NAFPS Forum
General => Frauds => Topic started by: educatedindian on December 30, 2004, 11:35:19 pm
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Someone asked about him over at American Indian Alliance. This is what I know so far.
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"educated_indio" <educated_indio@y...>
Date: Thu Dec 30, 2004 9:54 am
Subject: Re: FW: Tis Mal Crow
We haven't had any complaints about him over at NAFPS. Mostly he seems to sell his how-to herb books. I took a look at the table of contents online at Amazon and it's mostly herb use for minor
ailments. The way it's marketed is offensive and
stereotypical, "secret Indian lore" and so on.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/reader/1570671052/ref=sib_dp_pt/103-2522938-2445410#reader-link
He does seem to have done some good work with plant conservation and has worked with both Native elders and the feds both EPA and Fish
and Wildlife. Here's that working group he mentions.
http://www.nps.gov/plants/medicinal/pubs/elder4501.htm
These elders include at least one I'm not sure about. "Cherokee of the Appalachians"?
One thing even more suspicious I found was that his claim of who his people are keeps changing. Sometimes he claims to be Cherokee and
Hitchiti, other times "Tennessee Cherokee" or "Western Band Cherokee," other times Lumbee, "United Lumbee" which are not the
legitimate Lumbee in North Carolina. And on his books on tape once he's claiming to teach Muscogee medicine ways.
http://www.treefarmtapes.com/catalog/product.asp?productid=7286
Plus in at least one article he admitted he was not Native.
http://www.kelownacapnews.com/03401a/let1.htm
I'll keep asking around.
--- In American_Indian_Alliance@yahoogroups.com, Cloud Family
<yakama@a...> wrote:
> Does anyone know about this person?
> Margaret Cloud
> ZANN Corp. Teams With Native American Herbal Expert
> FENTON, Mich.--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Dec. 29, 2004--ZANN Corp.(OTCBB:ZANN)
> announced today that Tis Mal Crow, an internationally known herbalist and Native American Root Doctor (Medicine Man) has joined Zann Corp. Tis Mal is enhancing the Blue Kiwi product line and has over 200 "Leaves of
Light Plants as Teachers" products in the development pipeline to be introduced
> over the next 2-3 years.
>
> Director of Product Development-Natural Remedies, ZANN Corp.
>
> Tis Mal Crow is a Native American of Cherokee and Hitchiti descent. Since childhood Tis Mal has worked with tribal elders studying the
identification and medicinal uses of plants and native root doctoring techniques.
The information was passed down through generations of elders for thousands of years. Tis Mal has been called to become an elder on the on the Medicinal Plant Working Group of the Council of Elders, a group of concerned elders working for the protection of endangered plants. This group is an
off-shoot (ad hoc committee) of the U.S. Fish and Wildlife and U. S. Forestry Services. He has also been asked to speak at the United Nations
permanent forum on indigenous affairs. In 2003, Tis Mal was a presenter in the Industrial Leadership for the Preservation of Medicinal and
Aromatic Plants Symposium in Philadelphia.
> Tis Mal authored the first book about native remedies by a native person, ³Native Plants, Native Healing Traditional Muskogee Way² to be
printed and widely distributed. The book describes many of the ancient medicines and techniques mentioned above. He is also the first native person to record plant information in lecture form on CD¹s that have beendistributed in 13 countries outside the United States.
> Tis Mal has been teaching classes and workshops on herbs for morethan 20 years. He works with other indigenous healers and herb groups internationally to promote the medicinal uses of these herbs. For most of his adult life he has also been working for the conservation of
the wild habitat needed to sustain the growth of these important plants.
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Tis Mal Crow appeared on Native American Calling radio show over a year ago. He claimed he was United Lumbee/Cherokee on the show. When the announcer asked him a question about herbs and traditional medicine, he made an idiotic reply about the Lumbee trying to reclaim those traditions. My tribe has traditional healers and herbalists. WE have never lost that tradition, but here is a guy claiming he has connections to my people but he knows nothing about us or our history.
He and all the other "UNITED LUMBEE NATION" fakes are using our name and piggy backing on our history for their own gratification. These people are frauds, using our name for scholarships and grant money, and they should be stopped at all costs. My people struggled through hundreds of years of racism, hatred and death, and I will not stand to allow these fakes to steal my history as their own. I hope all you United Lumbee Nation fakes read this and pass it on!
Lumbee Pride!
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Good to have you here Locklear. We have a thread about the United Lumbee over in Archives. Anything you can add to that, we'd like to hear.
Tis Mal Crow also's made some appearances in Europe. I have an article from when he appeared in Sweden, translated for me by Annika. The guy claimed "Cherokees are one of 34 Muscogee tribes" and some other obvious mistakes.
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I looked for the United Lumbee Nation thread in the archives but could not find it. What is the subject line?
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Sorry, I made two mistakes. Part of the thread is on the "Lumbee of California" not the United Lumbee. And the thread is titled Would Be, Fake and Wannabe Tribes.
http://newagefraud.org/cgi-bin/forum/YaBB.cgi?board=archive1;action=display;num=1099249448
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Al,
would you post the sweedish article or send it to me along with the date and place of publication? I'd like to add this guy to my index.
Part of the Muscogee indeed!
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I just did a very quick translation so could you guys turn it from Swenglish to English before you put it up? LOL
Annika
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I'll try. Might be hard. Bork. :D
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I studied with Tis Mal for 2 years and produced his recordings, many of which have yet to become public, and he lived with my partner and I for a year, and we became very close in that time. I accompanied him to Sweden. I knew him well enough to know he was a bit of a loose cannon, and a bit of a tortured soul (he passed away several years ago). I have no doubt he didn't always tell the truth about things, and he was not always an easy person to be around. He was also a very very gifted healer, had encyclopedic photographic knowledge of many many plants, and was an absolutely phenomenal bead artist. He was also of mixed Native and European ancestry that made his life a hard one, with these spirits warring within him, as many here would know from your own experience. I understand why the work of this sight is important, but there are also aspects of the things I see posted about my friend that look a bit like a witch hunt to me, and only tell a distant part of the story.
In all honesty and in defense of a passed on troubled and gifted friend,
Peter T Hutter.
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2006
Tis Mal Crow, age 48 of Speedwell passed away April 28 at the Summit Medical
Center in Hermitage. He was a member of the Native American Church. He was an
herbalist, author and artist. He is survived by his close companion, Trish
Gray of Speedwell; close cousin, Frank Herron of Shepherd, MI; a host of family
and friends around the world. Graveside services will be held at 11 a.m. on May
4 in the Braden's Chapel Cemetery. Martin Wilson Funeral Home was in charge
of the arrangements.
http://searches2.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/TNMORGAN/2006-05/1146962858 (http://searches2.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/TNMORGAN/2006-05/1146962858)
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His birth name was Arne Lynn Johanson.
Father Robin Johanson, mother Lela Edith Cook. His father Robin in obit is described as "proud member of Cherokee Nation of Oklahoma"
http://www.mt-pleasant.org/depts/cemetery/data/obits/Obit%20for%20Robin%20Johanson%20ID%208961.pdf (http://www.mt-pleasant.org/depts/cemetery/data/obits/Obit%20for%20Robin%20Johanson%20ID%208961.pdf)
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I was going to ask if we should move him to Archives. But I see his books are all over the place. I'm not sure how accurate the plant lore or healing claims are. His own story is pretty phony. I do see some still list him as genuine, such as a museum in Britain. He's also cited by an astrologer, but otherwise doesn't seem to have trained other exploiters.
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His sister's obit:
Robin Renee Grace
Jan 21, 1963 - March 4, 2012
Robin Renee Grace, age 49, of Shepherd, passed away on Sunday March 4, 2012, at Woodland Hospice House.
Robin was born on January 21, 1963, in Carson City, the daughter of Robin Lynn and Lela Edith Cook Johanson.
Robin was a member of the Cherokee Nation. She was an avid motorcycle rider, a multi talented person that was willing to help others in any way she could and especially with her family. Robin was a great cook and was a proudly supported her native heritage.
She was preceded in death by her parents; and a brother, Tismal Crow. (http://She was preceded in death by her parents; and a brother, Tismal Crow.)
http://www.legacy.com/obituaries/themorningsun/obituary.aspx?n=robin-renee-grace&pid=156310778 (http://www.legacy.com/obituaries/themorningsun/obituary.aspx?n=robin-renee-grace&pid=156310778)
This sounds like a New Age belief:
Kay mentioned she is very allergic to mosquitoes. She said Tismal said just change your mindset and they won't bother you... but that doesn't necessarily work for her.
http://www.diamon-naturals.us/minutes.htm (http://www.diamon-naturals.us/minutes.htm)
This bit seems weird:
Signature for St. John's Wort is the tiny piercings in leaves, told her it was good for her mosquito problem. For fine nerves, specific for people who sunburn easily, and good for deep depression.
A common side effect of St. John's Wort is photosensitivity. So hopefully people who burn easily aren't taking this thinking it will protect them from the sun. Maybe he based this idea on the "like cures like" theory. Now I see in his book he follows the "doctrine of signatures" belief.
Also not everyone who is depressed does well on this herb, some people develop serotonin syndrome. Maybe his book includes appropriate cautions.
Using the search function on the Amazon Look Inside feature I see that he claimed he has diverted severe storms with St. John's Wort. Personally, I would not trust this book, I'd do lots of other research.
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I formatted the above incorrectly, this part is supposed to be in quotes:
She was preceded in death by her parents; and a brother, Tismal Crow.
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Tis Mal Crow was a registered member of the Cherokee Tribe of Oklahoma. He was well known and well respected in native communities and throughout the world. He was resilient and driven. Spent many years on the pow-wow circuit, and his list of friends is long (many are also famous/public figures from Naive American community, whom are also well known and respected). His list of accomplishments is also are too long. He was trained in traditional medicinal and healing practices by respected elders. He kept and respected these traditions. In keeping with these traditions, he had restrictions on whom he could Doctor, and never took payment for doctoring someone. He made money from contemporary means like classes, lectures, consulting with small and major manufacturers and companies about responsible and renewable sourcing and formulation of herbal supplements. He was also a gifted artist and created and sold many works of art, including his beadwork. He was the first enrolled member of a Native American nation to have published a book on the practical and responsible use of herbal remedies. So, yes an author as well. Anyone who knew him knows this. I am saddened and troubled by the accusatory manner of the acquisition into his genuine identity. I agree with Peter in his post when he references a "witch hunt". If Tis Mal was still alive, he would have surely been all over this anonymous person like a poodle on a pant leg, just to say the least. He would have asked me to do the clerical work of typing a response just like I am, because his use of a computer went about as far as u can spit a mouthful of fish-hooks!
My uncle was many things, but a fraud he was not. Tis Mal legally changed his name in order to honor his teachers, and to distance himself from his childhood abusers. This was a very personal matter. I'm not sure as to the testimony of the person who had question about something that Tis Mal had allegedly "said" at some point or place, but some things can get lost in translation. Please fix this erroneous accusation. Thank you for your attention to this!
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* I meant to say Cherokee Nation of Oklahoma. Not sure if I can edit my original.
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Tis Mal Crow was a registered member of the Cherokee Nation of Oklahoma. He was well known and well respected in native communities and throughout the world. He was resilient and driven. Spent many years on the pow-wow circuit. His list of friends is long (many include famous/public figures from Naive American community, whom are also well known and respected). His list of accomplishments is too long to list. He was trained in traditional medicinal and healing practices by respected elders. He kept and respected these traditions. In keeping with these traditions, he had restrictions on whom he could Doctor, and never took payment for doctoring someone. He made money from contemporary means like classes, lectures, consulting with small and major manufacturers and companies about responsible and renewable sourcing and formulation of herbal supplements. He was also a gifted artist and created and sold many works of art, including his beadwork. He was the first enrolled member of a Native American nation to have published a book on the practical and responsible use of herbal remedies. So, yes an author as well. He had no control over the way that any seller chose to market his works in their store, however he would have read them the riot act if he found anything offensive. But he is no longer with us. I am saddened and troubled by the accusatory manner of the acquisition into his genuine identity. I agree with Peter in his post when he references a "witch hunt". If Tis Mal was still alive, he would have surely been all over this anonymous person like a poodle on a pant leg, just to say the least. He would have asked me to do the clerical work of typing a response just like I am, because his use of a computer went about as far as u can spit a mouthful of fish-hooks!
My uncle was many things, but a fraud he was not. Tis Mal legally changed his name in order to honor his teachers, and to distance himself from his childhood abusers. This was a very personal matter. I'm not sure as to the testimony of the person who had question about something that Tis Mal had allegedly "said" at some point or place, but some things can get lost in translation. Please fix this erroneous accusation. Thank you for your attention to this!
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Ms. Johanson, we don't delete threads. But we do sometimes move them to Archives and mark them No Longer a Matter of Concern. As you can see, earlier in the thread I asked if we should do that with your father, since he passed away.
The problem is there are still many sites out there using stereotypes to sell his books. Some of the information in the books may also be inaccurate and harm people. Can you tell us who has control over his book titles? The royalties and rights must be going to someone. It most likely will be your family.
Can you find out? Can you help get descriptions of your father and the titles rewritten? Could you end the publishing of titles with inaccurate information which could harm others?
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Ms. Johanson sent another message. I won't repost it here because its contents could embarrass her. I'll just say that I think she's acting out of concern for her late father. I did say that I would only answer here and not in private.
The late Mr. Johanson was indeed registered with the CNO. He was of distant ancestry. That's important only for the fact that he did not know he was Native most of his life. He wasn't culturally Cherokee.
He did seem to make a genuine but far from successful effort to know the culture. That's why he made so many obvious mistakes, ones that few Natives would make, like confusing Cherokee with Muscogee, and recommending herbs that could be dangerous or make illnesses worse.
Once again Ms. Johanson, I think the best way to resolve this is for us to find out who has rights over his books, and either have them pulled, or have medical disclaimers attached to them so no one else is harmed. The descriptions also need to be rewritten r deleted to remove the stereotypes and falsehoods. Then we'd be happy to move the thread to Archives.
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We respect your message of stopping new age fraud.
With respect to anyone passing judgement about Tis Mal, or his work, they are just that. Judgments. Opinions from people whom are not familiar with him or his work. Perhaps when one sets-upon spectacle from afar, things can become easy to judge and yet hard to identify.
He was a registered member of the Cherokee Nation of Oklahoma. He was not a "New-Ager", or a fraud. He was traditional in his practice of doctoring, and never accepted money for it. He made money by holding classes, lectures, consulting with herbal companies, and selling his works of art. Some of which are in State, and National museums. He was/is well known and respected for his work and activism.
With regard to Tis Mal’s herbal remedies; he saw people treating herbal medicine as a novelty or fad, and this concerned him. For the safety of people, and of wild plants. He saw an urgent need to promote the message of safe, accurate, and respectful conservation-centered practices. These are the most important components of his work in educating people about herbal medicine. He did not like seeing people going and using them all Willie-Nillie. To forego this, is to disregard the entire premise of his work as to the use of herbs as medicine. Anyone that does not know this, would cause one think that person is not entirely familiar, if at all familiar, with this area of his work. Tis Mal was very clear and passionate in his message about this. People can be foolish sometimes in their attempts to alleviate discomfort or heal themselves of illness, in any regard. Anyone doing so by using herbal remedy, would be subject to their own will and perhaps ignorance, and entirely aberrant to his message or recommendations.
Are we to assume that the publication of herbal remedies is acceptable to some folks, so long as they are not authored by a Native person?
…Maybe somehow we are miss-interpreting that.
As I stated previously, he took serious issue with hokey and/or false representation, and took action if he became aware of any such foolishness. But he is no longer with us, and no-one can control everyone, or everything that someone, somewhere may ever do. As much as we dis-approve, it is not within our scope of control.
The bigger and more important institutions such as the museum’s, where some of his works are, would be of greater concern. To our knowledge, they have always presented tasteful and accurate representations.
As for inquisition about royalties from Tis Mal’s work. I am not sure that is anyone’s concern.
If the suggestion is that someone should have time or energy to dedicate toward seeking-out any, and every store or website that may market his works, so as to assure that it is NEVER done in any manner of "New-Age-ey" style or otherwise, I am inclined to think that would prove to be an exhausting feat, to say the least.
His work speaks for itself. I have said my peace. Thank you for your concern.
With respects,
-Angelica
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....As I stated previously, he took serious issue with hokey and/or false representation, and took action if he became aware of any such foolishness. But he is no longer with us, and no-one can control everyone, or everything that someone, somewhere may ever do. As much as we dis-approve, it is not within our scope of control.
The bigger and more important institutions such as the museum’s, where some of his works are, would be of greater concern. To our knowledge, they have always presented tasteful and accurate representations.
As for inquisition about royalties from Tis Mal’s work. I am not sure that is anyone’s concern.
If the suggestion is that someone should have time or energy to dedicate toward seeking-out any, and every store or website that may market his works, so as to assure that it is NEVER done in any manner of "New-Age-ey" style or otherwise, I am inclined to think that would prove to be an exhausting feat, to say the least.
His work speaks for itself. I have said my peace. Thank you for your concern.
With respects,
-Angelica
I think you keep on missing the obvious points. You, or another family member, almost certainly have the legal rights to his books. It matters little about royalties, no idea why you thought that.
You have the chance to end misrepresentation of your father that is very stereotypical. You or another family member can have that removed. You can also have disclaimers added that would prevent others from being harmed, since your father's efforts to learn herbal medicine were not completely accurate.
Instead you have these bouts of misplaced anger. That includes one very childish post of personal attacks that was removed, where you then metaphorically stomped out of the room and refused to do anything more.
Again, Ms. Johanson, we can't change the problems with your late father's work. Only you or other family can, and it's strange to see that you refuse to even think about doing so.
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I just saw the response from "educatedindian", posted on 2/1/16. I am trying to keep it respectful here but, apparently, that is not a mutual regard. He says in his message that he has an email for which he could use to "embarrass" me. That is not truthful. I posted to the forum, the same exact message that I had emailed to him. What the actual heck?
...Not wasting any more time on this. It is shamefully inaccurate and inappropriate, at best.
-Angelica
@ Angelica, Educatedindian did not say "He says in his message that he has an email for which he could use to "embarrass" me." He said this and I quoteMs. Johanson sent another message. I won't repost it here because its contents could embarrass her. I'll just say that I think she's acting out of concern for her late father. I did say that I would only answer here and not in private.
Please go back and re-read what Educatedindian said. He was not disputing the fact that your father was "enrolled" in the CNO. He and this forum just disagree with the contents of your father's books, the falsehoods, stereotypical depictions and what could be dangerous herbs and practices.
Lim lemtsh,
Diana
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@educatedindian said Tis Mal didn't know he was Native most of his life. Does this mean he didn't know he was Native when he began his studies with a traditional Tribal Chief at the age of 8? I am just asking.
From this thread I found the link to Tis Mal Crow's audio lectures an bought them. I am just starting to listen to it. Tis Mal Crow said one of his primary teachers passed away 10 years ago. This was recorded in 1997. So in 1987 this teacher died at the age of 116 years. Tis Mal Crow said this teacher was a traditional Tribal Chief one of the last few in a hereditary blood line. His teacher only had a bit of grey hair in his temples at age 116. Tis Mal began study with his teacher at the age of 8 years old. I don't know if this is helpful in filling out the picture of who Tis Mal Crow is. Perhaps the description of his teacher can help you find out who that might have been.
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His name for most of his life was Johanson. We don't use pretenders' names for themselves, even when they get legal name changes, because it gives them a legitimacy they don't deserve. Even those who knew and defend him on this thread have very mixed pictures of him, "loose cannon," "troubled," etc.
He had at least five different claims of his alleged ancestries until he was finally able to pin down that he had distant Cherokee blood. He was not culturally Cherokee, as seen by ludicrous mistakes no NDN, or even most people who've read about NDNs, would make. There's no more reason to believe his dubious claims about his alleged teacher than anything else. Eight year olds are not trained to be medicine people in any tribe. If there is any truth at all to that, it was likely general heritage teachings as a boy. Alleged 116 year olds with almost no grey hair? About as believable as anything else he said.
But again, he did some good in his life with conservation, and wasn't moved by greed or power as most of the frauds we deal with did. I still hope someone from his family with rights to his books can pull them so we can move him to No Longer a Concern.
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To get a complete picture of posts by Mommasays, I quote this from a thread she started:
Hi, I'm Angelica. I joined to post about my uncle whom ended up on the frauds section due to someone having question about him. I posted a reply but made an error that I was gonna fix before I hit submit, but too late. Don't know how to edit post. Anyway his name was Tis Mal Crow. He was an enrolled member of the Cherokee Nation of Oklahoma. He was well known and respected. His traditional beliefs did not allow him to "sell" tradition, and his family and friends are all saddened and hurt to find his name mixed up in anything like this. I google his name, and this comes up. It appears that some of the moderators & administrators have addressed the question with respect, but they are not sure. There is quite a lot of good info out there in Google-land, but I would like to inform a bit about Tis Mal. He was trained for many years in traditional medicine by respected elders. He was known, loved, and respected by many in the community, and throughout the world. His travels were many. He was on pow wow circuit, had many friends, some of them also famous and activists in Native community. His list of accomplishments are numerous. He was an artist, author (the first enrolled member of a NDN nation to author a book on Native herbal medicine use), and an activist. I would offer to provide proof of his identity (i.e. Tribal enrollment card, references), but I don't feel that we should need to stoop to that. He showed that to people who needed to see it for his works including those with the state and smithsonian museum, among many others. It was his life's-work in the contemporary/modern world, as an artist and educator, to teach average people whom are (increasingly) interested in herbal medicine, about proper use and sustainable practices. We have seen careless poaching and clearing of these sacred plants increase in the years since his passing, thanks in large part to TV shows. Tis Mal was keenly aware of this situation before it became a popular topic of interest as it is now with many self described "herb hunters" or " herbalists". He would very likely have found an outlet to make his presence on TV with these major networks by now. He would wish to educate about conserving, and respecting thir use from a Native viewpoint, in response to this modern phenom of herb-hunting. Many people were perceptive to this message. He had a way of making people care. His presence as well as his concern, was undeniable. And he always seemed to find his way into public eye...
He did so in order to bring awareness of how important it is to respect the proper use, handling, and conservation of the plants of which many are sacred medicine to us. As with any public figure, especially being a Native American, the new Agers will be attracted to them. But he had no more control over them than anyone does. He did not sell-out for anyone or encourage or perpetuate false conceptions of traditional practices, and was not in the practice of sharing sacred knowledge of traditions with outsiders, or putting on a false show of them. In fact, he would have read the riot act to anyone falsely representing him or his work. Unfortunately, he would not have control over how someone may try to market his book, art or CD's in their stores. And apparently how someone may gossip about him, who did not ever know him. Thank you for you attention to this!
~Angelica
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I accompanied him to Sweden.
Tis Mal Crow also's made some appearances in Europe. I have an article from when he appeared in Sweden, translated for me by Annika.
I am somewhat interested in Mr. Johanson (a very common Swedish surname) and his relations to Sweden and Sámi people. A short 2001 article (translated title: Tis Mal Crow: - Artist and Medicine Man from the southeastern USA) — maybe this is the article educatedindian referred to in 2005?):
Tis Mal Crow: - konstnär och medicinman från sydöstra USA / Carl Johan Gurt
Then in Issue #21, Spring 2000, of BÁIKI: The International Sámi Journal (not available to me) there is this article, which goes to show that Mr. Johanson seems to have made some impression on descendants of Sámi people in North America and also on some Sámi in Sweden:
"Tis Mal Crow in Swedish Sápmi," a Native American botanist visits Sweden with Sami crafter Anna-Stain Svakko