Author Topic: Warfield Moose, Jr.  (Read 67023 times)

Offline A Truth Seeker

  • Posts: 6
Warfield Moose, Jr.
« Reply #15 on: July 03, 2013, 07:45:42 pm »

Hello All,

I am writing today as a follow up to a post from two years ago about this same topic. It does not look as if the matter was resolved. Was looking to see if more information could be provided on Warfield Moose, Jr., and if some kind of determination could be made. The previous post can be found here:

http://www.newagefraud.org/smf/index.php?topic=3304.0

My situation is similar to the person who made the initial post (Jonathan): My friend has attended a Yuwipi ceremony conducted by Warfield Moose, Jr., and has since become much closer to him and his group, attending many ceremonies. I also attended the first ceremony my friend attended, but came away with a different impression. I was skeptical and felt that there was some misrepresentation going on.

There was a charge/donation requested of $100 for the ceremony. I was later told this money was going to a non-profit that helps provide housing at the Pine Ridge Reservation. I don't have any way of verifying this information.

For my friend’s sake, I would like to know if the people who conducted the ceremony are considered genuine or frauds among the Lakota people of the Pine Ridge community. At the same time, I don’t want to contribute to damaging anyone reputation if this person or (related) people are innocent. So I would appreciate feedback only from people who know Warfield Moose, Jr., or have had direct contact with him via the ceremonies or otherwise.

I just want to be able to warn my friend if it is deemed a prudent measure.

Thank you.

 

Offline Tal

  • Posts: 2
Re: Warfield Moose, Jr.
« Reply #16 on: July 04, 2013, 10:32:28 am »
I believe my own recent personal experience might help.  I would also like very much to warn people about Warfield Moose and these 'Healing Ceremonies.'  I certainly wish I had had more information before I paid out £160 and attended what seemed to me to be nothing more than a very amateur magic show. 
He is a terrible ambassador for Native American people; spirituality; traditions and so on.
When a friend told me that Warfield Moose was going to hold ceremonies in the U.K. during May 2013 and that she was able to book places through the friend who was organising it all, I thought it all sounded amazing.  I was made to understand that invitations to these ceremonies are exclusive and are only given out through word of mouth via friends.  Nothing can be put in writing because the ceremonies are too 'sacred' for that.  It was also made clear that NO REFUNDS WOULD BE GIVEN UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES!  That should have sounded a warning bell.  But, no, when you believe you are dealing with trusted friends, you don't want to appear too suspicious or awkward. 
The cost of £160 was for the event which we were told would run from 3 p.m. until midnight.  It was also to include a huge 'ceremonial feast' and, of course, Warfield's travel expenses from the U.S.A. would need to be covered.  To give you an idea of how expensive this was - a shop assistant in the U.K. typically earns £6.50 per hour before tax. 
However, the organiser seemed to have a good reputation as a spirit medium and we were told she had attended four of these ceremonies in the U.S.  She said they saw spirit people materialise before their eyes. 
We paid for our places around January 2013.  Two weeks before the event, we received an long email detailing various preparations we must make or we would not be allowed into the ceremony. This involved more cost. We were also told that the 'ceremonial feast' would be organised by those of us attending and we must cook and bring food for up to six people.  When you have already paid £160 each and know there will be no refund, you really have no choice but to comply.
We arrived at the small village hall promptly at 3 p.m. but were told to wait in the car park while the room was prepared.  Over two hours later we were called into the hall for a talk from the organiser.  There was no apology or explanation.  She wanted to explain what would happen during the ceremony.  We would have to sit on a blanket on the floor.  WE WOULD NOT BE ALLOWED TO BRING A DRINK OF WATER INTO THE ROOM. In fact, NOTHING would be allowed in the room - only the clothes we were wearing!  No one would be allowed to leave.  Doors would be locked.
I observed at this point that the fire exit was taped up.  There were two or three very thick sheets of black polythene taped over every window and door. All the light fitments on the ceiling had been removed.  I have attended many spiritual events in the U.K. over the years but have never witnessed anything like this before. It worried me.
It was another two hours before Warfield arrived.  Still there was no apology or explanation.  We begged the organiser to allow us to eat as we were all very hungry now.  Warfield said 'No' - we were not allowed to eat until after his ceremony!  Food had been standing in the kitchen for four hours now - some was even baking in the oven!
Warfield talked to us.  I was so hungry, thirsty and tired by now that I couldn't really concentrate on what he was saying.  But I DO remember he said we must respect the Earth's resources - and not waste anything.  WE MUST NOT EAT TO EXCESS!  I remember this bit because the man himself is very, very large and I guess he needed three airplane seats on the flight from the U.S.A. 
We were given herbs and asked to apply them to areas of our bodies where we had aches and pains.  Warfield and his men observed us carefully while we did this!  Later, in the dark, many of us would be 'touched by spirit' in these places. 
When the lights went off, it was totally black and I actually found it quite frightening! 
There were around thirty of us and we were all asked to take it in turns to pray out loud.  As you can imagine, there were many prayers for World peace, healing for the Earth and so on.
Then the noise began.  Rattles and whistles.  It was so noisy you could have led a team of boy scouts through the hall and we probably would not have noticed!
Someone fell over my ankle in the dark. (Thermal vision goggles failed him?) It hurt.  The 'lightening' looked just like 'Flash Paper' used by magicians - and you could make out a person's body when he turned in various directions.  Surely you should be able to see through a spirit person?
The same with the glowing rattles.  Every time they went across the other side of the room you realised a body was now between you and them - and you couldn't see them.
Luminous balls circled our heads.  I have seen identical things at shows where Chinese jugglers do amazing things!
At the end we were all whacked around each side of our head with something quite hard. That hurt too!  One lady cried out in pain as they had accidentally hit her in her eye.  Warfield said she had a particularly nasty Demon there which refused to leave and they had to hit it extra hard!!
In my opinion I saw nothing of genuine spiritual activity.
Warfield himself had a bottle of water with him! (Having made sure we would go thirsty and hungry!)   His voice came from various directions in the dark, so we knew he was no longer tied up.  Afterwards, I noticed our precious prayer ties were dumped unceremoniously in a sad heap where no doubt they had been thrown by human hands in the darkness.
We were on the floor in the blackness for FIVE HOURS!  It was now 2 a.m.! Never mind 'healing' - we now had even more aches and pains!
Warfield announced that we were now allowed to eat. Much of the food was now just charcoal in burnt out pans!!
Amazingly, I have to report that some people (mainly the younger ones!)  had actually enjoyed the event!
A small group of us (perhaps because we looked thoroughly miserable!) were warned by Warfield not to say anything about what we had seen to anyone FOR FOUR DAYS - OR NONE OF OUR PRAYERS WOULD BE ANSWERED!  (I assume he was on the plane back to the States in four day's time!!)
I hope this helps people really investigate what Warfield Moose and his men are REALLY doing. If I were ever invited again, I would be tempted to take a large torch and some newspaper reporters!

Offline Defend the Sacred

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 3290
Re: Warfield Moose, Jr.
« Reply #17 on: July 04, 2013, 04:44:50 pm »
Merging threads. Just ignore the red notice that says to start a new thread when a topic is old. It's something in the software; we prefer to keep the threads in one place when possible.

Offline Otter3

  • Posts: 21
Re: Warfield Moose, Jr.
« Reply #18 on: July 04, 2013, 06:45:10 pm »
ou
A small group of us (perhaps because we looked thoroughly miserable!) were warned by Warfield not to say anything about what we had seen to anyone FOR FOUR DAYS - OR NONE OF OUR PRAYERS WOULD BE ANSWERED!  (I assume he was on the plane back to the States in four day's time!!)
I hope this helps people really investigate what Warfield Moose and his men are REALLY doing. If I were ever invited again, I would be tempted to take a large torch and some newspaper reporters!

Tal, I am sorry you had this terrible, dangerous experience.  Thank you for reporting so clearly what happened so others will learn from this.   It's all about monetary profit and secrecy.   When I was part of Philip Scott's Ancestral Voice cult, he told people who went on a Hanbleceya (a Lakota ceremony misused by new age frauds/plastic shamans to fleece adults who think they'll see spirits and learn their life's meaning, etc.) that they couldn't talk about it for a whole year, so the "medicine" would work.  Four days without food, sleep, or water in the wilderness, while below, Scott and the "supporters" feasted on barbecued salmon steaks, gourmet meals, pancakes, fresh fruit, candy, and so on.  Boxes and boxes of goodies.  A portable kitchen and tents.   Supposedly they were eating for the people "on the hill."   

Offline earthw7

  • Posts: 1415
    • Standing Rock Tourism
Re: Warfield Moose, Jr.
« Reply #19 on: July 05, 2013, 03:39:32 pm »
Warfield Moose Jr. sounds like another Native who has taken advantage of people.
As I post this I want to let you know in way do I support or condone this behavior.

On the other hand
Tal what you describe is basically what happens in a ceremony,
Everything is blacken out no light is to be shown, or there would be no ceremony,
no one eats or drinks anything, NO FOOD IS ALLOWED IN THE CEREMONY
the leader will bring water for the spirits
we sit for hours waiting, which a person is supposed to be praying,
Everyone who has come for prayers must say them out loud, never heard of people praying for
world peace at a ceremony the prayers are supposed to be about self,
We know that we can wait for ceremony for a long time so we make sure our food is something that
cooks slow,
I have been to ceremonies where we were in for 8 hours or more depends on the prayers,
This is why I believe NO non natives People should be in ceremony they are always looking for
that quick fix for their problems. Plus no one pays to pray. That should of been your first
clue NO ONE PAYS TO PRAY,


In Spirit

Offline A Truth Seeker

  • Posts: 6
Re: Warfield Moose, Jr.
« Reply #20 on: July 06, 2013, 06:11:53 pm »
Tal, thank you for sharing your experience. And EarthW7, thank you for adding your feedback and clarifications.

I have been wondering if any of the money Warfield raises actually makes it back to the Pine Ridge reservation for housing as he proposes it does. Or is that just a lie? I also wonder why he no longer lives in Pine Ridge anymore.

I worry that this man is not who or what he says he is. I worry that he is doing damage to many communities of people.

My friend means the world to me. As you can imagine, the last thing I want for my friend is to get tangled up in someone and something that is a fraud.
« Last Edit: July 06, 2013, 06:14:47 pm by A Truth Seeker »

Offline Defend the Sacred

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 3290
Re: Warfield Moose, Jr.
« Reply #21 on: July 06, 2013, 06:28:08 pm »
TruthSeeker, Earthw7 is from the communities Mr. Moose claims to be from, and part of the culture he is exploiting and selling. As are many others who post here and have discussed identical situations in the past.

I think the situation is clear. Whether or not Moose was traditionally trained doesn't really matter at this point. The standards of the community he claims to be from say: it's wrong and harmful to sell ceremony; it's wrong to fake spirit contacts; it's wrong to commodify the sacred.

After listening to Lakota people on this subject, I think it's very clear your friend should not be involved in this. It's harmful to the cultures in question; it's not right to sell ceremony, and it's not right to do these ceremonies for people who aren't part of the culture, so don't even have the background to understand what parts are and are not harmful. I'd tell your friend to get out of there.
 

Offline earthw7

  • Posts: 1415
    • Standing Rock Tourism
Re: Warfield Moose, Jr.
« Reply #22 on: July 06, 2013, 06:35:21 pm »
I am ashamed to say that we have people who are from the tribal nations who
go to make money off people who dont know about our ways, They can tell you anything and you
woud believe it even if they themselves know better.
I will say it again anyone who "pays to pray is wrong"!

In Spirit

Offline Defend the Sacred

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 3290
Re: Warfield Moose, Jr.
« Reply #23 on: July 06, 2013, 06:54:51 pm »
I think there are a lot of non-Natives who want to find loopholes. They hear that it's wrong to sell out, but they still want access, so they think they, and the exploiter they've found, will be the exception. Then they only get mad when what they get isn't what they think they paid for.

So for the people who think they NEED access to NDNs and NDN ceremonies... what I can say is people who sell out lose their power. Someone who is faking spirit contact for a paid audience... it's possible that at one time they really had the power. But then by violating the community standards they angered the spirits, and now there are no spirits willing to help them. So they fake it. People can get really hurt that way. Some of the most harmful people we've dealt with did have knowledge and power at one time, but greed corrupted them. Real ceremonial ways can have dangers if they are done wrong, and if the spirits are offended. Most white people don't understand this. They think either someone has training or not, and they don't see the whole picture. Cultural context is everything. The ceremonies don't work without it. But non-Natives who are trying to find loopholes, and also operating from a place of selfishness and greed, are also part of the problem.  If they continue to support frauds after they know better, any harm that comes on them is hard to blame on anyone else. The main exploiter and ceremony-seller is certainly at serious fault, but the consumer of pay to pray is also to blame if they choose to knowingly participate in misappropriation.

Offline Tal

  • Posts: 2
Re: Warfield Moose, Jr.
« Reply #24 on: July 06, 2013, 08:10:45 pm »
I just want to thank you all for your kind comments.  I am an outsider, not Native American and live in the U.K. so I appreciate your understanding and kindness. 
I see that Warfield Moose has now updated his Website to say that he has taught in countries around the World including Italy and the U.K.
I won't write much more because it's not applicable to the original content of A Truth Seeker's question really.  Perhaps people who are closer to Warfield Moose can now begin to suspect foul play and investigate what he is really doing. 
I was especially concerned that he has the perfect excuse for recruiting people - ie. nothing can be put in writing - until everyone has paid in full, that is!  Many British people are fascinated by different cultures, especially Native American traditions.  I hear through my friend that Warfield is hoping to hold many more ceremonies in the U.K. in the future, including 'Sweat Lodges.' 
However, each person must ultimately take responsibility for their own life and actions, so I can only hope that future recruits check out your Website carefully before attending!
Thank you for your work in doing this.  There is more information about Warfield Moose now than in January 2013 when I first looked!  (The quip from AnnOminous about night vision goggles would have alerted me to the fact that the room was going to be darker than we are used to at spiritual events over here!)  NAFPS seem to be the only people brave enough to speak up.  Thank you.

Offline A Truth Seeker

  • Posts: 6
Re: Warfield Moose, Jr.
« Reply #25 on: July 07, 2013, 01:19:21 pm »
I also would like to thank the people who operate and contribute to this website. This is a valuable resource of information. Admittedly I did very little research before signing up for the ceremony I attended, and like Tal, I obviously now wish I had. But I am thankful I found this site and have a clearer understanding of your traditions and what constitutes fraud in your culture.

One observation: I think that Non-Natives are curious and interested about your culture. And in many instances that curiousity does come from an innocent and pure place. We know so little about you. There is so little written about your people in our history books in our schools. Also I think many of us realize that our ceremonies have in ways become hollow. We feel that we have lost our connections to nature. Then there is the guilt: Many of us are ashamed as to how our ancestors treated yours. And how much of that abuse and neglect continues today. There are all sorts of ways that Native culture is exploited by people who have little or no understanding of it. And then there are people, both Native and non-Native who recognize that curiosity and underlying guilt and play upon it and manipulate those thoughts and feelings for their own benefit. Those kind of people exist in all cultures.

All that said, I want to thank you for extending your patience and insight. I realize now how short-sighted I was and now how dangerous these ceremonies can be when conducted for the wrong reasons and in the wrong manner. These ceremonies are sacred to your traditions and should be considered with a greater sense of respect. I hope for a better understanding and respect between our cultures and encourage you to keep getting this information out there. It helps us all.

Offline Ironshield34

  • Posts: 4
Re: Warfield Moose, Jr.
« Reply #26 on: July 08, 2013, 11:27:20 pm »
Hello I'm from wounded knee and know that Warfield is a real yuwipi man. We have gone to sing for him a couple times it is sad that he does sellout but don't discredit him as a fraud he has a connection!!! He is a sellout though!!!

Offline AnnOminous

  • Posts: 99
Re: Warfield Moose, Jr.
« Reply #27 on: July 09, 2013, 04:31:18 pm »
Ironshield, please define a "real yuwipi man."  Please don't take this as an offensive question, but what qualifications does one need to have to make such a statement?

I've been to Warfield's yuwipi ceremonies on both Kainai in Canada and Pine Ridge reserves.  There was absolutely nothing he did, or that occurred during ceremony, that could not have been done with a few special effects and trickery.

If he had truly brought in the spirits, would those spirits trip over your feet as they walk by?  Do spirits cough and clear their throats?  Do they smack you upside the head and get their hands caught in your hair when they are "healing" you?

If one needs only an opinion and direct experience to decide whether or not someone is real or not, then I guess I qualify.  I say fake.  FAKE.

Offline Cetan

  • Posts: 238
  • Hoka Hey
Re: Warfield Moose, Jr.
« Reply #28 on: July 09, 2013, 07:56:30 pm »
The way one knows if someone is a real yuwipi man is by the results and what the members of the community say. Unfortunately when confronted with things they cannot understand or do not fit into their world view a lot if people, especially non NDN tend to say it is trickery or special effects. Some of the spirits that come in will hit people in the head or hit them with the gourds. There are flashing lights and sounds that the spirits make. This is why a lot of people do not want to allow non natives attend any ceremony, they experience things they cannot understand then say it is trickery.

Offline AnnOminous

  • Posts: 99
Re: Warfield Moose, Jr.
« Reply #29 on: July 09, 2013, 08:22:24 pm »
Cetan, I agree.  Which is why (a) he is no longer invited back to our communities; and (b) I stand by my previous posts.

If you have your own first-hand experiences with Warfield Moose, Shilo Clifford and their ceremonies, please share them.
« Last Edit: July 09, 2013, 08:50:03 pm by AnnOminous »