etc.
A large body of our members are actively involved in American Indian Injustices...also Animal Rights...and we regularly send out alerts via our mailing list to make sure our members are fully aware of new cases...and indeed how they can help on these matters...as too are we alerted to many cases via our members...and sometimes by non members....working together to make changes for our people is our goal...creating a unified voice of many ndn people from various...and indeed all ndn nations....is our goal....supporting our people and raising our voices where possible....is our goal.
We are a 100% free site...all the work we do is 100% free and on our own time. We do not ask for donations to maintain our site...and nor will we ever ask for such. Choosing Freeweb as our host....was a statement in itself. It was to show that a Native Site CAN be free....we do not believe in taking money from our people....as my previous posting regarding Tribal America hopefully shows.
Our board members are as follows:
Myself (Keetoowah Band of Tsalagi)
Blade (San Carlos Apache/Cherokee....my cousin)
Skylar (San Carlos Apache/Cherokee....my cousin)
Da'Quah (Mohawk)
Juan (Pawnee)
Alfie (Quinault/White)
Lucas (Quinault)
Jared (Flathead/Blackfoot)
Consoni (White Mountain Apache)
Clint (Onieda/Mohawk/White)
Marcus (Haidian)
(edited to remove two board members who are currently being replaced 06/26/08)
Either of our board members can be reached at our NAU office address of NativeAmericanUnity@gmail.com (edited to change email address)
I do not wish to mislead anyone....I say office...but in actual fact we work from many places...although we all avail of the main office email address...as we are all from various nations and locations.
We are basically a large body of Native People doing the best we can to speak up when needed....and to create a unity within our people. Blood quantum is not an issue with NAU...and will never become an issue....although we obviously draw the line at fakes posing as Native people.
I do not know what else to say here...except that again...I apologize for not introducing myself sooner....and I feel shame that I have not done so thus far...I can assure you this was not intentionally done through ignorance.
With Respect,
Tsissy
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Ulihelisdi oniyiyu Tsisqua! :) (Welcome Late Bird!)
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Ayv adalihelitsedi Waya.....wado
(I appreciate Wolf...thank you)
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Hi Tsisqua and welcome
I'm sorry if my behind the scenes nudge for you to introduce yourself made you feel ashamed - It's only because you seem to be bringing up your Native American Unity group in other threads, and that wasn't the place to discuss this.
It was this request that these people in a sensitive situaltion contact you at your office e that initially got my attention.
http://jayfulton.wordpress.com/2008/04/06/grandmother_peace_drum_and_pepper-spray/ (http://jayfulton.wordpress.com/2008/04/06/grandmother_peace_drum_and_pepper-spray/)
NAU ~ Native American Unity Says:
April 10, 2008 at 11:45 am
Hartman deetz could you please contact our office at NativeAmericanUnity_Office@yahoo.com
We would appreciate it greatly…with thanks,
NAU
So, let me make sure I understand this ;
There really isn't an office. That was just a figure of speech . This NAU is an online group with a large membership ( you mentioned over 19,000 people in another thread ) and this group and website are run by a bunch of completely anonymous people that will only give their first names, and people just have to trust that everybody is who they say they are.
You mentioned that ;
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1513.0;all (http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1513.0;all)
Re: Suraj Holzwarth aka White Eagle Medicine Woman
« Reply #32
Tsisqua
before I opened NAU...we already had over 7000 members of various other groups which we incorporated into NAU
I did a bit of digging, and found a cached page dated March 1 2008 . It is of one of the main pages of your message board .
http://209.85.173.104/search?q=cache:pmINyEKeP5EJ:nativeamericanunityforum.theiforum.com/
native-american-unity-forum-c1.html+%22native+american+unity%22&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=12&gl=ca (http://209.85.173.104/search?q=cache:pmINyEKeP5EJ:nativeamericanunityforum.theiforum.com/
native-american-unity-forum-c1.html+%22native+american+unity%22&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=12&gl=ca)
At the bottom you will see ;
Our users have posted a total of 122 articles
We have 18 registered users
The newest registered user is Juan Wildcat-Hall
In total there is 1 user online :: 0 Registered, 0 Hidden and 1 Guest [ Administrator ] [ Moderator ]
Most users ever online was 4 on Mon Jan 21, 2008 12:09 pm
Registered Users: None
So if you had 7000 members before you even opened NAU why doesn't even a small fraction of this 7000 - 19,000 members show up posting on your message board?
What "various other groups " did these members that got incorporated into NAU come from?
You say the NAU is just for Native people but how do you know for sure if anyone is Indian if you only know them on line ? - and for that matter- as you all are anonymous how can anyone know that about you ? Being able to write something in a Native language only proves whoever wrote it learned to say a few things in that language or copied a quote they liked from somewhere ...
I'm really sorry to be suspisous, but what you are saying does seem a bit odd.
I'm a bit puzzled how your group will bring about "Native American Unity" if everyone involved is anonymous. Actually the idea seems kind of funny. I guess it could really all be people in India ... LOL ...But ok ...
A bit more digging and I see the concept of a "Native American Unity " group seems to have begun at the Tribal America group you started a thread on . You mentioned this group was a website owned by people in India ...
This is actually quite bizarre considering these people are not Native people ... and they are making plans to organize the "Native American community" AND the plans are all copyrighted and owned by non natives calling themselves Tribal America !!!!!!!
http://209.85.173.104/search?q=cache:LEuMeo7nTXgJ:www.tribalamerica.com/nau.html+%22native
+american+unity%22&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=2&gl=ca (http://209.85.173.104/search?q=cache:LEuMeo7nTXgJ:www.tribalamerica.com/nau.html+%22native
+american+unity%22&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=2&gl=ca)
http://209.85.173.104/search?q=cache:0fp1Bn9p3n8J:www.tribalamerica.com/cgi-bin/fp.pl%3Ffn%3Df
%26tp%3D2006%26m%3D+%22native+american+unity%22&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=3&gl=ca (http://209.85.173.104/search?q=cache:0fp1Bn9p3n8J:www.tribalamerica.com/cgi-bin/fp.pl%3Ffn%3Df
%26tp%3D2006%26m%3D+%22native+american+unity%22&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=3&gl=ca)
And I see you were involved in setting up the intial group called NAU and it seems to be a affiliate or a franachise of Tribal America.
http://209.85.173.104/search?q=cache:4OIbc1Ubm6kJ:www.tribalamerica.com/cgi-bin/fp.pl%3Ffn%
3Df+%22native+american+unity%22+Tsisqua&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=ca (http://209.85.173.104/search?q=cache:4OIbc1Ubm6kJ:www.tribalamerica.com/cgi-bin/fp.pl%3Ffn%
3Df+%22native+american+unity%22+Tsisqua&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=ca)
Could you explain what NAU connections were and are with Tribal America and how this evolved or came to be seperate entities ?
It's not that I see any problem with your website ( though most of it I can't access because I don't download plug ins ) and I don't see a problem wanting to anonymously put together accurate information for Native people on a website - I'm just not sure how a bunch of completely anonymous people on the internet are a safe rallying point for " Native Unity" ?
I hope you see what I am feeling concerned about. It does seem a bit odd ...
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This NAU is an online group with a large membership ( you mentioned over 19,000 people in another thread ) and this group and website are run by a bunch of completely anonymous people that will only give their first names, and people just have to trust that everybody is who they say they are.
Incidently...if you notice any thread I have mentioned NAU on...the membership number has gone up over time...as over time we have gained more members. I am not expecting anyone to trust in anything I say...or indeed NAU has to say...trust is a thing earned....and I am in no hurry. As for remaining annoymous...that is our right...do all members here post their real names? And addresses as you suggested I did here? We have lives...and families...people take us as they find us...we are not claiming to be anything other than ndn people doing the best we can....we have already had most of our site closed down due to attacks from frauds...we have had our forum hacked...which is now closed down...we have had fake pages set up in our names...we have received many threats via email...many of us have little ones...so why on earth would we be expected to give out our addresses and real names?
So if you had 7000 members before you even opened NAU why doesn't even a small fraction of this 7000 - 19,000 members show up posting on your message board?
We have no message board/forum as it was hacked and closed down. If you managed to attain this information...I am certain you too obtained my specific request on the forum for MORE MEMBERS TO JOIN AND POST. Our forum was particularly slow....99% of all our correspondance is via bulk emailing from our site....and in all honesty with our forum...it seemed as though mainly admin posted there...which was not really an issue since many of our members belong to other groups and forums also.
(Added: By the IP number on the address you provided as a cached section of our forum...I notice you were a daily visiter of our forum...and you would also know that the membership and posters had sufficiently grown by the time our forum was hacked...just an observation....infact your IP was banned several times as you were visiting our forum many many times a day without becomming a member or posting...and we presumed you were something to do with RNS...I also find this highly strange that we at NAU have come into question by you at a time when RavenCrow has been sending us emails trying to gain information from us...to no avail...are these things linked??)
Could you explain what NAU connections were and are with Tribal America and how this evolved or came to be seperate entities ?
Please see the thread in FRAUDS under Tribal America...of which yourself posted on.
You know...I have no wish to sit here quoteing every little thing you say and responding...I have nothing to prove here...I am not here scoring points...I am simply doing the very best I can...I did not realize I was under investigation here...I did however months ago contact Frederica with regards to who I am...and who I am not...and this seemed sufficient for admin.
If my trying to help support our people...and my speaking out against injustice offends you or causes you to be suspicious of me...then the same may be said for anyone posting here.
If my wish and the wishes of NAU staff to remain annoymous causes you to doubt our intentions and raises concerns...the same can be said for anyone posting here who do not give out their personal details.
I post here to help....to also gain knowledge myself...as others do...nothing more. I am not asking people for anything...Im just trying to do the very best I can.
With respect,
Tsissy
Added on: After some thought on the matter...I would like to add the following:
Re: Ravencrow and RNS Admin Throw a Fit on: March 21, 2008
Posted by Moma Porcupine:
A lot of people who post on this message board do so anonymously, and people often do have good reasons for wanting to be anonymous. Especially on this board where people who post under their real names can be subjected to some truely nasty retaliation. But if people want to be anonymous in cyberspace they need to be the ones who take reasonable precautions to remain that way.
The whole question of privacy and when people cross the line in revealing information is tricky, but in this situation, clearly the only real victim is the reputation of the mainly conscientious and responsible people, who post here, and put themselves at risk to warn the public about people who lie and take advantage of them.
And a section of a PM from Moma Porcupine:
Posting removed by request
I chose option B...since I have no desire to give out personal details of any of our members...or indeed my own personal information...since we regularly come under attack...and also since we all have families and little ones...giving out private personal information is a big no no....and if it is good enough for people here to do...well its good enough for us...So...I did what was requested on option B...to still be ripped apart. It seems this was a mere ploy to get me into a confrontation...about what exactly..I have yet to discover...NAU is exactly what is states it is...we make no false claims...we take nothing from our people...and we work hard at all we do....and we are not here to boast about who we are...nor do we claim to be anything we are not.
I'm a bit puzzled how your group will bring about "Native American Unity" if everyone involved is anonymous. Actually the idea seems kind of funny.
Does Native Unity only exist when people give out personal details? Is this your explaination of Native Unity? Is Unity not about many people supporting each other and standing together as a body of people with no prejudice? My bad....I thought it was.
I see this topic has reached the pages of RNS pretty fast also...seems many people jump on the train to try to discredit people who simply try to do the right thing....but I am looking into the sources.
I know Frederica has asked that this subject be dropped...but when accusations are made...and the credibility of a site/group/people are being called into question...I feel they should be permitted to reply to the finger pointing of others. Incidently...our site stats have tripled today...and our membership additions have been higher than usual today....so I guess those who are actually Native people...those who wish for unity...have no issue with what we do.
With respect,
Tsissy
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As for remaining annoymous...that is our right...do all members here post their real names? And addresses as you suggested I did here?
Tsisqua - In a PM I asked if you had an actual office, as you claimed, and asked if you did if you would give an address. If you had a real office , representing so many Native people presumably the address wouldn't be private. I also said I understood if you wanted to remain anonymous - as long as it was clear you were just a website run by anonymus people who could be anyone - My concern was you seemed to be presenting yourself as if you have an office with a staff of real people which had the job of reprsenting 19,000 real American Indians. Sorry for the misunderstanding.
Quote (me)
Could you explain what NAU connections were and are with Tribal America and how this evolved or came to be seperate entities ?
Quote Tsisqua
Please see the thread in FRAUDS under Tribal America...of which yourself posted on.
I only posted in that thread asking for clarification because what you were saying was hard to understand. Which has nothing to do with the question about NAU beginings and affiliation with Tribal America , a question which you did not answer.
If my wish and the wishes of NAU staff to remain annoymous causes you to doubt our intentions and raises concerns...the same can be said for anyone posting here who does not give out their personal details.
That's absolutely true, I even started a topic on this at the top orf "Research needed". On the other hand , there is quite a few people involved in this website who can be verified to be real people who are affiliated with real Native communities. If everybody was completely anonymous here it would rightly be a lot harder to gain anyones trust.
I post here to help....to also gain knowledge myself...nothing more. I am not asking people for anything...Im just trying to do the very best I can.
I would guess as long as you aren't misrepresenting who you are, and it is clear that you could be anybody, that you have no office, and it is clear that 19,000 Native people in your group may be 19 people who each have 1000 email accounts, whatever you can do to help under those circumstances will probably be appreciated.
I am also posting here anonymously, but what I do here doesn't promote my own website or on line group , or even anything I am doing in another on line group, so it is a bit different.
I'm sorry to be so skeptical , it is what we do here.
( added - I have no idea what you are talking about me coming to your website too often)
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Moma Porcupine, I have read your posts here for several years, and i have yet to see you post who you are. Anonymity is often important to avoid repercussions in exposing frauds and abusers. I do not understand why you are pushing Tsisqua so hard; she is not "promoting" anything except a website where native folks can gather and discuss issues, for FREE. She is posting on her site to enlist additional support to stop fraud and abuse; if she can add additional voices to our members, what is wrong with that? You have previously stated that your personal credentials are unimpressive; how then do you judge the authenticity of another without time in the community of the person you are scrutinizing? You have done a lot of good work on this site in my opinion, yet i also personally know at least one formerly valued member here who left due to your heavyhandedness. I urge you to think about your approach carefully. A witchhunt mentality is counterproductive to our purpose here.....truth will always rise to the surface in time. There are some here who are not what they seem to be; that has always been the case, and eventually the truth emerges. By their fruits you shall know them....the knife cuts both ways.
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PS Moma_Porcupine, I looked for your introduction on the site and was unable to find one, perhaps you could direct me to it? Wadv....
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Hi wolfhawaii
I have never introduced myself.
I don't want to give personal details so I don't see the point .
Yes I post here anonymously, but I am not doing anything to draw people into a different website away from the scurtiny of the people here. There are many other people posting here who aren't anonymous, and presumably even if I'm not trustworthy, at least some of them are, and they will probably say something if I get out of line.
So my posts here are probably less of a hazard than an anonymous person trying to attract people to an on line group called Native American Unity where everyone running it is anonymous.
As for the person you feel I was too heavy handed with - I imagine you are reffering to Joseph. It seems a lot of people come to this board to gain credibiltiy for some other enterprise. If someone is here and is criticizing people for abusing Cherokee traditions and on the side advertising Cherokee healing with energy hand and crystal work , dream interpretation spiritual and emotional guidence for $50 an hour - as this forum member was -
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1003.0 (http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1003.0)
sorry I am not going to turn a blind eye and pretend that's not going on ..... And if we did that here this website would be over run with frauds and exploiters in no time .
And I don't think I was exactly "heavy handed " i just posted what he was doing in "Research needed" . If you think what I did was unnecessary you are welcome to go say so in that thread.
I don't think what we do here would be served if we criticize some people for doing something, and then we turn a blind eye if our forum members do the same thing.
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Yes I post here anonymously, but I am not doing anything to draw people into a different website away from the scurtiny of the people here. There are many other people posting here who aren't anonymous, and presumably even if I'm not trustworthy, at least some of them are, and they will probably say something if I get out of line.
Moma Porcupine...with respect...I am not trying to draw members away from here...if anything I am trying to BRING MORE people here....why on earth would I wish to draw people away? I dont even understand the remark. We have advertisements for NAFPS on many places on our site asking members to come here to give support...we have also requested members to come here via our bulk mailing system...we also have an advertisement on our MySpace page blog asking our members and readers to come here to show support...also on our yahoo 360 page...of which are clear and visable....just as we ask members to support NARF and their local AIM chapter....perhaps you simply do not understand what I am about...and as I have already said...trust is a thing earnt...I have as long as it takes...I am in no hurry.
With respect,
Tsissy
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Tsisqua
I am not trying to draw members away from here
I meant you are trying to attract people to your website, and by your being a part of this forum and seeming to be associated with NAFPS , some people might have the impression that you and your website are accepted as legit in the Native community. Maybe they are. I don't know. My point is, some people try to use this website and want to seem like they are part of the good that is done here, but it turns out it is only for self promotion.
I wasn't concerned at all until I saw you post trying to attract those vulnerable young people into an interaction with your group , claiming you had an office and 19,000 members, which I doubted was true. That made my alarm bells go off.
As people say, time will tell and trust is earned, but people shouldn't presume people who they don't know are trustworthy.
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Perhaps it is just my Cherokee need for balance, but it doesn't seem fair that you, Moma Porcupine, take Tsisqua to task for not having written an introduction until now, when you have not done so for all the years you have been on here. You can do an intro that does not disclose your identity if you have those concerns. We know so little about you yet we see your many posts and newcomers feel as if you are an authority, even though you have occasionally stated that your credentials are unimpressive. In Cherokee communities it is assumed that people who are still acquiring competency will speak less and listen more; i have seen this value in other Indian communities also.
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Moma Porcupine, I have read your posts here for several years, and i have yet to see you post who you are. Anonymity is often important to avoid repercussions in exposing frauds and abusers. ...... yet i also personally know at least one formerly valued member here who left due to your heavyhandedness. I urge you to think about your approach carefully.
It is not considered good form to use others to validate oneself, but there are connections that people of a common heritage have that allows others to know where they fit in. Language is one way. Cultural norms are another very important way. Geographic location is another. I know where Lost City is...do you? I do not "know" Tsisqua since she is anonymous, but it is entirely possible that i may have met her since i used to live in UKB country. I acknowledged her in a common language and she responded appropriately. This can be done in English as well but English is a slippery language unlike Cherokee. I have not seen anybody use their NAFPS membership to validate themselves in other ventures, but as you raise the possibility it makes me wonder why you are here and how you have so much time to devote to this site. Indians know that communication happens on multiple levels; there is a saying....listen, or your tongue will make you deaf! You said....."There are many other people posting here who aren't anonymous, and presumably even if I'm not trustworthy, at least some of them are, and they will probably say something if I get out of line. "
With love and respect....consider it said.
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You know I am from an era and remember the pain well,when raising awareness meant camping out on a strangers floor,crippling yourself with phone bills and relying on the kindness of non indian peoples who just wanted to do the right thing.
Not all non indian peoples with an interest in our peoples are frauds and not all indians doing their bit are either,some manners are in order right now.
You note Momma Porcupine i don't use a tag,I have a name and i am not ashamed of it,its been around and wandering the halls of the UN a lot of years,I don't google,facebook or my space better things to be doing quite frankly.
No one cares if who ever has an office only you,get some prospective.
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There is some big differences between anonymously collecting information off the internet, showing what people are advertising, who they say they are and how that fits with what tribal leaders have to say about those things, and anonymously hosting a website for socializing - which also claims to monitor everyone 24/7 while they do so, and includes chat rooms for youth.
As for what I do here, ( and why is this about me - I am not trying to promote anything )I may post a lot, but I have never misrepresented myself.
I have asked the people involved with this site, who I know aren't exploiters, or quietly supporting exploiters, to let me know if I ever take away from the purpose of this site. If any of them ever want to ask me to tone it down or completely shut up, I would be very happy to do so.
And wolfhawaii - don't blame me if I posted an advertisement showing someone who happened to be you supporting a questionable person . I never pointed out this person was you and it was an publicly advertised event.
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Sometimes it's just a difference in how people present things. I don't think individuals are in question, but sometimes people question the methods they use. I remember when American Indian Injustice group was started. They were sending out Alerts to all the different lists. Many didn't appreciate it, and had them stop. The lists felt they were being spammed. As they had read the items on other lists anyway, and felt it was old news. The idea may be good, but sometimes it all in presentation. And you know as well as I everyone's perception may be a little different. So they ask questions. It may have to do with personalities, but it's not personal. That's what makes it hard on a computer. So let's easy up for a while.
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Moma Porcupine....You know...I fail to understand why you did not take this line of questioning with RavenCrow when she was here blowing her own trumpet and treating others with disrespect...also claiming she owned RNS...which she does not....RNS are annoymous...infact this is the info they are willing to give...
Admins are: Baby Chelle, Bobby and Raven Crow aka knightcrowwatching
Funny how they Charge and ASK for money...also sell cermonial items to non natives on their site...yet you have not called them into question?...but you call NAU and myself into question as we TOO are annoymous...yet we do NOT accept money...donations...we maintain NAU out of our own pockets...and work on our own time.
Now if the Admin here at NAFPS wish me to remove our advertisements asking our members and readers to visit here in support....I will do so without a second thought. Nothing we place on our site can validate NAU....only how we deal with others...only the trust people build up due to their dealings with us....only through our keeping our word...can show who we are.
Yes our chat rooms are monitored 24/7.....and that is as it should be. IF you read my posting on Tribal America in the fraud section...you will see my biggest complaint was the abuse of our people by non native people...abuse that was permitted to happen and was charged a membership free for....we have assured all our members THIS will not happen at NAU...and we intend to keep our word....now....is that wrong of me? What terrible people we all are eh.
Moma Porcupine...with respect....you are entitled to your personal opinion of me...and of NAU...and I have no issue with that whatsoever....infact im becomming quite used to it....your PM to me did however give the impression you were part of the admin here....of which I can post if need be....you took a highly authorative tone...even asking me to PM other admin to tell them WHO I AM......of which...as I have already explained...I did some months ago when I came across my name in the NAFPS forum (Yahoo Group)...and forgive me if Im wrong...but there did not seem to be an issue with admin at the time.
I will again clarify what NAU IS and what it is NOT:
WE DO NOT: Permit abuse of our people in our chat rooms....all offenders are removed and banned on the spot....which is as it should be to keep chat safe and abuse free....as we value our members and friends.
WE DO NOT: Ask for membership fees or donations of ANY kind for NAU
WE DO NOT: Promote ourselves as people in any shape or form...as NAU is about unity and all Native people being treated as equal....it is not about 'who Tsisqua is and what she does'....nor is it about anyone else...there is no 'I' in'We'.
WE DO NOT: Sell ceremony, ceremonial items or promote such.
WE DO NOT: Give out members personal information...or indeed our own.
WE DO: Offer free membership
WE DO: Offer free chatrooms that are abuse free...that are monitored to keep it that way
WE DO: Offer as much information on site as possible...as we update our pages regularly...and are always open to the thoughts and views of our members as to how we can make the site a better place...more informative etc.
WE DO: Allow members to submit their own additions to our pages...as NAU is again...about unity and all members being treated as equal
WE DO: Send out regular updates via our bulk mailing system to keep members informed of all changes to the site...updates...new pages...new feature pages...chat times...causes to support etc
WE DO: The very best we can for our people.
As I said above....people will...and indeed do gain their own impression of who we are by the way we run NAU...and in our dealings with others...trust is a thing earnt...as is respect....I do not use this site to promote NAU as you claim...YOU asked me to state here who NAU is...and WHAT NAU is...of which I have done...to which you seem to have turned it back around as a means to finger point....if you Moma Porcupine are entitled to remain annoymous...so is every other poster on this board...regardless of who they are.
Incidently...the IP number of the cached section of our forum you posted...if this is not your own....then I would like to know WHO it belongs to...as this is an IP number we had to repeatedly ban from our forum for lurking...perhaps someone sent you the cached page and asked you to call NAU into question...who knows...since you claim you did not repeatedly come into our forum daily etc...all I can gather from that is the IP belongs to the person who sent you the page....which rings many alarm bells for me since we were hacked....and our forum is now closed on site.
I have respect for all posters here...including yourself...and that has not changed...but if people feel I am not welcome here...I will of course cancel my membership without another word. I come here to gain knowledge...to learn...to help....nothing more.
With Respect,
Tsisqua
Additional note: My apologies frederica....you posted your comment as I was writing my own...and I did not see it until after I posted...my intention is not to drag this on...but to clear up some points regarding NAU...since we are being called into question.
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I think she just asked some questions, about numbers and presentation. All the rest was not in question. Now can we give it a rest.
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As for what I do here, ( and why is this about me - I am not trying to promote anything )I may post a lot, but I have never misrepresented myself.
I have asked the people involved with this site, who I know aren't exploiters, or quietly supporting exploiters, to let me know if I ever take away from the purpose of this site. If any of them ever want to ask me to tone it down or completely shut up, I would be very happy to do so.
And wolfhawaii - don't blame me if I posted an advertisement showing someone who happened to be you supporting a questionable person . I never pointed out this person was you and it was an publicly advertised event.
Why it is about you is that you show no sense of selflimitation or responsibility. The link you posted had already been posted by EducatedIndian on the Ely thread.
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Tansi;
As one who has felt the attacks of the individual who identifies as "Moma Porcupine," I can easily understand why it is that there are some who believe that this site promotes "Witch Hunts." I chose to use my own name, in spite of the risks of exposing personal information, on the highly dubious internet. As I also live in an Aboriginal community, in the northern part of Saskatchewan, I am familiar with some aspects of my Culture that may not be put up on the internet.
I also am highly suspicious of anything that is posted on the internet, since there are few controls over the veracity of the information, when it is placed in this public media.
By the same standard, I do not limit my learning experience, by only reading on the internet.
I have made the decision to not participate, as much as I once did, mainly due to the apparently personal attacks that one individual makes, when I have attempted to share some of what it is that I work on.
At the same time, I recognize the dangers of Plastic Shamans and Fraudulent posers, some of whom I have met, which is why I have continued to participate in this forum.
In our Culture, shunning and ignoring the offending individual, is one of the ways that disrespect is dealt with. I know that there are some here, who do not understand this, but there are likely some, who do.
As with many learning opportunities, I have found it beneficial to "take what I need and leave the rest".
I left a secure job, in which it was my duty to find fault, when I found myself not trusting, nor showing Respect for anyone or anything that I encountered. I realized that my own life was not balanced, and it was causing me Spiritual, Mental and Emotional harm, that ultimately led me to experience Physical harm.
While I chose to use my own name, in this forum, my Life is not defined by what appears on the internet.
Ric
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I've been reading this exchange, and decided to keep out of it. Although I have some reasons to be a little skeptical about some person involved with NAU. All that aside, I just couldn't be quiet anymore lol. This statement
"Incidently...the IP number of the cached section of our forum you posted...if this is not your own....then I would like to know WHO it belongs to...as this is an IP number we had to repeatedly ban from our forum for lurking...perhaps someone sent you the cached page and asked you to call NAU into question...who knows...since you claim you did not repeatedly come into our forum daily etc...all I can gather from that is the IP belongs to the person who sent you the page....which rings many alarm bells for me since we were hacked....and our forum is now closed on site."
I had to reply before my brain exploded. This is google's ip for cached version of your page. It happens all the time in our stats, I mean all the time. When someone does a search for a page, then hits cached, this is what it looks like. This belongs to google and not an individual.
IP address 209.85.173.104
Hostname mh-in-f104.google.com
ISP Google Inc.
On that note (preventing myself from screaming at more assumptions) I'll walk away and not say any more.
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The ip shows up as:
State/Region CA
City Mountain View
And with all due respect...the IP number Moma Porcupine posted is the very same IP number that visited our website forum up to 20 times a day without posting...to which we banned...now I doubt sincerely Google did that! And since a few of our team modorated the forum and checked the stat regularly...we WOULD know these things...but I should just hush my mush...After all....what would I know...Im not to be trusted....Im just the untrustworthy idiot from NAU eh.
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The ip shows up as:
State/Region CA
City Mountain View
And with all due respect...the IP number Moma Porcupine posted is the very same IP number that visited our website forum up to 20 times a day without posting...to which we banned...now I doubt sincerely Google did that! And since a few of our team modorated the forum and checked the stat regularly...we WOULD know these things...but I should just hush my mush...After all....what would I know...Im not to be trusted....Im just the untrustworthy idiot from NAU eh.
I did not post this to cause problems, I was hoping to help clear that up. Google didn't do it, it's what comes up when anyone, anywhere in the world would cache your site. Maybe I'm too computer geeky, but I'm serious. If you take a look at when you google sites never do your ip's show. When you do that, that is what shows.
Nevermind. Just thought that might help.
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And I appreciate that...all Im saying is the ip number from Mountain View CA was one we had to repeatedly ban and remove from our forum for lurking...that's it...that's all.
Added note: Ok...as I said in the past I come here to gain knowledge...and I have just received this from Barnaby:
Posting has been removed due to request from Barnaby
So I stand corrected...and you all have my apologies...I do not claim to be a pc expert...far from it...so I do sincerely appreciate the correction and information...and again I am sorry.
With respect,
Tsissy
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I think there is some misunderstandings happening here.
wolfhawaii I apologize if the information I posted was already in a link and educatedindian was aware of this. I actually didn't notice that. I was privately sent some information someone was concerned about. I investgated and posted what I found.
If administration wants proof of this I can forward this information to them -
If you think about it, you would realize how impractical it would be to ask educatedindian if it's OK to post everything I find before I post it.
Yes I was wondering why you were giving me such a hard time for asking the same sort of questions that get asked here regularly. How i see it is just because people have posted here and say they consider certain people exploiters and frauds shouldn't mean their own public activities should be beyond question.
Ric, i'm sorry you feel I attacked you personally.
My first post in this forum was on the subject of the sale of sage and sweet grass, and you joined in this discussion, disagreeing with my expressing my concern and saying you felt it was OK. Maybe other people would percieve this differently but IMO if anyone was personally attacked in this thread it was me, and when I began this thread i had no idea you had plans to sell this as a business. So my concerns about this had nothing at all to do with "you" .
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=580.0;all
When you started a thread on your business , I will admit my question asking if this was a fancy way of selling sweetgrass, was rude , but in the discussion in the above thread, the only thing that you talked about specifically, was selling sweetgrass, so it was an honest misunderstanding . When you explained what you were doing, I agreed most of what you planned to sell sounded entirely positive.
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=877.0
The next discussion we had I asked a bunch of questions trying to clarify how it should be decided what parts of cultural traditions can be sold if people that culture belongs to don't agree. Yes I did ask some specific questions, which I feel you never answered and instead I was accused of "not caring about Native people " and "not caring about poverty and youth suicide." - which for me did feel like a personal attack - even if you didn't mean it that way. I guess when people disagree on an issue it can feel like a personal attack, but i know i never meant it that way.
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=412.0;all
That you would take this opprotunity to take one more kick at me probably says more about who you are than about me.
While I don't see a problem with asking any of the questions I have - I would see a big problem if I participated in asking these questions of people who don't post here, but I didn't ask these questions of people who do post here, and are selling something many Elders say shouldn't be sold or who are otherwise putting themselves in a position of public trust.
I do feel that as an anonymous person it would be better if i didn't post so much. I see so much stuff that doesn't seem right, and when I start digging what I often find looks more and more questionable. However I can also see that as an anonymous person of no authority , out of respect for the balance of this message board it might be better if I steped back some and left these many things for other people who are not anonymous and have a verifiable connections to a Native community, to deal with in their own way.
Participating on this message board I do feel a growing frustration at the constant stream of people who seem to want to point fingers at others but who expect their own activities to be beyond question or scrutiny , and the constant presure to accept the actions of themselves or their friends without question.
Maybe it is revealing that this criticism of me has only come up in response to me asking questions that people don't want to answer or would prefer I didn't ask.
Anyway time for a breather to regain some perspective, and I am sorry if I offended anyone.
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I think there is some misunderstandings happening here.
wolfhawaii I apologize if the information I posted was already in a link and educatedindian was aware of this. I actually didn't notice that. I was privately sent some information someone was concerned about. I investgated and posted what I found.
If administration wants proof of this I can forward this information to them -
If you think about it, you would realize how impractical it would be to ask educatedindian if it's OK to post everything I find before I post it.
Yes I was wondering why you were giving me such a hard time for asking the same sort of questions that get asked here regularly. How i see it is just because people have posted here and say they consider certain people exploiters and frauds shouldn't mean their own public activities should be beyond question.
It's not so much the questions you ask, but the way you ask them.
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April 15
In the hopes of stopping incorrect rumors and speculation, I have edited my response to some accusations that were made by wolfhawaii, against me , as he has removed these accusations from his own posts.
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As for your question of what I am doing here ...well HMMMMM , maybe I am here to protect the culture, stand up for the Elders I love and have loved, and to help educate people about how to avoid being hurt by frauds exploiters and wing nuts.
Naw....it couldn't possibly be anything that straight forward ...
As for Tsisqua - and her website ... I have to say that an anonymous group of people running a website that has fully monitered youth chat rooms , that track peoples ISP's, and accuse people who ask legitimate questions of stalking and spying, and who post parts of peoples PM's to prove reasonable requests and questions were really some nasty persecution conspiracy , this behavior raises so many obvious concerns I don't think this needs further explanation.
It's possible my concerns are wholy unfounded, and if this is the case, all it would take is a few people with real names, who can be verified to live in a Native community and have good reputations in their community, to come and vouche for the good reputation of the people running NAU, either publicly in this thread, or privately to educatedindian. That would lay these concerns to rest. But I don't mean the Nuyagi Keetoowah or the SECCI .... With 19,000 American Indian members that sort of verification should be easy to arrange. Otherwise... I really don't think this person should be promoting this website in NAFPS.
Just my opinion.... No doubt other people will have different opinions ... And it is for the administrators of the site to decide what is best..... I respect their judgment.
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As for Tsisqua - and her website ... I have to say that an anonymous group of people running a website that has fully monitered youth chat rooms , that track peoples ISP's, and accuse people who ask legitimate questions of stalking and spying, and who post parts of peoples PM's to prove reasonable requests and questions were really some nasty persecution conspiracy , this behavior raises so many obvious concerns I don't think this needs further explanation.
Dang...this is getting real old.
Firstly...we have fully monitored chatrooms, adult and youth for good reason..as I have already stated...if anyone wishes to read already on this thread....and I see nothing wrong with having monitored SAFE chatrooms for our people...in particular our youth!
Did I accuse you of spying and stalking? Did I actually SAY those words?? Ever?? I think not....if you are going to quote me...at least have the decency to speak the truth.
I posted your PM...to show your question to me...since you seem to jump ontop of every word I say...as proof of your words...but no doubt only you have that right.
And the only concerns it seems to be raising...is to you Moma Porcupine....since I have yet to see anyone else post on this matter. I have answered your questions..I have explained what and who we are...within the boundaries of remaining annoymous..which as I have said before...if it is good enough for you to remain annoymous...then its good enough for others.
It's possible my concerns are wholy unfounded, and if this is the case, all it would take is a few people with real names, who can be verified to live in a Native community and have good reputations in their community, to come and vouche for the good reputation of the people running NAU, either publicly in this thread, or privately to educatedindian. That would lay these concerns to rest. But I don't mean the Nuyagi Keetoowah or the SECCI .... With 19,000 American Indian members that sort of verification should be easy to arrange. Otherwise... I really don't think this person should be promoting this website in NAFPS.
The good reputation of NAU is given in our dealings with others...and since you are not a member...with all due respect...you wouldnt know anything about that....I have read all your posts on this board...and it seems you call many Native people here into question..asking for names...adresses etc...post up your own Moma Porcupine...?? Ahh but you dont see the need...yet you are quick enough to judge others and try to discredit...yet you wish to be accepted...trusted..all while remaining annoymous...but no one else eh? A contradiction of terms.
Again laying concerns to rest...these concerns only seem to be coming from you...not one of our members have an issue with how we run our site...nor do they have any concern with anyone involved in the running of our site...only you....and you are not a member...so how would you know anything about how our site is run? You even stated yourself that you cannot view all of our site due to plugins.
EducatedIndian has not requested I varify anything with him...only YOU.
I do not promote NAU here...YOU are the one who told me I needed to post here regarding who we are and what we do...YOU....to which I did...and then you state I shouldnt be promoting NAU here....contradiction of terms again.
You asked me to post here...which I did...to which you atacked me as you do many others...then you went on to attack others on this thread...Witch Hunt springs to mind rather quickly...and Im getting rather tired of you making accusations and trying to cast doubts....when you are contradicting yourself with every word....and Im also sick of answering the same questions over and over again....read the WHOLE thread here...NAU is doing nothing wrong...dang there are real fakes and frauds out there that need dealing with...why are you wasting your time and energy picking apart people who work for their people for free...creating a safe place to come to...a place to gain information...you said you found it laughable that we are attempting to create unity while remaining annoymous...how do you define UNITY? Is it based on names...and addresses?? Or is it based on a large body of people who stand together and support each other? People who wish to do all they can for their people?? Im curious...because apparently you are under the opinion Unity is about "Hello my name is XXXXX XXXXXXXXX and I live at XXXXXXX" What is your problem with Native people wanting Unity?? Are we not entitled to it??
With respect,
Tsissy
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I ask that anything further be taken to private emails.
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Siyo educatedindian,I have not seen you posting to powwow latly.
It is very strange to me,a "fraud" was brought here by usdi ulv,Tsisqua,and it are she who are repeatedly attacked by this "someone" moma porcupine,with demands Tsisqua tell who EXACTLY she are,and yet this "porcupines" does not need even a simple "polite" siyo I am? I have been reading here to you site,and am thinking it start out as a "good" place/idea,to help our Peoples find and STOP those taking without right "CEREMONY" of our Nations,selling,making yonega "god" the monies,and giving nothing back to our Peoples but grief,and more genocide.It has become instead a place to back bite,and attack some our OWN that certians do not like or agree with,rather than working TOGETHER,to help ALL our Nations protect each other from yonega.We are MANY Nations,and though it is true we are connected in some ways,agree and share "some" beliefs in common,there are wide and far differences as well,some are traditional,some christian,some follow STRICKTLY the OLD ways,some have less of the old ways to follow.It is sad to me to see some one I respect and care for to be treated so with disrespect,when I,know well how hard she work and the PERSONAL cost to herself,and then she attacked HERE by someone not even courage to say I is male or female,I am of THIS or that Nation,no one is saying give you personal information to all the world,but do NOT allow her/him,to demand that very thing from others. And,moma Poke you pine,you may attack ME all you wish, :D I am right here!In my eyes you deserve no respect,as you in every thread I,have read give none to any!
adadoligi granny
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It is good to hear traditional voices here....I have sent a PM to Moma_Porcupine.
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Don't need any challenges, let it be. Please. Thank you.
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When distention is created by others we all feel the repercussions, I d not see what fighting or arguing amongst ourselves is going to solve although to outsiders reading these posts they are surely smiling and enjoying the tensions. I belong to NAU and as far as I can tell and everything I have seen it is on the up and up.....Remember Tsi, ONLY THE GUILTY NEED DEFEND THEMSELVES.
I agree.......let it go.
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Siyo Mooniesixkiller,tohitsu?
I have question for you please,what is this christian colonial based nonsense of(ONLY THE GUILTY NEED DEFEND THEMSELVES.)What has this to do with Traditional first Peoples? This is not as I was raised to believe to be so,our Peoples gave all fair chance to speak,and YES,to defend self were a question raised.The accuser speak and all would listen in silence and respect,then the ACCUSED spoke and the SAME respectful silence was given,if there were others who wished to speak on this matter,each was given that chance to do so.Only by hearing ALL sides/opinions could FAIRNESS be made in deciding.ONLY yonega ties the hands and gags the mouths so THEIR side alone is heard,how well WE understand that.In the eyes of yonega ALONE are you GUILTY before a "trial" of you peers/Elders,by the words of another. Only yonega "snipe",lash about,and make hidden comments,with out a fair chance to answer in defense of self,kin,or friend.And so,I ask most humbly is this a place of Native first Peoples,or is this a "mud slinging" yonega COURT? In our languages there are no "curse/cuss" words,WE do NOT abuse each other as Tsisqua and others have been abused by this "moma porcupine" person,even an ENEMY was given fair treatement by our Peoples. I have been reading here in this place some very strange "ways" that are SAID to be "traditional" to OUR Peoples,and it leave me to wonder who traditions they are?
aisv Nvwadohivnv
granny
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While I am still less than a newbie here (the ranks progress too fast on this forum I guess - since officially I am already junior member) and Moma porcupine doesn't need me to stand in her defense and I don't have enough credibility here anyway... but still.. can't stay silent.
I got one of the first meaningful replies around here from her, when I came rushing in with the subtility of a bulldozer.
She is very thorough in her research and usually raises very substantiated questions as far as I read her posts.
She might have read more colonial mind and aspirations than there really are in me, but at the same time offered many good points that were relevant.
So she might have sensed or read more fraud than there is to any of you in question, but she only asked questions...
This forum is harsh in style sometimes, but when I see what kind of frauds they encounter I am not too surprised anymore.
I guess you (we) should temper our egos enough to be able to bear occasional accusations and doubt and learn something when there is something to learn. If you are innocent, you can only laugh for yourself and try to explain your position - but even if you stay percieved wrongly - noone can hurt you - because you have clear conscience. But if you are guilty...
I agree it is a little "privileged" not to introduce yourself when this is a standard on this forum, but after seeing what a certain group around Lekay is doing to Al - like the last yahoo group I noticed - devoted to him and honoring him with the title "AltonCarrollIsCrazy" I can understand why one of the more active and inexorable NAFPS members doesn't wish to expose herself - if she is backed and trusted by other non-anonymous moderators and administrators her credibility is granted through them like Moma correctly stated herself.
I hope this intervention helped anyone.
best
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Thank you A H, that's well said. Everyone has a place. We have enough going on without fighting among each other. And I'm sure as Moonie says, others are enjoying this.
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It's kind of a compliment in a way, that they feel the need to go to such lengths, and funny that they keep failing so miserably. That yahoo group has a grand total of a single member (from Ireland!) and no messages. Just a long rant on the welcome page. Probably they expect it to be deleted shortly as libelous, which it is. At least they're bothering to come up with a new set of lies...
Granny, good to see you here. I haven't been by the Powwow group in awhile, but sometimes I get very busy in here.
Sorry to sidetrack this thread. I'm done.
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Hello Granny, I am only saying that Tsi does NOT need to defend herself. NO ONE does unless they are guilty of something, of which TSI, is NOT. I don't know enough of the history of Mama, or Tsi, for that fact, what I am saying is that outsiders are enjoying every ounce of distention that is being created here. When and why has it become open season on those who are truthful and doing the right thing, as both Mama, and Tsi, are doing? Because it seems to me that since Raven Crow came and did His/Her thing, and we outted Him/Her, there has been nothing but accusations and dis accord here and it's almost enough to make me want to leave, but I am standing firm because this Forum does so many great things, things that both Mama Porcupine and Tsi have been involved in and with, and I think the doubts that are being created are bringing many pleasures to those who have been found GUILTY. This is not a court of law, this is a group of people who believe in preserving the old ways the best we can in a modern world, because I can assure you, if this were the old days......This would NOT be happening.
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Considering the amount of times this thread has been read in the past few days...I have to agree with you Moonie...and I have stayed quiet on this matter since my last posting..as I have nothing further to say....I dont feel its necessary to keep going over and over the same points raised when answers have been given....its pointless and futile....people will take all other people as they find them...trust is a thing earnt...as is respect...and we have nothing to hide....there are enough people who are members of NAU...and other groups we associate with...respected people of ndn community...who we know in 'real' life...people I could quite easily round up and ask them to post here to varify who I am and who NAU is...but I dont feel its necessary....I have no issue with people coming to their own conclusions...a tree's worth is shown by the fruit it bares....
With respect,
Tsissy
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Siyo Mooniesixkiller,you are most right,Tsisqua do not need to defend self,nor I too defend her. We need to stay focas together and stop those taking from our Peoples,we need a place such as this to meet as equals no matter the Nation and do this work. We need to respect each other as we should,and as for those who are "peeking" in as cowards to seek out a place to "stir" trouble,they are very simply that,cowards. Even a close family at times disagree,so long as it is done with respect we soon learn to agree to disagree with grace.As to "ego" I have none,and it is no "self" thing to speak in honesty of what ones Elders taught.Truth,at times to those who do not know ones ways,perhaps does not set well with anothers views of what is true. I respect the words of all,respect their right to speak them,but attacking each other moves no mountains. Let us then move forward in peace,and seek to end those who would steal and sell our heritage.
adadoligi granny
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LOL! I forgot to say,if they are SO busy to watch what we are saying,perhaps they will not have the time TO make troubles,eh?
granny
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I wish Granny, I wish, lol.
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Thanks for the kind words ... and acknowledgment for what I do here . I do hope it helps some people ... Thats why I contribute what I do .
I wish this hadn't gotten so personal - because it wasn't.
No matter who the people are who are involved, I think there is a differnce between being an anonymous poster, and a website with all anonymous moderators. Before I joined this website i checked out who is running it and who might have access to my personal information. I was able to investigate Al Carroll to the point I felt he was who he says he is and does have verifiable support and connections in the Native community. I was able to decide he was probably trustworthy and accountable and hadn't done anyone anything I felt was wrong . If everyone here was anonymous I couldn't have checked that out.
I am anonymous but I'm just a poster here. i'm not a moderator or the owner of the site. I don't have access to anyones private information. I can't be looking at anyones ISP or email or even possibly going into their private messages. I don't know what website owners can do, but I trust that whatever the owners of this website can do is probably going to be reasosnable and fair . the only reason I can check this out is because they are not anonymous I can look at their past history their connections in the native community, and see that I am comfortable with how they have (or have not) disclosed or used private informtion.
Lots of people who post here don't introduce themselves - even a couple of the moderators - and as long as people aren't linking what they do on NAFPS to other activities in their personal lives or on other websites that involve the public trust, I don't see why it is that important to do so.
I'm not neglecting to introduce myself becase I feel above everybody else or because i have something I want to hide. I would love to explain my own perspective because my life has taught me a lot and given me an unusual perspective it would probably be valuable to share. I am very comfortable with who I am. The problem is , I really don't feel safe to put the information out there that could help identify me.
But I will explain something which may help people understand my "attitude".
I haven't lived an easy life and as a young person I lived through some pretty severe abuse, at the hands of both non native people and Native people in a Native community. All of those people were older and in some ways wiser than me, and there was always people who didn't want to see, and who chose to protect friends and family members who were more important to them than me. Becoming an adult in these situations, I learned to think for myself and that just because someone occupies a position of authority or even is highly estemed in the community doesn't mean everything they are doing needs to be respected. Some of these people who were abusers also shared really valuable things with me, so I know people can share something that is like the rock of gibalter and guides you through your whole life, and a few hours later this same person can begin hitting you for no reason or threaten you with violence if you ever talk about being abused.
It was only through learning to talk about it I was able to begin to be emotionally healthy.
If I seem mouthy and disrespectful of peoples positions this is why. I learned from these experiences that there is good and bad in everyone, and I am deeply committed to supporting the good and confronting the bad, no matter what peoples seniority or personal position is.
I don't think that just because people post here , or just because people are Native or partly Native, or just because people have some traditional teachings or are older, or just because people are somewhat respected in the Native community , or just because people are opposed to some forms of fraud or exploitation, means they should consider their own public activities beyond question.
Having already lived through too much abuse and still having some effect like mild PTSD I am also very protective not to expose myself or my family members to more. Which is one reason why I am so protective of my identity .
Although my personal story is very common , I am a bit uncomfortable sharing even this much, but maybe it will help people understand why I seem to have an attitude, and where part of this comes from.
I'm not a young person and I really feel I earned my 'attitude' honestly. And I am sorry if it is this "attitude" has created some misunderstandings.
And because I am anonymous- there is no way to verify if any of this is even true - so - even this ...and anything else I say... might be a complete lie ... Which is another reason I try to make no claims about myself and just stay with things that people can verify. Because on line I think people should always be skeptical about anything anyone claims , and I don't want what I contribute here to in any way rely on claims people can't verify.
And no i don't really want to put this information in the introduction where it is easy for people to find because people wanting to discredit me will probably find a way to use this to do so. And it is very close to some nerves . It's been really hard to decide to even post this much personal info ...
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Thank you, Moma. Although it wasn't necessary, it's good to know. I'm a relatively new member here, but I have never seen you be rude or obnoxious to anyone. You ask questions, but that's what everyone does here. I've also noticed that you do your research well and can back-up anything you post with facts. I appreciate that. You never go off half-cocked, making accusations that can't be verified.
I agree with you that there's a difference between an anonymous poster, without access to anyone's personal information, and an administrator or moderator of a forum. Admins and mods usually do have access to personal information, including someone's name, e-mail address, ISP and IP. I know cause I'm an administrator on another forum. I feel this is information that should never be disclosed; I respect our members' privacy. I'm uncomfortable with anyone who has this type of information making statements about posting it. Threats of posting someone's personal info or their location or IP should never be made, even if you never would actually do it. When I see this type of info posted, it infuriates me. I won't even post pm's or e-mails I receive, unless I have the person's permission to do so. As an administrator or moderator you have a responsibility to your members that shouldn't be taken lightly. Giving out personal information crosses the line. I've seen this happen a couple times since I joined NAFPS. It's one thing if a person gives out their own information, as I do, and something else entirely when someone else is doing it, especially when that someone is anonymous.
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Siyo moma porcupine,age,nor troubles give us "right" to be cruel,we walk this life time together,we learn,or refuse to learn,that alone is our "right".My heart aches for your abuses,if they happened,you in truth post in circles,but as a child who self faced true abuses if it is so my prayers include you. I will in time make introduction,though most here of our Peoples know me already.I do not claim to be the only holder of wisdom,nor the only human to know trouble,my own personal fight with such as steal our Cultural heritage is my children and grandchildren,those left to me. My eldest son was murdered in a most horrible way by White Supremists,his body put through a nine foot propeller of a river boat,leaving very little for my mourning,he was four months from twenty first birthday. So yes,for me,in so very MANY ways,it is a personal fight.
Real Love!
I still remember when my little boy was two,he came running up to
me with tears on his little cheeks.
His little hand was swollen so hot and red it looked,what
happened to you baby where the first words from my lips.
His little face so brown and sweet,so rosy were his cheeks,so
sturdy and so healthy it made me proud to look.
I have something for you mommy one hand behind his back,what is
it little one I asked?
I wanted to show you that I loved you, so I picked you this rose
he answered back.
His little hand came forward with a small pink clover flower
clutched tight,in all my life I have never felt so loved.
To pick for me this flower bees he had to fight,for love of me he
took the sting,smiled throgh the pain,to give his mother the greatest
treasure of her life.
That little boy is gone now he has passed through Heavens
Gates,but the love he left within my heart can never be replaced!
I have that "rose"still today!
granny!
Jehrimia 4-29-1976 to 12-13-1996
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WTFIWTS
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I must be crazy, but it seems this information will continue to bug me until I post it ...
On June 26 2008 Tsisqua edited her intitial introduction, and then she edited it again on June 29 2008.
In her intitial introduction she gave the first names and tribal affiliations of the NAU board members
Tsisqua
Our board members are as follows:
Myself (Keetoowah Band of Tsalagi)
EAZ (Warm Springs...also my fiance)
Matty (San Carlos Apache/Cherokee....my cousin)
Blade (San Carlos Apache/Cherokee....my cousin)
Skylar (San Carlos Apache/Cherokee....my cousin...all of the above three names are brothers)
Da'Quah (Mohawk)
Juan (Pawnee)
Alfie (Quinault/White)
Lucas (Quinault)
Jared (Flathead/Blackfoot)
Consoni (White Mountain Apache)
Clint (Onieda/Mohawk/White)
Marcus (Haidian)
I have the page saved, and could provide screen shots of the original page if people wanted to see this. Adm. also got sent links to the original when it existed as a cached page after this was edited.
It now reads;
Tsisqua
Myself (Keetoowah Band of Tsalagi)
Blade (San Carlos Apache/Cherokee....my cousin)
Skylar (San Carlos Apache/Cherokee....my cousin)
Da'Quah (Mohawk)
Juan (Pawnee)
Alfie (Quinault/White)
Lucas (Quinault)
Jared (Flathead/Blackfoot)
Consoni (White Mountain Apache)
Clint (Onieda/Mohawk/White)
Marcus (Haidian)
(edited to remove two board members who are currently being replaced 06/26/08)
In a number of places , Blade and Skylar use the surname Yazzie. Here in the NAFPS thread about an internet group called "Tribal America", is some quotes posted by Tsisqua from someone she identifies as her cousin called Blade Yazzie , and his brother Skylar.
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1439.0;all
Re: Tribal America
« Reply #12 on: January 25, 2008,
posted by Tsisqua
#7934 Re: TA Pool .....[edit]..... And now I find my brother Skylar has 2 been banned from entering the site 4 speaking his mind ....[edit ...]After all Tsissy did here, Pappy has made no apology, nothing. Chief? I see no Chief. Blade Yazzie. (2007-12-08 16:19:34.450114)
So Bade and Skylar, who are stated to be San Carlos Apache/Cherokee appear to be surnamed Yazzie. Yazzie is a Dine name, though I suppose if an Apache or Cherokee family had a patrilineal line that went back to a Dine ancestor it's possible this surname might be carried by an Apache or Cherokee family.
If Matty is the brother of Blade and Skylar as was stated by Tsisqua in her introduction , it would make sense to guess his name would be Matty Yazzie, but doing a google search on this name comes up with nothing.
However there is a Matty J. Yellowboy mentioned in in numourous places as someone with some authority in NAU and it appears this is Matty's full name.
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1513.msg10805#msg10805
posted by Tsisqua
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2008 10:34:19 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Native_American_ Unity" <nativeamericanunity_office@yahoo.com>
[.edit ..]
With Respect,
Matty J Yellowboy
NAU ~ Native American Unity
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1439.msg9918#msg9918
Re: Tribal America
Tsisqua
« Reply #17 on: March 11, 2008,
Tsisqua
I am a member here, also on the yahoo group of NAFPS, American Indian Injustice, and a few others....plus of course my own site....she was directed to me yesterday for the first time via my cousin Matty who maintains a page on RNS to keep watch on certain well known fakes there, he was being rudely questioned by her on our NAU links to Beaderman
Yellowboy seems to be a Lakota or Dakota name ... I suppose it's possible that an Apache or Cherokee family which had a patrilineal line going back to a Lakota ancestor might also have this surname.
This could be interpreted in a number of ways.
1. Maybe these brothers really are surnamed Yazzie and Yellowboy but they have different Dads. If this is true it would also mean that even though Matty J. Yellowboy has a different father with a Lakota surnname he somehow ended up inheriting the same San Carlos Apache/Cherokee bloodline as his brothers who's Dad was surnamed Yazzie.
2. Or, Maybe the names Yazzie and Yellowboy are not the real surnames of these 3 cousins and their relative , and they are just internet handles. If this is true , it would also mean that they all decided to use a seemingly real Native family name along with first names and middle initials as an internet ID rather than an obvious alias. This seems to be somewhat deceptive.
Blade and Skylar and Matty would be the relatives of the Mark Coyote Yazzie , who's death is reported and discussed in the link below.
http://209.85.173.104/search?q=cache:KcNLaN04nDIJ:www.blackamericansingles.com/cgi-bin/fp.pl%3
Ffn%3Df%26tp%3D2037%26m%3D+Mark+Yazzie+tsis&hl=en&gl=ca&strip=1 (http://209.85.173.104/search?q=cache:KcNLaN04nDIJ:www.blackamericansingles.com/cgi-bin/fp.pl%3
Ffn%3Df%26tp%3D2037%26m%3D+Mark+Yazzie+tsis&hl=en&gl=ca&strip=1)
This content is the property of the tribalamerica.com and is freely posted by members after logging in. Any duplication or distribution without our consent is strictly forbidden per federal and state regulations and is prosecutable under law.
(I am reproducing this for purposes of eduction and research . I have deleted everything which isn't directly relevent to establishing that this person is alleged to have been a family member of Tsisqua's )
Mark Coyote Yazzie - Mark Coyote Yazzie aka 'CoyoteShadow' passed away in the early hours of Monday morning at 4:26am>
Re: Mark Coyote Yazzie - I too am sad for the loss of Mark Coyote Yazzie. I understand he was defending a burial site from being desecrated and was fatally beaten in the process. My prayers are with all of those who grieve for him as I also pray that those who perpetrated these heinous acts will be brought to justice. Mi Takuye Oyacin (2007-12-15 19:12:41.672261)
Re: Mark Coyote Yazzie - Thank You to all who have keep me in your prayers and thoughts. I apprieciate all of you. My heart bleeds...as Tsissy said, let us not allow Marks work to have been in vein.Lonefeather. (2007-12-07 09:57:26.039149)
Re: Mark Coyote Yazzie - I appreciate all the prayers and words...please....let us not allow Marks work to have been in vain...I urge you to support our native rights, to unite and join forces against the desecration of our sacred lands...to make the voice of our people a united voice...a powerful voice...only together can we be heard...Tsisqua (2007-12-05 10:17:28.098041)
I haven't been able to find any news coverage of this or the investigation.
I guess people can interpret that however they do ...
The next think that makes me wonder is there is a NAU board member called Juan Wildcat-Hall
He is listed here by his full name as a member of NAU;
http://www.google.com/search?q=cache:uM1kjhfpNlIJ:nausinglesnetwork
.ning.com/+Juan+wildcat-hall&hl=en&gl=ca&ie=UTF-8&strip=1 (http://www.google.com/search?q=cache:uM1kjhfpNlIJ:nausinglesnetwork
.ning.com/+Juan+wildcat-hall&hl=en&gl=ca&ie=UTF-8&strip=1)
Blade Yazzie also had a myspace page and 5 friends, and one of them was Juan Wildcat~Hall , but I see this has now been removed. I could provide a screen shot of the page .
Blade Yazzie has 5 friends.
NAU ® Native American Unity
E.
Juan Wildcat~Hall
Lonefeather
Tom
Eric Wildcat-Hall has signed a couple of Tsisqua's petitions . Eric Wildcat-Hall is a real person who is in prison .
I can think of a few ways this could be interpreted
1.Maybe Juan Wildcat-Hall is a relative of the Native man who is in prison named Eric Wildcat Hall .
2. Or maybe Juan perfers using a real Native persons family name instead of an obvious internet alias . If this is what is going on it seems deceptive and even borders on identity theft.
The names on the petitions that Tsisqua starts are interesting as they give the impression of some family relationships.
I have edited most of the names out of this and I'm just leaving the ones I want to comment on. The others may be relevent and i haven't researched each of them . My comments are in italics .
Tsisqua was very involved in the internet group Tribal America which sponsered this petition and being as Tsisqua is the first name on this petition it seems fair to conclude she is the one who started it
http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/BurialGroundRights/index.html
Petition sponsor
Please visit with us at TribalAmerica.com...the Native American online community promoting Unity of Native Peoples!
http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/BurialGroundRights/signatures-1.html
# Name
1 Tsisqua
(owner of NAU )
2 Eli S. Smith
( claimed to be Tsisqua's fiance)
3Tina Lonefeather
( An NAU member and administrator )
5 Jared Yellowboy
This looks like Matty J Yellowboy has a relative ... As Jared is an unusual name, it seems quite a coincidence to have a Jared named as a NAU board member in Tsisqua's introduction and a different Jared signing one of Tsisqua's petitions . The problem is, Matty J Yellowboy is said to be Apache/ Cherokee in Tsisqua's introduction. The NAU member Jared is said to be Flathead/Blackfoot in Tsisqua's introduction. So apparently there is 2 different Jareds associated with Tsisqua.
11Dancing Elk (edited comment ...) Dancing Elk Notoweega, Alleghenny Lenape Multi Tribal Red Chief
( Alleghenny Lenape Multi Tribal Red Chief ? Is there such a thing ? Are the Notoweega a part of the Allegenny Lenape ? Does any legitimate group in OH have a Chief called Dancing Elk ? )
21 Kachina Dawisgala
( You will see another petiton mentioned below was written by Tsisqua Dawisgala, and another petiton below is signed by Kachina Toulou. I guess this is either a strange coincidence or someone associated with Tsisqua likes using the name Kachina in combination with names they saw on other petitions )
22 Blade A Yazzie
(Said to be Tsisqua's Cherokee/Apache cousin )
29 Coyote Benidict Jr This is just messed up beyond belief. WTF is up with these people? Tsissy call me, let me know what else can be done.
(Apparently this person is a friend of Tsisqua in real life , if she knows how to call them. Coincidentally Coyote is also the middle name of Mark Yazzie . )
30 Hector Moya ( another person surnamed Moya is mentioned in a different petition below )
31 CLINT SOOSAY I spent too long in the iron house due to people like this digging up sacred lands and i will do so again tsisqua don't you ever dare give in what you are doing our people need more people like you
There is a real person with this name who is in prison .
http://www.worldwidefriends.org/224.html
Clint SooSay # 08038-046
USP 2, K-Unit
PO Box 1034
Coleman, FL 33521
USA
Age/Birthday: Birthday 4-13-1984
Race/Tribe: Chippewa-Cree
Physical Description: 5'10" 180 Lbs, black hair brown eyes
Release Date: 2014
Coincidentally NAU has a board member called Clint , except it can't be the same person because the NAU member with this name is said to be (Onieda/Mohawk/White)
35 Melvin Yazzie
There is a real Melvin Yazzie in prison . Like most people surmed Yazzie he is Dine - not Apache or Cherokee as Tsisqua's Yazzie cousins are claimed to be. See below
http://naprisoners.tripod.com/yazziemelvin.html
Name MELVIN YAZZIE
Number 140873
Birth Date
Address ASPC Lewis - Buckley Red Yard
P O Box 3400
Buckey, AZ 85326
Nation/Tribe Dine
Coincidentally the next person who signed this is also in prison. Maybe Tsisqua is just entering names and comments from prisoners she coresponds with ?
36 Eric Wildcat Hall
http://www.brightonabc.org.uk/restoftheworld.htm
Eric Wildcat Hall, #BL-5355, Unit 1/A, 10745 Route 18, Albion, PA 16475-0002, USA
Serving 35-75 years for helping ship arms to Central American indigenous activists.]
Here is another petition asking that Eric be allowed to access what is necessary to practice his religion . This petition was not put together by Tsisqua.
http://www.petitiononline.com/ilpp/petition.html
To: support the religious rights of incarcerated First Nations People
WE THE UNDERSIGNED call upon Pennsylvania's Governor Thomas Ridge to intercede on the behalf of Eric Wildcat Hall and James Locklear Brooks, prisoners at the State Correctional Institution at Albion, PA., and issue an executive order to Martin F. Horm, Secretary, Pennsylvania Department Of Corrections, to allow Eric Wildcat Hall and James Locklear Brooks to have access to Medicine Bundles,.........
I went over the names in this petition. There is one person near the end that signs "Yellowboy" but except for that there is no sign of Tsisqua or any of her associates.
So ... I guess there is a few ways to interpret this ;
1. Maybe the real Eric Wildcat-Hall arranged to have computer access to sign Tsisqua's petition protesting the excavation of this burial ground ... and another petition the sale of scalps on ebay ( below )
2. Maybe Eric gave his permission to someone associated with Tsisqua to sign this petition using his name
3 Maybe Eric Wildcat-Hall somehow manages to arrange to sign petitions started by Tsisqua who is friends of his relative Juan Wildcat-Hall, but for some reason Juan Wildcat-Hall and other NAU members who have easy access to computers and who have even started their own petition on the need for religious freedom in the iron lodge don't sign the petition to support Eric.
4 Maybe NAU members didn't sign the petition to support Eric because real Native people are involved in that issue and if these people aren't really related to them, they might start asking questions about who these people using the surnames Yazzie and Wildcat-Hall are.
5.Maybe Tsisqua or someone associated with NAU and Tsisqua is using imprisoned American Indian's names instead of obvious internet AKA's to make their on line make believe role playing seem more real .
Coming back to the names on this petition
44 Patsy Floyd OUr group has lost a very dear man because he tried to stop grave diggers and they attacked him with picks and shovels. This must stop, this discretion of our ancestors.
45 Patsy Floyd OUr group has lost a very dear man because he tried to stop grave diggers and they attacked him with picks and shovels. This must stop, this discretion of our ancestors.
( I am told Patsy Floyd is real person who participates on a lot of mailing lists )
47Tina Lonefeather Someone that I loved, that we all loved has been killed for these very same reasons. For standing up for the truth, for what is right, for his people. He and many others are the honorable ones...not you. Ryan Weller, where is your grandmother buried you fucking coward. Justice will be ours...
51 Blade Yazzie
( said to be Tsisqua's cousin and relative of Mark Coyote Yazzie )
(65 signitures in total)
Here is another petition created by Tsisqua which appears to have been signed by Eric Wildcat-Hall ( I've edited the comments and names i don't see as relevant )
http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/NativeRights/signatures-1.html
7 Tsisqua
14 Skylar Yazzie
15 Blade A Yazzie
16 Kachina Toulou
( The burial grounds rights petition above written by Tsisqua is signed by a Kachina Dawisgala - Dawisgala is a name Tsisqua sometimes uses. The inmate petiton , below was written by Tsisqua Dawisgala )
18 Jared Barehand I am of the Sioux Nation.
( Wow Jared is an unusual name and here is another one ! What a coincidence ! Three people named jared associated with Tsisqua ! )
Eli S. Smith
(said to be Tsisqua's fiancee' )
31 Coyote E. Wildcat I
(Another person who's name is Coyote and WildCat. Both these names are unusual . What a coincidence that Tsisqua knows so many different people with the same names !)
35 Ash Moya Jr They are also trying to sell burial moccasins from the graves of infants on ebay, bones, and other items of disrespect. They can not use the excuse that ebay is so large that they find it too difficult to keep track of what goes on there. It is EBAYS responsibility to keep track. They are permitting these people an open field. The worse thing I see on ebay are OUR OWN PEOPLE selling items that are sacred, burial items etc etc. Ignorance breeds hatred. Tsisqua I have worked with you for many years, and I hope to work with you for many more years to come in your plight to educate and unite the people and in your fight for justice. You are an inspiration to me and others. We have to put a stop to this! By any means possible. I stand beside you! Beside all our brothers and sisters!
(All I can find doing a Google search is a cigar called Ash Moya... Wonder if they are related to the Hector Moya who signed the petiton above ...)
39 Johanna Dillion Yazzie (I couldn't find anything else for Johanna Dillion Yazzie but there does seem to be a Johanna Yazzie who went to high school at Window Rock AZ)
55 J Yellowboy
( looks like another relative of the Yellowboy family or Jared Yellowboy again )
56 Eric Wildcat Hall
( Did Eric Wildcat - Hall sign this petiton or did someone sign this petiton using Eric's name and idenitity ? If someone signed this petition using Eric's name , did they first get Eric's permission ?)
70 Joe Bear Warrior Gonzales I find this selling of Native American sacred objects and Native American body parts highly offensive. Please do your part in seeing that this travesty and racism is stopped. Bear Warrior
( This person calls himself one of the Cheifs of a group of people claiming distant Cherokee descent and the right to a Native political identity. He is also a NAU member )
Here is another petition created by Tsisqua
http://www.petitiononline.com/Inmate1/petition.html
The Spirituality Rights For Our Brothers And Sisters In The Iron House Petition to US Congres/US Prison Officials was created by Native American Unity NAU and written by Tsisqua Dawisgala (NativeAmericanUnity_Office@yahoo.com). This petition is hosted here at www.PetitionOnline.com as a public service. There is no endorsement of this petition, express or implied, by Artifice, Inc. or our sponsors. For technical support please use our simple Petition Help form.
I did a google search on "Dawisgala" and it seems to be a Cherokee word meaning "flint". Below are the people who signed the petion starting with the last person to sign. I've edited some of the comments to shorten this .
18. udokoga Hall I am tsalagi {Cherokee.} ( edit )
( What a coincidence ! Here is the surname Hall again, which gives the impression this person and Juan Wildcat-Hall are related but Juan is said to be Pawnee and this person claims to be Cherokee )
14. Nate Yazzie
( looks like a relation of the Yazzie cousins )
9. Blade Yazzie
( said to be one of Tsisqua's Yazzie cousins )
8. Joe Bear Warrior Gonzales
( So called Chief of the United Peoples Cherokee Nation. I find it interesting that he is one of the few people on this petiton . I see he is a member of NAU and his name on these 2 petitions suggests he has been communicationg with NAU members for a while . I also noticed a lot of NAU's goals sound similar to the UPCN - and both groups sem to have questionable ways of defining who is and is not an Ndn. )
4. Matty J Yellowboy
(said to be Tsisqua's cousin and brother to at least 2 of the men surnamed Yazzie )
1.Tsisqua I work with many of our native brothers and sisters within the Iron Forts, it is high time changes were made, and time our people stood together to make these changes
So , I guess there is several ways this all could be interpreted.
1. Maybe these are peoples real names, but if this is the case there seems to be some family relationships and tribal affiliations which don't seem to fit together . There also seems to be no evidence any of these people have any connection with the real world. These names only come up in association with a few internet groups .
2.Maybe I just don't understand how internet petitions work , but it seems to me that when people sign a petition using an internet alias this would not be counted as a real signiture , as if people don't use their real names it could be one or 2 people using different names to sign the same petition over and over and over .
Which makes me wonder, if these names are not these peoples real names , why would so many people who appear to be interconnected and are associated with Tsisqua reduce their signiture on a petition to a meaningless gesture by signing it with an internet alias rather than a real name ? If these aren't people's real names, it seems these petitions are being used as nothing more than a stage to make it look like this cast of characters is involved in Native rights issues.
Tsisqua herself has provided so many personal details , anyone aquainted with her would easily be able to identify her. The UKB doesn't have that many members . Only one of them is likely to fit the following description.
Re: what tribe or nation is everyone?
« Reply #16 on: December 25, 2007
Tsisqua
I am a full blooded enrolled member of the Keetoowah Band Of Tsalagi, From Tahlequah, Oklahoma
Re: IMPORTANT NEWS...Please Read...
« Reply #8 on: June 28, 2008
Tsisqua
Yup...I know...I used to live in Cornwall Island on the Akwesasne side...in the KRA Apartments...also on Raquette Point Road on the Hogansburg NY side....lived up there for years..
Re: WRedGranny Spreading Lies on Other Websites
« Reply #15 on: June 18, 2008,
Tsisqua
since my 'condition' is now put here for all to see...I will clarify it...I have a terminal heart condition...one that requires a heart transplant...of which I can not have
Tsisqua
« on: April 11, 2008
Matty (San Carlos Apache/Cherokee....my cousin)
Blade (San Carlos Apache/Cherokee....my cousin)
Skylar (San Carlos Apache/Cherokee....my cousin...all of the above three names are brothers)
( before the edit)
Re: Discussion with Moma P
« Reply #13 on: May 09, 2008
Tsisqua
Im 33
Tsisqua
« on: April 11, 2008
We also run a NAIS program...(Native American Inmate Support)...of which many members actively get involved in....NAIS has been ongoing for the past 6 years now.
I haven't been able to find any online mention of this NAIS program except this new yahoo group with no messages.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NativeAmericanInmateSupport/messages
Unless this is all make believe , this person posting as Tsisqua is only anonymous to people who don't know her.
I also want to point out that everything I have presented here is not private and all these claims were placed online by Tsisqua or by people closely associated with her.
As my questions about the claims Tsisqua has made have frequently been misconstrued to be " demands for private information" I want to say that it is entirely Tsisqua's choice if she wants to create a way to verify what she has claimed about herself - or she can choose to simply leave these facts to speak for themselves - however people choose to interpret them.
I also wanted to add that Frederica mentioned in the NAFPS yahoo group that she thought Tsisqua was Theresa Courtney and then later Frederica mentioned that Tsisqua is who she says she is, which gave the impression Frederica was saying Tsisqua is Theresa Courtney .
I don't think there is any reason to think she is the Tsisqua here. Frederica can correct me if I'm wrong , but I think all Frederica meant is that she saw someone named Theresa Courtney who may have been the same person and though she doesn't know who Tsisqua is, she was willing to take Tsisqua's word for who she was and saw no reason to question this.
I have not posted everything that I found, and I am really trying to only post enough information for people to make informed decisions about who they get involved with.
The information that was in the links that no longer work in my first post in this thread have been posted in reply 26 & 30 in the thread below;
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1439.25
The person posting as wredgranny and Mooniesixkiller revealed a bit more of how they see things in the thread below;
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1751.0
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I must be crazy, but it seems this information will continue to bug me until I post it ...
Why is this so important as to put people's names on this site when they just signed some online petition on another site? I though your stated policy was to avoid posting people's information unless they were shown beyond doubt to be doing real i.e. criminal harm? Why are you driving yourself and others crazy with this? Who is harming whom? Jared is not an uncommon name, think there was a sandwich dude who got famous..... There are many people who are intermarried tribally, leading to all kinds of mixes; I know Cherokee/Navajo (their terminology, not mine) Cherokee/ Pima/Maricopa, Cherokee/Kiowa, yeah, even some Cherokee/white folks :) What is the point to all of this other than your apparent personal vendetta against Tsisqua, who if what has been posted is true, has a terminal heart condition which you must certainly be having some effect on. Do you really want to live with that or maybe it is beyond you to think that way? What is the point of all this?
-
Well obviously I am only semi computer literate; MP's words are on the first line above and mine follow below in the above post :-[
-
Why is this so important as to put people's names on this site when they just signed some online petition on another site? I though your stated policy was to avoid posting people's information unless they were shown beyond doubt to be doing real i.e. criminal harm? Why are you driving yourself and others crazy with this? Who is harming whom? Jared is not an uncommon name, think there was a sandwich dude who got famous..... There are many people who are intermarried tribally, leading to all kinds of mixes; I know Cherokee/Navajo (their terminology, not mine) Cherokee/ Pima/Maricopa, Cherokee/Kiowa, yeah, even some Cherokee/white folks :) What is the point to all of this other than your apparent personal vendetta against Tsisqua, who if what has been posted is true, has a terminal heart condition which you must certainly be having some effect on. Do you really want to live with that or maybe it is beyond you to think that way? What is the point of all this?
Wolfhawaii, did you take the time to actually read thru the information Moma provided in the above post or just skim over it noticing names? I suggest you read thru it. There's a lot of information, which raises many questions. Moma is not the only one who has had questions about Tsisqua, Native American Unity, Tribal America, and more. Don't let your dislike for Moma and your admiration for Tsisqua cloud your judgement. Read the post, look into the claims made my Tsisqua and others involved with NAU, ask some questions. Don't jump to an immediate decision because of the personalities involved. Think!
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I've wondered why EAZ (Eli Smith) and Matty (Yazzie/Yellowboy) were removed as board members, in the opening post of this thread on June 26th, while they are both still listed as board members on the actual Native American Unity site. In fact, Matty Yellowboy seems to be #1 on the website, even ranking higher than Tsisqua.
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Well BLS I don't know Tsisqua or Moma Porkypine, so I neither dislike or admire either of them. I am not a member of NAU, not my thing, I hardly even have time to hit powwows.com much anymore. I usually stick to Cherokee related threads here, and MP tends to post a lot about Cherokee subjects, usually in attack mode. I did read MP's info above and I still don't really know what the issue is....is she concerned that some people are posing as real native people and running a free website and stealing people's identities, signing internet petitions using fake names, or what. If there are people posing here as somehing other than they are i don't think that is good and should be dealt with. It will be interesting to see what develops....in the meantime, MP wants Tsisqua to prove who she is (i think) and few if any knows who the hell MP is, kind of strange i think. I have a clan brother who is in office in the UKB, but i wouldn't bother him with this kind of thing trying to determine enrollment.
EDITED TO ADD: If Tsisqua wanted me to verify who she is, I have some resources in Cherokee country and i am willing to do so if she is able to convince me she is who she says she is.....at this point I think it would be a good idea.
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Well BLS I don't know Tsisqua or Moma Porkypine, so I neither dislike or admire either of them. I am not a member of NAU, not my thing, I hardly even have time to hit powwows.com much anymore. I usually stick to Cherokee related threads here, and MP tends to post a lot about Cherokee subjects, usually in attack mode. I did read MP's info above and I still don't really know what the issue is....is she concerned that some people are posing as real native people and running a free website and stealing people's identities, signing internet petitions using fake names, or what. If there are people posing here as somehing other than they are i don't think that is good and should be dealt with. It will be interesting to see what develops....in the meantime, MP wants Tsisqua to prove who she is (i think) and few if any knows who the hell MP is, kind of strange i think. I have a clan brother who is in office in the UKB, but i wouldn't bother him with this kind of thing trying to determine enrollment.
The issue is honesty and truthfulness. There are too many inconsistencies, half-truths, and lies where Tsisqua and Native American Unity are concerned.
NAU is made up of a board of 13 enrolled Native Americans
Our Staff members are as follows:
Tsissy
EAZ
Matty
Blade
Skylar
Da'Quah
Juan
Alfie
Lucas
Jared
Consoni
Clint
Marcus
http://www.freewebs.com/nativeunitysite/questions.htm
Sometimes these people have last names, sometimes not. Sometimes their surnames change; i.e. Matty Yellowboy/Matty Yazzie. We don't know who any of these people are.
It's one thing to be an anonymous poster on a forum and another thing to be an anonymous adminstrator of your own forum. These people (or possibly one or two people and several sock puppets) have access to their members' names, ISP and IP #, even their physical addresses. That bothers me. They have a chat room for teens, monitored 24/7. Well, that doesn't reassure me, since we know nothing about the people doing the monitoring.
Tsisqua claims to be an activist, yet signs petitions with her screen name. How many activists do you know who refuse to stand up and be counted as a real person?
And speaking of petitions . . . yes, it does seem as though the names of real people are being signed to these petitions without their knowledge. That would constitute indentity theft.
Why does Tsisqua refuse to give out any information about herself? She claims to need to remain anonymous because of the work she does. What? What does she do that puts her and her family in jeopardy? Exposing fakes and frauds? I did belong to the NAU Forum for a while; I know the work that they are doing. Nothing posted on that forum is original; most is copied right from NAFPS. Tsisqua isn't doing any ground-breaking detective work that would put her in danger. Even the claim to need to remain anonymous is bogus. Tsisqua has given out enough information about herself that anyone who knew her would easily be able to identify her on this or any other forum. How many enrolled Keetoowah, with a heart condition, formerly lived in New York and Canada and now reside in Ireland? Anyone who was her neigher in the KRA Apartments in Cornwall Island or on Raquette Point Road in Hogansburg, NY would recognize who she is. Or was this all a lie? Maybe she never lived in Cornwall Island or in Hogansburg, NY. Who knows? There have been too many lies. Maybe she really isn't enrolled Keetoowah. Who knows? I don't mean to sound crass, but how do we know she really has a health issue? Was that simply a ploy for sympathy? Seems the heart condition only gets mentioned when things aren't going her way.
As I said in another thread . . . If a member is claiming to be someone they aren't, how are they any different than the frauds we help to expose? Just because they may not be selling ceremony, doesn't make it okay. Claiming a spirituality and culture that is not rightfully yours is wrong. Appropriation doesn't have to be sold to make it unethical. A lie is still a lie, even if no money is attached to it.
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The key question is NAU selling ceremonies or culture? As far as internet petitions go the reality is that they are never counted and legally not valid because there is no way of verifying signatures. So why waste all this time and energy on it.
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I also have not been sure whether to post this or not , and i talked about some of the pros and cons of confronting people who are misrepresenting themselves in the thread below .
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1874.0
I'm still not entirely sure what is the best thing to do , but I guess I believe when in doubt just keep doing your best to tell the truth ..
I don't agree that the only thing that matters is if someone is selling ceremony or misrepresenting culture.
People who lie are dangerous.
Before I posted this i did my best to confirm Tsisqua's stories. I contacted an activist who works in the prisions who knows Eric Wildcat-Hall. They told me Eric doesn't have a brother Juan and doesn't have computer access.
So , although we can't confirm who signed those petitions we can confirm there is an NAU member named Juan Wildcat-Hall who is not Eric's brother and coincidentally someone signing Tsisqua's petitions as Eric Wildcat-Hall.
So what is going on here? Where did Juan get the name Wildcat-Hall?
It should also be possible to confirm the story of what happened to Mark Yazzie , and events like this are usually well known in Indian country. How come no one has heard of this?
I'm not trying to find out who Tsisqua is ( though I don't agree with heading up a Native Unity group anonymously )
When I contacted the activist mentioned above , I was very clear that if they knew who Tsisqua was based on her description, all I needed was confirmation that she was known and trusted in the Native community , and that I wished torespect her desire to remain anonymous.
Although this person works on native rights issues in the prisons and although Tsisqua clains to have done work in the prisons for 6 years this activist had no clue who she was and instead got the same impression I have, That she is stealing bits of peoples bios to create ghost personas. This person had already discussed Tsisqua with someone they know on the UKB tribal council and this person also found Tsisqua's claims doubtful.
NAFPS lists many fake tribes - as I understand it that is because groups calling themself Ndn and organizing into a political body when they aren't Ndns creates problems. So simply misapproprieating Native identities is something NAFPS does deal with and NAU goals are political - to unify Native people into one voice. As Ialready pointed out how can ths possibly be legitimate in an on line group when everybody could be anybody?
There is many real concerns here.
Sure this could all be a misunderstanding, but I find Tsisqua's expectation that she should be able to claim to be a Native person and head of a Native unity group without having to verify that either she or any of the NAU members are Native comnpletely bizarre, especially when she makes a point of going after people like Ravencrow and Red Nation Society mainly because they claim a Native identity which can't be verified. That she would get all insulted and indigent that anyone would ask for some way to verify her own CLAIMS just seems completely unreasonable.
All Tisqua would have to do is arrange with someone in the UKB tribal council to vouche for her being enrolled there and that the stories she has told are true. As has already been pointed out she has provided enough personal information that assuming she isn't lying she isn't anonymous to anyone who is aquainted with her. So arranging thios in no way would jeprodize her safty.
If she doesn't want to do this thats fine. But claims she has made, the names and tribal affiliations of NAU members really don't seem to fit together. The doubts about her are completely in her power to resolve and before anyone starts to make her out to be a victim here, it's important to understand she has set this up herself.
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From the first page of this thread:
Re: Tsisqua
« Reply #16 on: April 12, 2008, 09:30:33 am »
Now if the Admin here at NAFPS wish me to remove our advertisements asking our members and readers to visit here in support....I will do so without a second thought. Nothing we place on our site can validate NAU....only how we deal with others...only the trust people build up due to their dealings with us....only through our keeping our word...can show who we are.
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1674.0
Right now I'm going to talk about some of my personal interactions with Tsisqua. She, nor anyone else at NAU, hasn't given me any reason to trust anything they say.
One of my first encounters with Tsisqua came in April. I had made a post here on NAFPS about Rachel Holzwarth. Tsisqua copied and pasted it to the NAU Forum, with the intro "Sent by bls926". While I don't care if someone copies anything I post anywhere on the internet, especially if it involves exposing a fraud, don't say I sent you something when I didn't. It would have been nice if she'd asked first and then she could have said something like, "Posted on NAFPS, reprinted here with bls926's permission". I sent Tsisqua a pm and asked her to change the intro, which she did.
I became a member of the NAU Forum in May 2008. I contributed a few things, mainly in regard to Holzwarth. There was one thread, started by Da'Quah, that listed frauds, people to avoid. David Swallow was on this list. I posted, asking why David was included. Tsisqua posted that Da'Quah was out of town and wouldn't be back for a week and then supplied links to threads on NAFPS where David Swallow had been discussed. While I might not agree with everything David has done, I would never refer to him as a fraud. One of the other moderators, I believe it was Blade, posted that Da'Quah was down in Texas and wouldn't be back for two weeks. I said I'd wait for his return; then asked what part of Texas Da'Quah was visiting. I'm in the Houston area and thought it would be nice if we could get together. There was no response to that.
In May and June, when Sheila Williams was acting the fool about NAFPS, Al, and other members here, I posted my thoughts about this.
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1751.0
While my May post must not have upset anyone at NAU, the one I made in June obviously did. My account at NAU was disabled on June 19th. I e-mailed Tsisqua and she responded that Juan had taken over the forum for her, but she was sure it was "just a technical problem". She was going to look into it, call Juan, and get back to me as soon as she knew something. She also said that NAU did not support Granny. "We dont support Granny....or her messed up behavior...not one bit...Infact she's just heard from me in person about her lies...posting on our yahoo group that she took down all postings and NAFPS is lying about her...when I went to her site myself and saw these things were STILL posted there..."
A week later, on June 27th, we had a couple visitors to Woodland Indians who had come from a link posted on the NAU Yahoo Group. Since no one at Woodland belongs to that group, we wondered just how the link to our forum got posted there. I tried to join the NAU Yahoo group, but was rejected. I e-mailed Tsisqua about this, wondering why I was rejected. Another song and dance, from Blade Yazzie this time. "Just to let you know, Tsiss is actually in the hospital, and may be there for some time. I will look into this for you when I get the chance, I am sure as you can imagine, we are busy with our own work, and trying to keep up with all Tsiss did." If Tsisqua was in the hospital, she must have had her laptop with her; she had logged onto Woodland and was logged into NAFPS several times a day. I wrote Blade another e-mail on July 5th, inquiring about Tsisqua.
I received an e-mail from Tsisqua on July 7th, letting me know she'd just gotten home the night before, and thanking me for my patience.
Another e-mail from Tsisqua on July 8th. "Seems we're having a problem with the NAU forum...I cant find anywhere that you were banned ...Ive even checked all the actions listed on the board regarding mod stats and its showing nothing..." She suggested that I re-register on the forum. She went on to say, "With regards to the Yahoo group...I dont run it...I just set it up for members to use is all....so Ive sent mails to the 5 admin that do...to request in writing why you weren't accepted as a member there...could have been something simple like your profile not being filled out...I dont know...but once I hear back from them I'll forward the mails to you....and I'll get it figured out...in honestly im kind of surprised you weren't accepted there since many members know of you from NAFPS." Yeah, that's probably the reason my application was rejected; I'm sure Sheila Williams wouldn't want me there.
I have wondered about Mark Yazzie's brutal murder since I first read about it on Tribal America. No one I know has heard anything about it and many have questions. I wrote Tsisqua a pm on July 16th, asking about his death, where it had happened, and if the perpetrators had been arrested. I'll post more about that later.
Back to the NAU Forum . . . I did as Tsisqua suggested and re-registered on July 17th. Another rejection. I'm sure my pm about Mark Yazzie's death might have played a part in this. But then, maybe not. My account was disabled on June 19th and Tsisqua has given me the run around for the past month. Obviously someone wanted me off that forum and doesn't want me back.
Do I have any reason to trust Tsisqua or anyone else involved with Native American Unity?
I don't think so.
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I debated all day yesterday about posting Tsisqua's pm's. Since I did tell her right up front that people were asking questions and I needed to tell them something, I don't consider this a breach of confidence. I wanted to post Matty's e-mail to me also. I don't feel that's a breach in confidentiality either. He wrote to me, unsolicited, threatening me with an improbable lawsuit. If he didn't want me to let people see this side of him, maybe he should have acted better. Remember in the thread about Sheila Williams, I compared the things that were being said and their actions to those of ravencrow. Matty falls in that same category. He's making threats that would never hold up in court. I never threatened anyone; did not harrass anyone. Re-posting info about someone that's been availabe online for the past 7 or 8 months is definitely not an invasion of privacy.
bls926
Senior Member
Posts: 184
Mark Yazzie
« Sent to: Tsisqua on: July 16, 2008, 04:41:55 pm »
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Tsisqua,
I hope you are feeling better and stronger, getting healthier each day. Hope there won't be any more trips to the hospital anytime soon.
I mean no disrespect to you or your family by what I'm about to ask. Several people have inquired about your cousin's death. It seems there were no reports of Mark Yazzie's murder or the circumstances surrounding it. The only place it is mentioned is on the Tribal America website. If this young man was murdered while protecting a burial site, he should be remembered. People want to know where it happened. They want to know if the perpetrators were caught and are standing trial for this horrible crime. Tsisqua, there are several people whom I respect a great deal, who doubt this murder happened. I need to tell them something. Help me out here.
I'm sorry if I've offended you in any way. That was not my intent.
Bonnie
bls926
Senior Member
Posts: 184
Re: Mark Yazzie
« Sent to: Tsisqua on: July 21, 2008, 11:22:00 am »
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Quote from: Tsisqua on July 17, 2008, 05:21:43 pm
I expect these are the postings from Tribal that you are referring to (In reverse order but dated):
Member Responses
#8048 Re: Mark Coyote Yazzie - I too am sad for the loss of Mark Coyote Yazzie. I understand he was defending a burial site from being desecrated and was fatally beaten in the process. My prayers are with all of those who grieve for him as I also pray that those who perpetrated these heinous acts will be brought to justice. Mi Takuye Oyacin (2007-12-15 19:12:41.672261) #161182
#7993 Re: Mark Coyote Yazzie - I REALLLY DONT KNOW MARK BUT I KNOW WHAT THE FAMILY IS GOING THROUGH I JUST HAD TO HELP A FRIEND BURY HIS MOM I ALSO CALLED HER MOM SHE WAS ALWAYS THERE FOR ME IM SORRY FOR YOUR LOSS... (2007-12-11 21:29:21.400677) #166802
#7971 Re: Mark Coyote Yazzie - I am soo sorry about Mark! This was a terrible tragedy that should not of happend. He went home, and now walks with the spirits of our Ancestors! And He walks proudly among them!! (2007-12-10 17:55:57.24811) #165312
#7906 Re: Mark Coyote Yazzie - Thank You to all who have keep me in your prayers and thoughts. I apprieciate all of you. My heart bleeds...as Tsissy said, let us not allow Marks work to have been in vein.Lonefeather. (2007-12-07 09:57:26.039149) #164149
#7901 Re: Mark Coyote Yazzie - I appreciate all the prayers and words...please....let us not allow Marks work to have been in vain...I urge you to support our native rights, to unite and join forces against the desecration of our sacred lands...to make the voice of our people a united voice...a powerful voice...only together can we be heard...Tsisqua (2007-12-05 10:17:28.098041) #166047
#7900 Re: Mark Coyote Yazzie - Tsis and Lonefeather from our household to yours our prayers are with you. We are sorry for your loss. Wankan Tanka give this family solice where needed, let the ancestors walk with Mark as he crosses over.All of Our Relations,Dave and Wendy Tatanka Inyan (2007-12-04 15:21:41.535699) #166717
#7898 Re: Mark Coyote Yazzie - Who is Mark Coyote Yazzie?? (2007-12-04 12:43:27.049186) Anon
#7897 Re: Mark Coyote Yazzie - Tsis, I'm so sorry and my prayers are with you and your family, and Lonefeather, my heart is with you as well. (2007-12-04 10:35:33.409202) #163468
#7896 Re: Mark Coyote Yazzie - Tsis, sis I am so sorry to hear this news. I pray Great Spirit will be with you and your loved ones and bring you strength. (2007-12-03 16:42:06.836398) #47103
#7894 Re: Mark Coyote Yazzie - Tis a sad sad day. To all his family, especially Tsis, my fervent prayers ask for peace and tranquilty for you in dealing with this tragedy. (2007-12-03 14:01:48.298232) #143182
#7893 Re: Mark Coyote Yazzie - Mark... my heart is with you as you start your journey on the path to Creator. My prayers are with you and your family Tsis, I'm here for you whenever you need me little one. Diana ( Fire Eyes ) (2007-12-03 11:07:34.031334) #166035
#7892 Re: Mark Coyote Yazzie - Mark, our hearts ache as you take your long journey... Tsisqua, My thoughts and prayers are with you and your family... (2007-12-03 10:43:53.724725) #166010
12 replies found
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Now please note...myself nor Lonefeather (Tina) Marks fiance at the time did NOT state what happened to Mark...the only person who claimed to know...was the topmost poster...Keepsthefire...who is not a member of my family...nor a friend to any of my family.
Myself, nor Tina...or any of our family members who were at Tribal posted anything regarding the death/cause of death of my cousin...as it would be wrong to speak of him in such a way after his passing....some posts are also missing from that particular forum...as it was closed down/thread locked at that time due to some disrespectful postings made.
Now quite honestly...I couldnt give a rat ass what people here think...they know nothing of my family...nor is it anything to do with them now...nor will it ever be. And I mean no disrespect to you in my words.
I am not going to state what happened to my cousin...nor why...or by whom. It is a matter for my own family.....I did not take it to Tribal...and I wont bring it here...out of respect for the wonderful man who is no longer with us...this is a family matter.
Anyone who has an issue with that...they know how to find me...or they can contact Marks brother who has more right to speak of this than I...I was simply his cousin.
Matty can be contacted at NativeAmericanUnity@gmail.com. If he wishes to speak of this...so be it...but I do not. I dont involve myself in the family matters of others here...and I expect the same dignity...no matter who they are.
Incidently, Marks legal name was never Yazzie....but that is not the concern of anyone here either...let alone annoymous posters of this board with little better to do than poke their noses into other peoples family matters.
Again I mean no disrespect by my words to you....Im just a little disgusted right about now.
Tsissy
Tsisqua,
First let me say that the people I referred to, who said that they doubted this murder occurred, are people I know outside of NAFPS; both are enrolled members of their Nations and are highly respected in Indian Country. It doesn't matter that Yazzie wasn't his legal name. Both are skeptical that this murder happened, regardless of the individual's name. Something like that could not happen without people knowing about it. AIM would know. All of Indian Country would know. The fact that no one has heard anything about the incident is very suspicious.
Second, you and Lonefeather may not have said how Mark Yazzie died on Tribal America, but neither of you corrected the poster who said Yazzie had died protecting a burial site and you both implied that was what had happened.
Tribal America - from your pm
#7906 Re: Mark Coyote Yazzie - Thank You to all who have keep me in your prayers and thoughts. I apprieciate all of you. My heart bleeds...as Tsissy said, let us not allow Marks work to have been in vein.Lonefeather. (2007-12-07 09:57:26.039149) #164149
#7901 Re: Mark Coyote Yazzie - I appreciate all the prayers and words...please....let us not allow Marks work to have been in vain...I urge you to support our native rights, to unite and join forces against the desecration of our sacred lands...to make the voice of our people a united voice...a powerful voice...only together can we be heard...Tsisqua (2007-12-05 10:17:28.098041) #166047
Tina has referred to his brutal murder defending a sacred burial site on other places.
Stop the digging on scared ground
45 Patsy Floyd OUr group has lost a very dear man because he tried to stop grave diggers and they attacked him with picks and shovels. This must stop, this discretion of our ancestors.
46 Anonymous
47 Tina Lonefeather Someone that I loved, that we all loved has been killed for these very same reasons. For standing up for the truth, for what is right, for his people. He and many others are the honorable ones...not you. Ryan Weller, where is your grandmother buried you fucking coward. Justice will be ours...
http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/BurialGroundRights/signatures-1.html
So, saying y'all didn't say how he died, while being technically correct, is far from the truth. Much is said with your silence and also with what was posted by you and Tina.
You suggested that I contact Mark's brother Matty, NativeAmericanUnity@gmail.com. Would that be Yazzie or Yellowboy? Or is that one and the same? I still fail to see the reason y'all use aliases.
Tsisqua, I think it's time for you to come clean. If your cousin was murdered, tell us. If not, it's time you made a retraction and apologize for misleading everyone.
Bonnie
bls926
Senior Member
Posts: 184
Re: Mark Yazzie
« Sent to: Tsisqua on: July 21, 2008, 02:30:51 pm »
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Quote from: Tsisqua on July 21, 2008, 12:58:13 pm
I suggest you put your Native friends in contact with Matty at NativeAmericanUnity@gmail.com, if they have questions, I am sure he will be more than willing to answer, hence afterall, Mark was his brother and he was there at the time.
Tsisqua,
I'm not going to bother anyone else about this. You're the one who claims to have lost a cousin. Either you bring this out in the open or I will.
Bonnie
That was the last correspondence I had with Tsisqua.
Monday evening, I received this e-mail form Matty.
(No Subject)???
From: NAU Native American Unity (nativeamericanunity@gmail.com)
Sent: Mon 7/21/08 6:22 PM
To: bls926@msn.com
I am enclosing a message I sent to you recently on the NAU forum, I presume you did not receive it.
Until the issue regarding my brother is cleared up, I cannot allow you to join this group, no matter what Tsiss has asked of me, I personally do not wish you to be here, even if she does.
I have contacted our family lawyer today, and I can assure you, anyone speaking ill of my brother, his death, or my family, will be severely dealt with, be you and your 'friends' annoymous or not. I see even now you seem confused even of your gender, since you are apparently a female, yet claim here on your request to join, that you are male.
I see your questioning of Tsiss as simply a ploy to try to obtain information regarding who SHE is, and nothing more. If Moma Porcupine cannot do her own dirty work, more fool you for being her lacky.
You may take this right back to Moma Porcupine, as I am no fool, and am already well aware of the game you are playing.
Infringement of a persons personal privicy, infringement of a persons family matters will not be taken lying down, of that I can assure you, be it on the NAFPS board, or anywhere else on the net.
You nor Moma Porcupine have the right to question the death of my brother, you are not my family, and my brother was nothing to you both. And I swear on his memory I will do all necessary to deal with anyone legally who raises this issue. I do not care how much money it costs, money I have in abundance and it will be well spent. Do you not know the taboos of our people? To not speak of the passed? Yet you wish to pick apart his death? I will not have it.
If you contact Tsiss again regarding this issue, I will take legal proceedings of harrassment. If you fail to believe me, I suggest you just try me. And the same goes for anyone else. I do not know what makes you think you have the right to question the death of anyone, and unless you are a federal agent, I have nothing more to say to you. Anything else I need to say can be said through my lawyer.
All messages, emails, etc, etc, are being filed and logged as evidence. I understand from your message to Tsiss in NAFPS that you came to her appearingly in a good way, but I sense the underlying tone of your words. I also sense those you respect, are people who have none for my family. As such, I will not entertain them or you unless it is via a courtroom. I hope I have made myself abundantly clear.
Matty
Your most recent message to Tsiss was threatening, of which has also been passed onto my lawyer.
I will also quote a portion of the registration rules from NAFPS:
You agree, through your use of this forum, that you will not post any material which is
false, defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, threatening, invasive of a person's privacy, adult material, or otherwise in violation of any International or United States Federal law. You also agree not to post any copyrighted material unless you own the copyright or you have written consent from the owner of the copyrighted material. Spam, flooding, advertisements, chain letters, pyramid schemes, and solicitations are also forbidden on this forum.
I will also include some information we have regarding yourself from one of your very own aquaintances:
In a message dated 5/15/2008 8:11:14 P.M. Central Daylight Time, XXXXXX writes: Your welcome. BLS is not enrolled either-some Cherokee ancester somewhere that's all, but way back, but she has never posted her family names. I see she posted a link to NAFPS on Easterband and then went back to NAFPS to make another derrogatory comment! Bonnie Lynn Singleton from Housten, Texas and Martha Newcomb Fanning from Housten, Texas-I didn't tell you and these names are posted on the web in different forums.
Since you seem confused regarding who you yourself are, I do not see your right to question the death of my brother. Who was he to you? Who am I to you? We are nothing, and we have not openly posted anywhere on the internet regarding his death. Again, this matter will now be dealt with legally. I see you have visited our NAU site to search for cached information on our Political and Informative section, you also visited our Singles Chatroom to do the same. Your IP number is logged, and my search shows the information we received above is correct, thus enabling my lawyer to locate your actual physical address. So please, do continue with your threats, anything further you wish to say will be taken directly to our family lawyer and dealt with accordingly.
Matty (NAU ~ Native American Unity)
--
There are no leaders in Unity...only many people walking side by side!
If he thinks this is going to scare me quiet . . . he really doesn't know who bls926 is.
To clear up a few inaccuracies in the info one of my "acquaintancies" sent to Matty:
I will also include some information we have regarding yourself from one of your very own aquaintances:
In a message dated 5/15/2008 8:11:14 P.M. Central Daylight Time, XXXXXX writes: Your welcome. BLS is not enrolled either-some Cherokee ancester somewhere that's all, but way back, but she has never posted her family names. I see she posted a link to NAFPS on Easterband and then went back to NAFPS to make another derrogatory comment! Bonnie Lynn Singleton from Housten, Texas and Martha Newcomb Fanning from Housten, Texas-I didn't tell you and these names are posted on the web in different forums.
bls926 = Bonnie Lucille Singleton and my birthday September 26th
Newsflash: Everyone who posts on the internet and lives in Texas is not necessaily from Houston and definitely not the same person. Don't know why other names were brought into this. I have never posted under any other nic. I have been bls926 since day one and was Bonnie Singleton even before there was an internet.
Yes, I live in the Houston area. Never made any secret of that. Grew up in southeastern Pennsylvania, spent the first half of my life there. Guess I have two homes now, Texas and Pennsylvania.
No, I'm not enrolled. "Cherokee ancester somewhere that's all, but way back" . . . not exactly. It's only three generations back. My direct ancestors decided to leave the Nation. My great-grandmother married a German blacksmith and became assimilated. I was raised white, as was my mother and grandfather. I have family on the Baker Roll. I'm not going to give out their names on an open forum. I've given you my real name; you don't need theirs.
The link to NAFPS that I posted on eb.com was to the thread about Holzwarth and the Grandmother Drum. I honestly don't know what they're talking about with "then went back to NAFPS to make another derrogatory comment!" Derogatory comment about what? Rachel Holzwarth? And that would be a bad thing?
As a side note: Whoever wrote the above quoted message to Matty really should have used spell-check before sending it.
Matty and Tsisqua, you don't scare me.
I don't understand why y'all need to pretend to be something you aren't. I think others need to see exactly what kind of people you really are.
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When threats of legal action didn't work, NAU resorted to head games. Received this e-mail from Matty yesterday.
Matty/Tsisqua, it's still not working. You can't silence the truth.
Well Done???
From: NAU Native American Unity (nativeamericanunity@gmail.com)
Sent: Thu 7/24/08 9:01 PM
To: bls926@msn.com
I just wanted to thank you Bonnie, we've been inundated with mails of support, and our membership has risen by 173 members since you started posting. So I must thank you for the publicity. It seems that you have not made us look bad in any way, considering all your 'evidence' is merely heresay and speculation, and since you are desperately piecing together things from the net you 'presume' to be true, things you 'presume are connected', my how foolish you look, and in actual fact, you've made yourself look nothing more than vindictive and out for blood.
You posted private PM's on the board, yet Tsiss was made to remove her own PM's from Moma Porcupine and Barnaby. Showing true colors now I see, not just you, but the admin of the board, and other people have noticed this also.
I am glad Tsiss is away, as I know she would have posted in response to you. This way people are left with only your own vindictive words and rantings. As for my words to you? They show only honesty and disgust at your behaviour, and I see nothing wrong with that. I want people to know how I am. We have stated before, we do not put up with any BS, fakes and trouble makers, although we treat all people with respect, and I have always spoken to you in a respectful manner. It is a pity you cannot say the same.
Nice job Bonnie.
Matty
--
There are no leaders in Unity...only many people walking side by side!
Why write me about it? Why not post on the forum, Matty?
Matty, about the comments you made concerning the PM's I'd received from Tsisqua and posted here on the forum . . . That's why I made it a point to say that people were asking about Yazzie's death and I needed to tell them something; basically telling her I was going to let people know what she told me. Tsisqua had no expectation of privacy. The PM's that Tsisqua posted and then were deleted were not written in that way. Think that's what made the difference.
If there's anyone who's had a better experience with Tsisqua and/or NAU, or knows her/them to be who they say they are, please add to this thread or e-mail me directly.
Edit for punctuation. My OCD got the best of me; had to fix it.
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What bls926 is saying about there being a difference between posting PM's that were clearly looking for information to pass on to other people and PMs made in other circumstances is true but there is more of a story to this.
First, Tsisqua posted my PM as an edit made to a post which was made quite a bit earlier and already had several replies made to it , so I didn't even notice it had been posted and it wasn't in thew flow of the conversation for me to reply to this and the way it was posted.
Secondly, Tsisqua snipped off the beginning and end of the PM
I still have the original in my outbox and in it's entirety it reads ;
Hi Tsisqua
I had to think about this for a bit...
http://jayfulton.wordpress.com/2008/04/06/grandmother_peace_drum_and_pepper-spray/
NAU ~ Native American Unity Says:
April 10, 2008 at 11:45 am
Hartman deetz could you please contact our office at NativeAmericanUnity_Office@yahoo.com
We would appreciate it greatly…with thanks,
NAU
Maybe you don't mean to , but you give the impression of being the main coordinator of a group of 19,000 Native activists , with an "office" .
I can't speak for the other people who are members of this message board, but as you are presenting yourself as the coordinator of a large Native organization, would you be comfortable to
A. Introduce yourself in the Members introdution as a person with a real name and tribe you are enrolled in or otherwisew conected with , and also provide some of the real names of a few of your associates and the tribes they are enrolled in , together with the address where the NAU office is located ...
OR
B. Introduce yourself in the Members introdution, as an anonymous person with a website called NAU, a large mailing list , and a computer in a room in a private residence that you call "your office"
I want to say I don't think there is anything wrong with being an anonymous person who sets up a web page to provide information or networking for Native people, and i don't see a problem with having a mailing list of 19,000 - if this is true ... But this needs to be presented in a way that people understand who you are and what you are doing .
I don't mean to be rude. You seem like a nice person and some of what you have contributed has been really helpful - just - your claims of having an office and 19,000 members might be misleading, and as some of the issues you are approaching are sensitive, it would be good if you were clear about who you are, who you are affiliated with, and what you and the group NAU is actually doing.
Sorry but I do care about these issues and we have all kinds come through here trying to promote themselves to the detriment of NDN people , so I feel these things need to be kept clear.
Other than this bit of uncertainty , your support is appreciated !
The parts highlighed in black bold are what Tsisqua chose to post. The parts not highlghted and especially the part hghlighted in bold red is what tsisqua chose to delete.
She then went on to accuse me ;
Re: Tsisqua
« Reply #16 on: April 12, 2008
Tsiqua
Moma Porcupine...with respect....you are entitled to your personal opinion of me...and of NAU...and I have no issue with that whatsoever....infact im becomming quite used to it....your PM to me did however give the impression you were part of the admin here....of which I can post if need be....you took a highly authorative tone...
I mentioned to Barnaby that this seemed wrong on a number of levels and because of this Tsisqua was asked to remove the PM which she did.
I don't think threatening emails that try to frighten people into silence should be kept private. It can't be shown how inappropriate this response from NAU is , without showing the messages that led up to this.
So the circumstances of Tsisqua posting my PM and bls926 posting the communication between her and NAU are quite different, and if a more reasonable response to reasonable questions had been recieved, I doubt there would have been any reason to make this public.
bls926
If there's anyone who's had a better experience with Tsisqua and/or NAU, or knows her/them to be who they say they are, please add to this thread or e-mail me directly.
I believe bls926 means people who can be verified to be real ... with real reputations in the native community . Not sock puppets or people who are supporting exploiters.
I also want to point out that in spite of the threats and undeserved abuse bls926 is still doing her best to be fair and give the benifit of whatever doubt exists.
As I have also done.
But there is a point where things are beyond reasonable doubt ...
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Tsisqua, if you are reading, please see my reply #51 above, and contact me if you want my assistance in resolving this. This issue has gone far enough that I think it is important for the concerns to be addressed.
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Wolfhawaii
EDITED TO ADD: If Tsisqua wanted me to verify who she is, I have some resources in Cherokee country and i am willing to do so if she is able to convince me she is who she says she is.....at this point I think it would be a good idea
Wofhawaii , it was already been mentioned that people have been in contact with respected people in the Cherokee community and I have no idea why you are suggesting yourself for this. Though you have repeatedly edited many of your posts in this thread , and some of your personal and nasty attacks on me have been removed , you obviously have a dog in this fight though you have not said what it is. And you are, or were, recently involved in befriending exploiters Either you got involved supporting these people because you didn't know how to ask the right questions and your BS dectector isn't working very well, or you just didn't care what these people were up to. You have more than once brushed off official statements about correct cultural protocols from the CNO as " just their opinion". I have no idea why you imagine you are an unbiased person with trustworthy connections in the Cherokee community.
I suppose if you can help get someone we all agree is trustworthy like Al or Debbieredbear - get in touch with someone who can be verified to be in the UKB tribal council , and Tsiqua can provide enough information to this person that they can can confirm Tsisqua's claims - while allowing her to remain anonymous , what you are suggesting might be helpful - but if you expect us to just take you or some freind of yours word for this - i guess people can believe whatever they want, but after how you have treated me on this thread - that sure isn't going to work for me .
If Tsisqua wanted to confirm her stories through a more neutral person i would suggest she contact Al or Debbieredbear and ask who is was that I talked to who knows someone in th UKB tribal council, and how to get in touch with them . This person has a verifiable history of activism and is also a NAFPS member though they rarely post. Their email is in their profile.
Wolfhawaii, I also need to point out that you deleted the post you made on April 15, and in doing so you broke an agreement you made with me. You asked me to edit my posts removing quotes and my responses to information you posted about yourself that you later decided you wanted to keep private. I edited my posts at your request , only because you agreed to post in this thread , acknowledging that you had edited your posts and that you asked me to do the same .
I see you removed this acknowledgement and replaced it with some letters that sound like something rude.
Re: Tsisqua and Moma porcupine
« Reply #45 on: April 15, 2008
Wolfhawaii
WTFIWTS
I can't see any reason you would do this except to make me feel violated -Kind of a strange thing to do if you want me to trust you as any kind of a go between ...
I don't want to drag this thread off topic by explaining why I don't think wolfhawaii should be displacing the authority that rightly belongs to respected Cherokee people who live in Cherokee communities - or by pointing out how he has repeatedly done this.
Maybe I'll post this in another thread ...
But for now I want to say is I have found wolfhawaii to be both abusive and dishonest, I don't trust this person at all , and i don't see why anyone else who is paying attention would .
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There you go again, MP.....I'm trying to help your cause and you attack me again.....and you think that you are trustworthy? You have attacked my personal integrity and posted personal information about me that caused me to be physically threatened. About all I have done to you was say you don't seem to be a very nice person. Why is it when someone disagrees with you you must attack them?
If you are really contemplating investigating me, do what you must . You know who i am.....get your "trusted Cherokee person" to ask the deputy chief of the UKB, or the chief of Echota and /or Redbird, or the head of Cherokee Studies at NSU about who I am and what kind of person I am. Regarding your comment about my supporting exploiters: I have met a great many people in my journey, some good, some not so good. Sometimes it takes a while to really find out about people, especially if they use false claims of relation and use that to worm their way in. I have gained insight from these experiences over time. If you use this rationale as a means to declare me untrustworthy then by your own words you are untrustworthy as well. I have never profitted from ndn culture, or encouraged anyone to take a path other than traditional culture.
EDITED TO ADD: In answer to your question of what dog I have in the fight.....FAIRNESS and BALANCE.
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There you go again, MP.....I'm trying to help your cause and you attack me again.....and you think that you are trustworthy? You have attacked my personal integrity and posted personal information about me that caused me to be physically threatened. About all I have done to you was say you don't seem to be a very nice person. Why is it when someone disagrees with you you must attack them?
If you are really contemplating investigating me, do what you must . You know who i am.....get your "trusted Cherokee person" to ask the deputy chief of the UKB, or the chief of Echota and /or Redbird, or the head of Cherokee Studies at NSU about who I am and what kind of person I am. Regarding your comment about my supporting exploiters: I have met a great many people in my journey, some good, some not so good. Sometimes it takes a while to really find out about people, especially if they use false claims of relation and use that to worm their way in. I have gained insight from these experiences over time. If you use this rationale as a means to declare me untrustworthy then by your own words you are untrustworthy as well. I have never profitted from ndn culture, or encouraged anyone to take a path other than traditional culture.
EDITED TO ADD: In answer to your question of what dog I have in the fight.....FAIRNESS and BALANCE.
Hmmm I always thought fairness and balance required some commitment to honesty ...
Wolf hawaii
I never disclosed any private information about you. That is an outright lie. You disclosed private information about yourself- apparently just so you could have the pleasure of accusing me of disclosing private information and endangering you ... I guess if there is nothing real I did wrong , you just need to make something up .... I never even knew the private information YOU disclosed, but I was nice enough to edit out where I quoted you and responded to the information YOU disclosed... I have all this saved and could repost what was said before you began deleting your comments and asking me to do the same.
I don't want to let you drag this thread off topic, so if you want to talk about your deletions, lets go over here ...
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1801.0
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You already drug it off thread and made it about me......but yes, let's adjourn to the other thread shall we? Got your cut and paste fingers all limbered up?
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If there's anyone who's had a better experience with Tsisqua and/or NAU, or knows her/them to be who they say they are, please add to this thread or e-mail me directly.
It's been about a week and a half since I made this post. The only person who has responded is wolfhawaii. Even his support seemed lukewarm; IF Tsisqua could convince him of who she is, he'd get in touch with someone in the UKB to vouch for her. Looks like that hinges on Tsisqua being able to prove she's enrolled Keetoowah or at least known by someone in Cherokee country.
I have not received any e-mails, pro or con.
Tsisqua/Native American Unity doesn't seem to have much support at all.
Tsisqua hasn't logged into NAFPS since July 21st, when this all started to be made public. Being exposed as a fraud has to be embarrassing, especially when you've been so vocal about wannabees and cultural/spiritual appropriation.
Guess it is what it is.
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Well, like most everyone else I've stayed out of this, feeling I had nothing much to add to the discussion.
But at some point I think I voiced some concerns about misinformation on the NAU site (can't remember in which thread) and never got an answer.
I haven't looked at the whole NAU site. There does seem to be some useful introductory information. But other things, like these, had me concerned:
from http://www.freewebs.com/nativeamericanunity/nativemedicine.htm
Methods of healing include prayer, chanting, music, smudging (burning sage or aromatic woods), herbs, laying-on of hands, massage, counseling, imagery, fasting, harmonizing with nature, dreaming, sweat lodges, taking hallucinogens (e.g., peyote), developing inner silence, going on a shamanic journey, and ceremony.
...
Key Terms
Shaman
A person who serves as an intermediary between humans and the supernatural world, using special powers to cure illness, foretell the future, etc.
And this page http://www.freewebs.com/nativeunitysite/nativewriters.htm includes notorious fraud Charles ("Heywhatever") Storm ( http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=227.0 ) as a "Native American Author."
I'm always glad when people want to help with activism, but that sort of stuff on the website made me uncomfortable and unwilling to recommend it.
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I thought this was an introducation post should this post be moved to another section??
Just asking??
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I thought this was an introducation post should this post be moved to another section??
Just asking??
Research Needed?? Sounds good to me.
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You taking about the last one or the whole thing?
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If the thread gets broken up it will just be confusing. If people want it in research needed I guess that's OK, but personally I'm not sure that is necessary. As long as the information that raises some questions is available to people and they can find it OK . People will probably find it OK here too.
Maybe we need a section for abandoned sock puppets .
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I haven't heard anything from Tsisqua or any supporters asking me to verify who she is which seems odd if she was who she said she was.....it appears that she has flown the coop......
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Maybe Wolf, One of her friends that posted said she was away. But gave no other information. It's been about 2 weeks. Moma P, That's why I haven't moved it. Not sure where to start. It will be confusing.
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With due respect!,Tsisqua at this time is in europe,nope she's not hiding,run away or has any reason to feel embarressed to my knowledge.You are just going to have to be patient and await her return rather than let the imaginations run riot huh!.
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lol.......sounds to me like there is way too much "self importance" flying around. You have all lost the main concept of fraud fighting and started in-fighting! How.....IMMATURE! Why is it so darned important to know everyone's personal identity? Unless you have a good darn reason, then its no one else's business. I think she did a nice introduction.
I'm on Tsissy's side....... ;D She got attacked right off the bat. And for what? Y'all could always play: i'll show you mine if you show me yours. How asinine! I didn't intrduce myself. Y'all gonna attack me now???????? lol go ahead....I have a bad case of the "don't givem no chits!"
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I thought this was an introducation post should this post be moved to another section??
Just asking??
Research Needed?? Sounds good to me.
I don't think the thread should be broken up. It should stay intact, to let people know what Tsisqua and her organization truly are. Really don't know how much more research needs to be done; I think the facts presented speak for themselves.
I haven't heard anything from Tsisqua or any supporters asking me to verify who she is which seems odd if she was who she said she was.....it appears that she has flown the coop......
This doesn't surprise me. I think she's busy re-inventing herself. Doubt if any of us hear from Tsisqua again.
Maybe Wolf, One of her friends that posted said she was away. But gave no other information. It's been about 2 weeks. Moma P, That's why I haven't moved it. Not sure where to start. It will be confusing.
No one posted that Tsisqua had been "away"; that was from Matty's e-mail to me. Didn't believe it then; don't believe it now.
With due respect!,Tsisqua at this time is in europe,nope she's not hiding,run away or has any reason to feel embarressed to my knowledge.You are just going to have to be patient and await her return rather than let the imaginations run riot huh!.
That dog don't hunt. Didn't run away, isn't hiding, no reason to be embarrassed? Tsisqua's in Europe? Please. Tsisqua lives in Ireland. That country is part of Europe, right? The number of half-truths and out-right lies she's been caught in should embarrass her.
lol.......sounds to me like there is way too much "self importance" flying around. You have all lost the main concept of fraud fighting and started in-fighting! How.....IMMATURE! Why is it so darned important to know everyone's personal identity? Unless you have a good darn reason, then its no one else's business. I think she did a nice introduction.
I'm on Tsissy's side....... ;D She got attacked right off the bat. And for what? Y'all could always play: i'll show you mine if you show me yours. How asinine! I didn't intrduce myself. Y'all gonna attack me now???????? lol go ahead....I have a bad case of the "don't givem no chits!"
Yes, the purpose of this forum is to expose fakes and flakes. Whether someone is a member of NAFPS should not matter. A fraud is a fraud. Infighting? Not really. I call it exposing frauds. It's not about knowing everyone's personal identity. It's about claiming to be something you aren't. It's about claiming a culture and spirituality that does not belong to you. It's about being honest.
You think Tsisqua did a "nice introduction"? On the surface it may seem that way; but it's fake. It's full of lies, always "with respect", but lies none the less. I don't like to be lied to, no matter how much respect is served with it. And that "self importance" you wrote about . . . Tsisqua is the master of that.
Claiming to have lost a relative who died protecting a sacred burial site crossed the line. Knowing how we all feel about family, our ancestors, sacred sites and using that to up your "Indianness" is wrong.
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FWIW, I think the NAU MySpace page is gone now.
I noticed something odd when I was looking for it. In her sig, she always put the ® ( (R) Registered Trademark) sign in her sig, like this: NAU ®
I'd be surprised to hear that NAU is actually a registered trademark. And if so, why?
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I think MySpace has been absent for a while. Registered Trademark, interesting. These can be checked.
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I was contacted by a member of NAU via e mail this morning,I stand corrected Tsisqua returned to the States recently and she is currently dealing with family matters.However if there is no question she can access this forum still,then i am sure if she feels you have raised valid questions and not those raised by personal angst and motivation,she will answer them for herself.
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Reply #73
Wolfsraven
I'm on Tsissy's side....... She got attacked right off the bat. And for what? Y'all could always play: i'll show you mine if you show me yours. How asinine! I didn't intrduce myself. Y'all gonna attack me now?
zoi lightfoot
Reply #77
i am sure if she feels you have raised valid questions and not those raised by personal angst and motivation,
Enough .
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1874.0
Please refer to the suggestion in reply #13
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You guys just don't get it. Why is it so frigging important to know who is whom? Carded, uncarded......we need to STOP trashing each other and get to work! All this infighting is STOOPID! And it looks stupid in print too! If we spent as much time WORKING as we do trashing each other, we might just accomplish something.
I do NOT believe Tsissy is a fraud. And shame on you all for attacking not only a woman, a PREGNANT woman, but one with a bad heart! Shameful! Talk about disrespect! [Childish insult removed]
[Al's note: If you want to flame someone, it won't be allowed. Take it to private IMs.]
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You know....If I'm not mistaken in an email conversation I had with Tsissy, when I first got acquainted with her here, I could have sworn she told me her and her husband lived here around the Plains area of Montana, or they have family, or her husband was from here. It's been over a year and I don't keep emails, but yup I am pretty sure that is what she told me.
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You know....If I'm not mistaken in an email conversation I had with Tsissy, when I first got acquainted with her here, I could have sworn she told me her and her husband lived here around the Plains area of Montana, or they have family, or her husband was from here. It's been over a year and I don't keep emails, but yup I am pretty sure that is what she told me.
Where hasn't Tsisqua lived? lol
It seems her entire internet life is fiction or belongs to someone else. Who is this woman? None of us know her true identity. One thing is for sure, she isn't who she claims to be.
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:( I hate to admit it but I did in the beginning, and I defended her, for which I owe Mama Porcupine an Apology and hope that she accepts. But Sky I commend you for bringing the Info that you did because well.......it opened my eyes up to a lot! So Thank You and Mama, I do apologize for getting really nasty at one time about the whole situation and I do hope you will accept my apology.
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Hi Mooniesixkiller
I don't blame you for feeling irritated with me. I can be intolerant of people who aren't telling the truth and I can be annoyingly persistent if I think someone might be hurt by that. But i know how hard it can be to figure out who is the instigator in an on line disagreement. Sometimes I read over at Indianz.com just trying to figure out who it is who really has the problem. Often it just seems like everybody does...
We all make mistakes and have blind spots and next time may be my turn. I hope you won't hold that against me , and of course i won't hold it against you !
The internet seems to be quite a jungle ... But hopefully a good place to learn some skills to avoid having some bad experiences in real life.
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I for one would love to find out who she is. So many lies and so much hurt she has spread. I for one was hurt not in a economic way but emotionally. She is very cruel and vile in her way of hurting people too. Then she gets people into a Mob Attack Mentality to attack others.
Why she does this is the million dollar question. Anyone who was not hurt by her, consider yourself lucky. LOL.
What is sad to me is, her energy is focused not on helping causes but creating anger and hate. She also appears to want to be the center of attention and the praised one. Now supposedly she has a heart condition which is slowly killing her unless she gets a heart transplant? Does anyone here know what is involved with that? And now I hear she is pregnant? I don’t know but I find it a little hard to believe any of that. To add to that, she spends her time on the internet getting her ever so weak heart all worked up, it is a death wish waiting to happen...don’t you think?
I just cannot understand her agenda and if she willing to expose other peoples privacy then she better expose hers. My name was not of a public record and there is only one way she could get it and it was to buy it. I can see if I had other sites and public things with my name on it, but I did not. I also did not give her permission to check my credit. Or was she hoping to steal my identity? Too bad my credit sucks. LOL. I froze my credit records regardless.
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gogv
My name was not of a public record and there is only one way she could get it and it was to buy it. I can see if I had other sites and public things with my name on it, but I did not.
gogv ... sorry but that isn't true and was already discussed here once
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1598.0
See reply #1
When I saw you removed this information I edited my post and removed your name which was in my report about how easy your real name was to find with a simple google search on your user name. Maybe you forgot about this... ?
Tsisqua did enough stuff that is wrong without any of us blurring the issues by accusing her of stuff she didn't do.
As i just said I am intolerant of people not telling the truth and yeah I know this can be annoying. No offence is meant but i have to tell the truth and I can only support people who do the same.
I agree with your other points and yes Tsisqua was good at creating unnecessary conflict, and bad feelings.
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Kathryn. There are too many names on other sites. I don't think anyone will ever know. You have Tanena Davis, Teresa Courtney, and Tsisqua Dawisgala. http://pub31.bravenet.com/forum/2622176167/show/766816
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Okay I don't see where I posted my Sonja name anywhere and that is what I am talking about. She also posted my IP and I know that too was not public information. When people have social sites those people are expected to hold some respect for people's privacy. In Freewebs they have a program that tracks IP's and that is where Tsisqua got mine. But it is not her right to post it here, there, or everywhere like she did.
Now I do admit I made a mistake with RNS and I did apologize here openly for anything mean I may have said. Now I also know none of my Nicnames show me as Sonja. Now IP's fine it does not take you directly to my house but hey, anyone wants to come and visit I will now map quest it for you. That is what I am talking about. I don't feel I wrongfully accused her of anything because she did do that. She also had a few variations of my name and not all of them was mine. The only way she could of gotten that was in a credit check. I got one myself and I saw some things there that was not even mine so I had that cleared up.
I just googled knightcrowwatching and these are what came up
http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=knightcrowwatching&form=QBRE&custom=1&checkcustom=1&qs=n
and for Ravencrow this came up
http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=ravencrow&form=QBRE&custom=1&checkcustom=1&qs=n
Still nothing with my IP or Sonja name.
But that is okay. I am not all twisted up on that nor does it rule my life. I also don't make a habit of blaming people for something they did not do. I know she did what she did to me and that is not a lie.
gogv
My name was not of a public record and there is only one way she could get it and it was to buy it. I can see if I had other sites and public things with my name on it, but I did not.
gogv ... sorry but that isn't true and was already discussed here once
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1598.0
See reply #1
When I saw you removed this information I edited my post and removed your name which was in my report about how easy your real name was to find with a simple google search on your user name. Maybe you forgot about this... ?
Tsisqua did enough stuff that is wrong without any of us blurring the issues by accusing her of stuff she didn't do.
As i just said I am intolerant of people not telling the truth and yeah I know this can be annoying. No offence is meant but i have to tell the truth and I can only support people who do the same.
I agree with your other points and yes Tsisqua was good at creating unnecessary conflict, and bad feelings.
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gogv
If I reply to this I think this will take this thread off topic so I'm going to reply in the thread where this came up before.
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1598.0
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I do see in my introduction there that the post where she posted my name and IP are gone. Interesting. I see her words but she really gives me a headache and I don't want to read anymore of Tsisqua's lies. I will have to comb my files to find that but then again it is no longer here so I will not be able to post links to prove it.
I am not all twisted up about that alone with Tsisqua. I honestly am over that and I really will map quest for anyone who wants to visit. I like company and I am a great hostess.
Since the link is gone we will drop it, but I will stand behind that claim I made even if it is not agreed on.
I am not here to cause fights or argue. I have too much in my life for that. I come here for all the same reasons most of you do. I will not post anything unless I have a load of proof besides my own experiences.
Please bare with me while I learn this style of stating facts. I learn quick so it should not take me that long.
gogv
If I reply to this I think this will take this thread off topic so I'm going to reply in the thread where this came up before.
http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=1598.0
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Kathryn. There are too many names on other sites. I don't think anyone will ever know. You have Tanena Davis, Teresa Courtney, and Tsisqua Dawisgala. http://pub31.bravenet.com/forum/2622176167/show/766816
Wanted to comment on this; been thinking about it and decided something needed to be said.
First, Tsisqua Dawisgala is a screen name/stage name Tsisqua uses/used when she really needed a last name. You know, those times when just plain Tsisqua didn't have the power of Madonna or Cher.
Second, you know as well as I do that Teresa Courtney, although going by the name Tsisqua, is not the Tsisqua that posted here on NAFPS or runs the NAU website. Courtney lives in Ohio; the Tsisqua in question lives in Ireland.
Finally, we come to the third name, Tanena Davis. Although at one time I was sure Tsisqua couldn't be Tanena, now I'm not so sure. I honestly don't know.
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RE: Mark Yazzie???
From: Bryan Shade, Webmaster (webmaster@keetoowahcherokee.org)
Sent: Mon 12/29/08 6:32 PM
To: Bonnie Singleton (bls926@msn.com)
Bonnie,
After several months of researching, we have no record of any of our membership residing in Dublin, Ireland. This is not intended in any way to deny that this individual is a member of the UKB but it is unlikely. Only with a name would we be able to verify the status of this individual. While our membership consists of nearly 13,000 enrolled members, none have an address in Ireland.
Unfortunately, an increasing number of non-Keetoowah individuals choose to imitate our full-blood faction. For years, people have imitated the Cherokee People, though only recently have we, the United Keetoowah Band of Cherokees, been aware of the number of people who claim to be from United Keetoowah Band of Cherokees.
While we realize that our deeply traditional roots have became a draw of sorts for those who wish to affiliate with Native American-ism, this type of activity truly is a threat to the existence of the bona fide Native American Tribes and our relationship with other Tribes and Nations as well as the Federal Government.
They say that imitation is the best form of flattery so it makes perfect sense that these people begin to imitate the most religious and traditional portion of the Cherokee Blood Line – The Keetoowah Cherokees.
We appreciate your inquiry and thank you for coming to the source.
Wado,
Bryan Shade,
Webmaster/Director of Federal Programs & Compliance,
United Keetoowah Band of Cherokee Indians
-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Mark Yazzie
From: Bonnie Singleton <bls926@msn.com>
Date: Tue, July 01, 2008 1:59 am
To: <enrollment@keetoowahcherokee.org>
I have a question I hope someone in the United Keetoowah Band can answer. I recently came across someone online claiming to be enrolled UKB. I don't know her real name; she goes by Tsisqua, refusing to give any personal information. I know that she lives in Dublin, Ireland. She never gave out that info, but I was able to find out by other means. She has stated that her cousin, Mark "Coyote" Yazzie, was beaten to death defending a burial site in December 2007. While she claims full-blood Keetoowah, Yazzie was San Carlos Apache/Cherokee. I'm having a hard time believing this story; haven't been able to find anything about this incident. I hope someone has heard something about it. If it really happened, someone lost a son, brother, nephew, cousin, a relative. This is not the type of news that would be kept quiet. I realize Yazzie is neither a Cherokee name nor Apache, but is Dine. In fact there's a Dine artist named Mark Yazzie. I don't want to accuse this person of making up a story to garner sympathy and support, but that's what I feel in my gut. There are other inconsistencies in who she says she is. Would really like to get to the bottom of this. Any help you can give me would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you,
Bonnie Singleton
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In light of the fact that NAU and Tsisqua have resurfaced, and as it pertains to two other active threads, Zoi Lightfoot/Treaty House and Ben Carnes/Eagle Mountain, I think this thread should be revisited. Bumping for those who may have forgotten the game Tsisqua was playing.
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When this person first posted I really wondered where she got the picture of the NAC lodge. It looks exactly like the Medicine Bull lodge and was, last time I saw it, not widely published. Not that it matters to the discussion, but it bothered me a bit to see it, if it is the same lodge, used as a logo by some one who seems to not be honest.