Author Topic: The ManKind Project - Misogynist Pretendian Cult - England  (Read 39627 times)

Offline ojibwenation01

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Re: The ManKind Project - Misogynist Pretendian Cult - England
« Reply #15 on: October 19, 2015, 02:01:00 pm »
I've been active in MKP for several years. I know many many many Natives active in MKP. Pine Ridge reservation holds a MKP gateway training for men and women. It is powerful, sacred, challenging, and beautiful work that individuals do in MKP. The next training in Pine Ridge is this coming weekend. You guys can sign up and attend if you want. Come see for yourself!!


Offline educatedindian

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Re: The ManKind Project - Misogynist Pretendian Cult - England
« Reply #16 on: October 19, 2015, 03:36:18 pm »
No trolling for or promoting Nuage ceremony selling allowed in here. That Nuage exploitation is making inroads on a rez is always disturbing.

Mr. Clinton Isham, perhaps you should introduce yourself. He wrote some emails to me asking the thread on a late abuser be removed.

Could you describe how you became involved? How much is the ceremony sold for? Is what's in the articles similar to what you went through? The naked blindfolded walking around? Nude guys in a circle handing around a dildo, shaving each other, etc? Faux psychotherapy and so on. Why would anyone Native get involved in such obvious crackpot nonsense?

Offline WINative

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Re: The ManKind Project - Misogynist Pretendian Cult - England
« Reply #17 on: October 19, 2015, 05:26:58 pm »
Clinton Isham,

All Indigenous people had their own Rites of Passage ceremonies, why do we need to "create" one?

I know for a fact Lakota and Dakota people have their own well intact, as well as most WI tribes.

So the ManKind Project are supposed to show us how to be better Natives?

Offline WINative

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Re: The ManKind Project - Misogynist Pretendian Cult - England
« Reply #18 on: October 27, 2015, 03:40:08 pm »
I'm wondering about this Dallas Chief Eagle person also since he seems to be the main Native spokesperson for this group, anyone know anything about his history?

http://mankindprojectjournal.org/2013/11/dallas-chief-eagle/

https://www.facebook.com/dallas.chiefeagle

Offline educatedindian

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Re: The ManKind Project - Misogynist Pretendian Cult - England
« Reply #19 on: October 29, 2015, 01:50:54 pm »
DCE is primarily a Lakota hoop dancer and art teacher.
http://www.artscouncil.sd.gov/aisc/trad2.aspx

I wouldn't call him a spokesman at all. He seems to have blessed the group once and said a few kind words about them, mostly because they offered some free sessions to Lakota men.
http://www.indianz.com/News/2013/009552.asp

Offline ojibwenation01

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Re: The ManKind Project - Misogynist Pretendian Cult - England
« Reply #20 on: October 30, 2015, 04:07:32 pm »
The training isn't a Rites of Passage, it's an educational workshop. The training last weekend was completely free. I am not sure why there such negativity towards the effort when none of you experienced first hand what the training is about. I attached the flyer on here so that you can attend, for free, and develop a valid opinion based on first hand experience. Your dogmatic responses aren't helping anyone especially when there is momentum with something that actually helps our people. What are you keyboard warriors doing to help? Following state and federal grant guidelines for programs that are supposed to help our people, feeding them AODA/AA/NA nonsense, lecturing them in a school system thats foundation and roots are grounded in Western knowledge and perspectives. All you are doing is further assimilating our people while they die in front of you. Natives are killing themselves everyday either directly or indirectly and your fundamentally white methods do not work. MKP and this Lakota Warrior Oyate project works. We are on the frontlines working with Native men and healing from the repercussions of colonization. Our elders in the community and the ancestors watch as this powerful work takes place. Keyboard warriors stay home and find the tiniest things wrong with everything. That is the colonized mind set. That is not the way of our people. Say what you will keyboard warriors but know that this work will keep going on, and I will forever remain on the frontlines. I will never sit with you behind a computer screen internalizing the oppression, clueless, blank, lost, scared, dull, and everything else you represent.. My name is Clinton Isham. The grandson of great Anishinabe Chiefs. Medicine and political chiefs. Warriors. My bloodline stretches from Canada to Mexico. This is my land, and I shall forever remain on its frontlines. Aho.

Epiphany

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Re: The ManKind Project - Misogynist Pretendian Cult - England
« Reply #21 on: October 30, 2015, 07:33:15 pm »
Mr. Isham, your attempts to insult us and act as a troll does nothing for your cause.

Resources:

http://forum.culteducation.com/read.php?4,12552,page=1  - 114 pages of discussion concerning this large group awareness training (lgat)

http://culteducation.com/group/1040-mankind-project.html - Articles on this group

http://culteducation.com/warningsigns.html  - Warning signs of unsafe groups and leaders, including:



Quote

Ten warning signs regarding people involved in/with a potentially unsafe group/leader.

Extreme obsessiveness regarding the group/leader resulting in the exclusion of almost every practical consideration.

Individual identity, the group, the leader and/or God as distinct and separate categories of existence become increasingly blurred. Instead, in the follower's mind these identities become substantially and increasingly fused--as that person's involvement with the group/leader continues and deepens.

Whenever the group/leader is criticized or questioned it is characterized as "persecution".

Uncharacteristically stilted and seemingly programmed conversation and mannerisms, cloning of the group/leader in personal behavior.

Dependency upon the group/leader for problem solving, solutions, and definitions without meaningful reflective thought. A seeming inability to think independently or analyze situations without group/leader involvement.

Hyperactivity centered on the group/leader agenda, which seems to supercede any personal goals or individual interests.

A dramatic loss of spontaneity and sense of humor.

Increasing isolation from family and old friends unless they demonstrate an interest in the group/leader.

Anything the group/leader does can be justified no matter how harsh or harmful.

Former followers are at best-considered negative or worse evil and under bad influences. They can not be trusted and personal contact is avoided.

Offline Smart Mule

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Re: The ManKind Project - Misogynist Pretendian Cult - England
« Reply #22 on: October 30, 2015, 10:58:03 pm »
Hi Clinton,

You're tossing around a lot of really ridiculous accusations. First of all, you're young enough to be the kid of most of us. My youngest son is a few months older than you. I am raising his children.

I think it may do you some good to sit back and read your words. You're being a bit snotty and your age is showing in both your passion and your judgement.

No one here participated and encourages assimilation to the best of my knowledge. There are quite a few veteran activists who post here and your tirade is insulting. This Mankind Project doesn't seem to be teaching you Traditional values. Waaswaaganing has many amazing Elders, elders and olders. Why do you need to bring in MKP? How is that respecting your ancestors, elders and community members? If you can explain it to us clearly and concisely you have a better chance of helping us understand why MKP is a good thing instead of over reacting and being insulting.

I would like to understand how an organization founded by three guys who are not from Wasswaaganing, who consulted with a guy (Charles Chips) who is not from Wasswaaganing and currently employs another guy (Dallas Chief Eagle) who is not from Wasswaaganing can help the young men from Wasswaaganing. Please show me how what this organization is doing is minobimaadiziiwin.

omgsrsly?
The training isn't a Rites of Passage, it's an educational workshop. The training last weekend was completely free. I am not sure why there such negativity towards the effort when none of you experienced first hand what the training is about. I attached the flyer on here so that you can attend, for free, and develop a valid opinion based on first hand experience. Your dogmatic responses aren't helping anyone especially when there is momentum with something that actually helps our people. What are you keyboard warriors doing to help? Following state and federal grant guidelines for programs that are supposed to help our people, feeding them AODA/AA/NA nonsense, lecturing them in a school system thats foundation and roots are grounded in Western knowledge and perspectives. All you are doing is further assimilating our people while they die in front of you. Natives are killing themselves everyday either directly or indirectly and your fundamentally white methods do not work. MKP and this Lakota Warrior Oyate project works. We are on the frontlines working with Native men and healing from the repercussions of colonization. Our elders in the community and the ancestors watch as this powerful work takes place. Keyboard warriors stay home and find the tiniest things wrong with everything. That is the colonized mind set. That is not the way of our people. Say what you will keyboard warriors but know that this work will keep going on, and I will forever remain on the frontlines. I will never sit with you behind a computer screen internalizing the oppression, clueless, blank, lost, scared, dull, and everything else you represent.. My name is Clinton Isham. The grandson of great Anishinabe Chiefs. Medicine and political chiefs. Warriors. My bloodline stretches from Canada to Mexico. This is my land, and I shall forever remain on its frontlines. Aho.

Offline WINative

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Re: The ManKind Project - Misogynist Pretendian Cult - England
« Reply #23 on: October 31, 2015, 05:26:54 pm »
Hi Clinton,

No one attacked you personally but our comments were directed at the ManKind Project, why such hostility from you if your getting such good teachings from these workshops?

I still won't attack you since I know you are a young man, and as an older man it's my job to point out some things to protect the younger generation if possible.

The first mention I heard of the Mankind Project was a registered sex offender from our community had posts on his Facebook page that he was a member of them. So I did a search on them and found out they were founded by some White men from here-Milwaukee.
They went to a few Lakota ceremonies with Chipps family and decided they wanted to do their own. Their own words by the way.

They take bits and pieces of all cultures and combine them to make alot of money off  the participants.
I understand they are not charging the Lakota Oyate who are doing these combined workshops. I wonder why not?
Maybe because they need them to legitimize themselves and their trainings. What better places then Pine Ridge.

If you know teachings anyone who seeks to make money and ManKind is an international profit making company by now, they aren't doing any work with native people out of the kindness of their hearts. If you ask me they just want to appropriate Native ways and ceremonies into their trainings to attract more Non-Indians.

I hope I am wrong but the writing seems to have been on the wall a long time ago. You talk about our communities needing the ManKind Project why? if you want a great Native training to de-colonize your mind try the White Bison's "Mending Broken Hearts." I've done and been trained as a local facilitator. I've seen the positive results come of it. We don't need outside groups tell us how to heal.


Offline educatedindian

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Re: The ManKind Project - Misogynist Pretendian Cult - England
« Reply #24 on: November 01, 2015, 05:51:33 pm »
Mr. Isham, the striking thing to me is the way you avoid answering questions at all and immediately go on the attack on a personal level. You could easily defend MKP by describing it and allaying many fears. Instead we are left with the impression that the news reports are accurate. That it really is overwhelmingly whites playing NDN by doing goofy things like going nude in the woods and shaving each other.

Obviously what they do is not even remotely Native in any way. In fact it is a white stereotyped caricature of either generic NDN or faux Lakota. (And I'm still not sure why an Ojibwe turns to faux Lakota rather than Ojibwe ways.) This is far from criticizing "every little thing." This is exposing the whole of what they do, not minor details. Nuage is spiritual colonialism, and that is what you take part in when do faux ceremonies and defend their actions. What you are doing is about as colonized a mindset as possible.

You went out of your way to attack teachers. I have to conclude this was directed at me as a professor. (You can see who I am and what I do simply by looking up my thread, so I won't waste time on that.)

And then you attack the idea of "keyboard warriors."
You ignore that I'm just one of several thousand members, both Native and non-Native.
You ignore, or maybe you didn't know, that some of our members are in tribal gov'ts, both rez and Canadian reserves.
You ignore, or maybe you didn't know, that some members in here have worked with or are AIM members.
You ignore, or maybe you didn't know, that some members in here have counseled Native prisoners.
You ignore, or maybe you didn't know, that more than a few members have taken part in "real life" non-internet non-digital protests.
That includes members who faced threats from their protests. We've had Nuage fraud supporters stalk us or our family members or friends. I was at a protest against fraud Harley Reagan where his German bodyguard tried to break into the car to get to the Native woman who was protesting.

And for some reason your attack on teachers as colonizers ignores the fact that Dallas Chief Eagle, endorser of MKP, is primarily a teacher at public schools. You yourself are a college student.

If you know your history at all, you know that Natives have been using "mainstream" schools to preserve Native ways since the 1930s. Kill the Indian Save the Man was officially repudiated at that time, and the first bicultural and bilingual education begun. It was far from complete or easily done. But are you seriously claiming the likes of Vine Deloria and Robert Warrior were just colonized puppets?

I'm still waiting to see if you will actually discuss MKP instead of the personal smears.

Offline AClockworkWhite

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Re: The ManKind Project - Misogynist Pretendian Cult - England
« Reply #25 on: November 02, 2015, 06:07:48 pm »
If he's Anishnabe, why does he go with Lakota ways and why did he bid adieu with "AHO"? I smell fakery. And the MKP is BS so rectify ASAP PDQ.
I came here for the popcorn and stayed for the slaying of pretenders.

Offline Defend the Sacred

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Re: The ManKind Project - Misogynist Pretendian Cult - England
« Reply #26 on: November 02, 2015, 07:41:13 pm »
I have questions, too. The data does not line up.

Offline WINative

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Re: The ManKind Project - Misogynist Pretendian Cult - England
« Reply #27 on: November 19, 2015, 03:28:37 am »
It looks like the Mankind Project is enlisting more local Native help, I know you guys checked out Rocky, but I have too and he's my same tribe and no one I know and talked to on the rez has legitimized him. They say he knows some Southwest stuff but his claims are to Oneida medicines?


Offline WINative

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Re: The ManKind Project - Misogynist Pretendian Cult - England
« Reply #28 on: December 12, 2015, 07:48:19 pm »
As a follow-up to my comment on Dennis Rocky King, I talked to six different spiritual leaders and traditional people on the Oneida reservation in Wisconsin and none has sanctioned or agreed with what Rocky does. One even told me "There's a reason he does it in the city and suburbs."